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nah, they called SRR pound4pound WAY before HBO ever came on the air.
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iceman is SRR the bets ever in your opnion?Comment
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I cant really say....I have only seen him later in his career when he fought Lamotta and then even later when he fought Basilio and those guys.... he was good, of course. He threw some real sharp punches, nice combinations etc..but nothing that I havent seen Rioy Jones do , too...I dont know....I think at 160 Roy Jones would have been avery real problem for himComment
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of course, RJJ is p4p probally in the top 5 best of all time imo, but what im saying is that us young guys hear from the old dudes/boxing historyians that SRR was the best, its how we learn about our past in any subject
another thing is something u brought up, how great must have SRR been to be able to do the things we see guys like RJJ do yet he did them in the 40s to the mid 60s, when i see older greats like joe louis and such there great in there time and even though joe might be the best heavy ever imo he would get KO'd in 1 round vs someone liek WladComment
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John is right he was called best pound for pound way before that, but HBO I think are the ones that have really pushed it to the viewing public beginning with that special, and one before that caleed "Sugar Ray Pound for Pound."
I have this magazine (World Boxing) from 1975 that the readers voted the best welterweight of all time, and Henry Armstrong finished first with Jose Napoles second and Robinson third.Comment
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Hey Ice, seeing as you view RJJ as a great fighter and have known and been in the ring with the legend, what do you think of all these RJJ haters saying that he avoided the likes of his friend McCllelan, Benn, etc, etc, and that they would have beaten him so he avoided all the hard matches and ducked these guys by moving up in weight to take it easy? I always say look at the way he DOMINATED James toney (an incredibly good fighter), and then come talk how RJJ would have lost to Benn, Mcllellan, etc, etc. Of course all the excuses then come about Toney being drained for the RJJ fight, etc, etc...you just can't win when debating a RJJ hater...LOL!Comment
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Roy Jones, James Toney,Oscar de la Hoya,Pernell Whitaker,Floyd Maywether,Bernard Hopkins,Felix Trinidad and Shane Mosley
are the best pound for pound fighters that I have really watched as an adult or near adult .
Each of them has the right to make a claim as the best at some point in time.
I know about other greats of that era such as Michael Nunn,Breland,Starling ect but haven't seen enough or know enough about them to judge.
Ray Robinson and Sam Langford are my two favorite old time fighters to read about or find clips of and I would say that they are the two best p4p fighters that I have ever heard of.
During Roy's best years I thought he had overcame the shadow of Robinson but he never had that big rivalry as Ray had with many men until Tarver came along.
James Toney as I've said before reminds me of todays Sam Langford but I think some of the things he does makes people discredit him unfairly.
The same goes for a lot of fighters today no matter how good Floyd becomes he will never get credit until he fights fighter A B and C and learns to be respectful and promotable.
This problem is not just with Robinson .
Why is it so hard for people to understand that Ali would not just run over every heavyweight in history ?
He may well in fact have beaten Tyson ,Lewis ,Holyfield,Bowe ect but we can not simply come to the conclusion that he will have his way with them.
The way I see it is by what I know of Ray Robinson he would win over all but a hand full of welters and maybe even middles which makes him 'one' of the p4p best.Comment
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Roy didntfight some top name fighters he was around at the same time as...but the fact is that for whatever reasons...they didnt fight him either. I know, for example, when Steve Collins had beaten Eubanks and Benn he wanted to fight RJ and challenged him.....the fight didnt come off and everybody blamed RJ but Kerry Davis from HBO came on and said the reason the fight didnt happen was not because of RJ but because Stevie wanted 5 million for the fight. Its not always RJ's fault certain fights dont get made...there is A LOT going on behind the scenes that people will never hear aboutComment
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Yeah that's what I ment , people will always find a reason to detract even if it's not the right reason.
You always see people say that Hopkins was green
James Toney was under weight
Thomas Tate,Vinny Paz, ect were to small
Mike McCallum and Hill were to old.
Some of it may be true but that is not Roy's problem
He came ready they didn't he won end of story.
That does 'should' not make the win any less important to Roy's legecy but people can alwasy say that well Roy beat a young green Hopkins but he wouldn't beat the Hopkins we've seen the last few years.
At the same time what we read and hear about a fighter like Ray Robinson makes it seem that he was unbeatable when at his best.
Which in turn tells people if Roy can beat a young Hopkins then Robinson should be able to beat an even better Hopkins.
It's not fair and it's not right but that's the way it looks from what people say.
I think a lot of people will look back later and understand just how good these men were it's just that people take it for granted right now.Comment
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The haters seem to forget that Hopkins actually had one MORE fight on his resume at the time he fought Roy and over 20 total fights at the time, so the "he was green" arguement is pure b.S.! As for Toney, the haters say he was weight drained when he fought Roy, yet Roy wasn't weight drained against Tarver...LOL, you can't win with the haters is one thing i've learned, they are just huge hypocrites and you waste your time debating with them as they are so irrational.Comment
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