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Activity and longevity, re: Muhammad Ali vs. Tyson Fury comebacks, and beyond
Hallo folks,
An interesting topic of discussion; who has/had the better comeback, Muhammad Ali or Tyson Fury? Ali out for three and a half years, Fury out for a little over two and a half. Obviously vastly different reasons.
Now, if we look at the first two years of their returns, Fury fought for the WBC title within six months of returning, and has fought for it a second time since. So in those two years, Fury fought six times: Sefer Seferi, Francesco Pianeta, Deontay Wilder (controversial draw), Tom Schwarz, Otto Wallin and Deontay Wilder.
In the first two years of Ali's return, he fought for the Lineal, Unified, WBA/WBC titles within five months of returning, whilst also winning and defending the NABF titles many times during the period (the NABF was much more higher regarded in an era when belts were few). In those two years, Ali fought eleven times: Jerry Quarry, Oscar Bonavena, Joe Frazier (loss), Jimmy Ellis, Buster Mathis, Juergen Blin, Mac Foster, George Chuvalo, Jerry Quarry, Alvin Blue Lewis and Floyd Patterson.
The sheer intensity of Ali's workload in that period, by today's standard, is really something. A steady line-up of tough customers and genuine contenders. Fury on the other hand having taken several tune-ups between his shots at Wilder. The only things that stand in Fury's favour here are that he remains the Lineal champion, and he has added the WBC title to his list of honours.
If we look ahead another two years, Ali fought another seven times: beating Bob Foster and Joe Bugner, splitting two Split Decisions with Ken Norton, beating Rudi Lubbers, avenging his loss to Joe Frazier, before finally regaining the Lineal, Unified, WBA/WBC titles against George Foreman. Beating Frazier and Foreman in '74 put Ali over the two men who had cleaned up the division during his hiatus.
If the next two years go well for Fury, we can expect him to finish off Deontay Wilder in a third fight, before beating Anthony Joshua in a pair of fights in 2021/22. At most, he may squeeze in a tune-up or two between those fights. Fury too would have proven himself superior to the two men who cleaned up the division during his hiatus.
But what comes after that? For Ali, six more years of activity, ten successful title defences, thirteen title fights in all, beating some quality opposition before going out on his shield against the top fighters of the younger generation. For Fury, retirement upon unifying the division?
It really is awe-inspiring to see the activity from past fighters, and it makes it hard to make comparisons between modern fighters and past Greats. In my opinion Tyson Fury would have to be a Top 10 ATG if he can topple Wilder a third time and then AJ twice over. But he would need to show more longevity as Undisputed before we could include him in the argument for top 3-4 ATG. Dillian Whyte, Oleksandr Usyk, a resurgent Joseph Parker, a resurgent Andy Ruiz Jr., Murrat Gassiev, Mairis Briedis, Daniel Dubois being some possible opponents to push Fury onto that hallowed perch.
Differing viewpoints welcome.
An interesting topic of discussion; who has/had the better comeback, Muhammad Ali or Tyson Fury? Ali out for three and a half years, Fury out for a little over two and a half. Obviously vastly different reasons.
Now, if we look at the first two years of their returns, Fury fought for the WBC title within six months of returning, and has fought for it a second time since. So in those two years, Fury fought six times: Sefer Seferi, Francesco Pianeta, Deontay Wilder (controversial draw), Tom Schwarz, Otto Wallin and Deontay Wilder.
In the first two years of Ali's return, he fought for the Lineal, Unified, WBA/WBC titles within five months of returning, whilst also winning and defending the NABF titles many times during the period (the NABF was much more higher regarded in an era when belts were few). In those two years, Ali fought eleven times: Jerry Quarry, Oscar Bonavena, Joe Frazier (loss), Jimmy Ellis, Buster Mathis, Juergen Blin, Mac Foster, George Chuvalo, Jerry Quarry, Alvin Blue Lewis and Floyd Patterson.
The sheer intensity of Ali's workload in that period, by today's standard, is really something. A steady line-up of tough customers and genuine contenders. Fury on the other hand having taken several tune-ups between his shots at Wilder. The only things that stand in Fury's favour here are that he remains the Lineal champion, and he has added the WBC title to his list of honours.
If we look ahead another two years, Ali fought another seven times: beating Bob Foster and Joe Bugner, splitting two Split Decisions with Ken Norton, beating Rudi Lubbers, avenging his loss to Joe Frazier, before finally regaining the Lineal, Unified, WBA/WBC titles against George Foreman. Beating Frazier and Foreman in '74 put Ali over the two men who had cleaned up the division during his hiatus.
If the next two years go well for Fury, we can expect him to finish off Deontay Wilder in a third fight, before beating Anthony Joshua in a pair of fights in 2021/22. At most, he may squeeze in a tune-up or two between those fights. Fury too would have proven himself superior to the two men who cleaned up the division during his hiatus.
But what comes after that? For Ali, six more years of activity, ten successful title defences, thirteen title fights in all, beating some quality opposition before going out on his shield against the top fighters of the younger generation. For Fury, retirement upon unifying the division?
It really is awe-inspiring to see the activity from past fighters, and it makes it hard to make comparisons between modern fighters and past Greats. In my opinion Tyson Fury would have to be a Top 10 ATG if he can topple Wilder a third time and then AJ twice over. But he would need to show more longevity as Undisputed before we could include him in the argument for top 3-4 ATG. Dillian Whyte, Oleksandr Usyk, a resurgent Joseph Parker, a resurgent Andy Ruiz Jr., Murrat Gassiev, Mairis Briedis, Daniel Dubois being some possible opponents to push Fury onto that hallowed perch.
Differing viewpoints welcome.
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