Harry Greb in 1919

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  • Rusty Tromboni
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    #151
    Originally posted by travestyny
    Find me a reputable list that ranks Gibbons ahead of Langford.
    Not that I actually believe you know what reputable means. But that list would be precisely that.

    Seriously, when did Langford ever beat anyone as good as Greb, or go 15 rounds with anyone as good as Dempsey?

    Langford was very primitive. Gibbons, though not maybe on the level of his brother or Loughran, was one of the best defensive fighters of the era. It was men like Gibbons who ushered in the modern era of Boxing.

    Sure, in the land of the blind, the man with one eye is king. So langford, being slihtly more refined, was ability to exploit that absolute appaling lack of skills common in his Heavyweight opponents.

    It also wasn't beneath him to bully smaller men, especially if they were on their way out. Gans (whom Langford couldn't drop, though a Featherweight bombed him out in 2 rounds), Walcott (disputable), O'Brien (washed up, last pro-fight), Ketchel (already a junkie) are all legendary names, but were all smaller men.

    Really, Langford was a Heavyweight. A small one - even by the standard of the times. But a bigger man than Gibbons. He certainly hit harder, but Gibbons himself was a proficient puncher (77% KO to Langford's 50%), despite facing higher quality opponents.

    Gibbons was only stopped once - at the end of his career, by the inimitable Gene Tunney.

    So yeah, being Boxing, I really don't ever expect to see reputable lists. But that's my fault, I only rank fighters based on their ability as, ya know, Boxers. I don't give a sh.it if they couldn't eat at the same lunch counter as someone with different skin, or they were born in the shed, or they had the same haircut you had in high school, or they protested this or that (or didn't), or whatever. None of that matters. It don't matter when fighters are in the ring, does it? So why should it affect rankings?



    Originally posted by travestyny
    As for Tunney, Dempsey lost.
    I get it, reading ain't your thing. Pages upon pages in this thread have been filled with you being exposed as someone lacking even a 6th Grade Reading comprehension. But really, when you know I am gonna invade your keister everything you make a mistake, don't you think you should at least try to appear compotent?

    What did I say about Tunney?

    Now, show me a Heavyweight who's unleashed a combo like Jack did to floor Tunney.

    Maybe you will refer to the NYT for that one, too?

    Dempsey was a faded fighter by that point, but you can't find at fighter at 200 lbs. or below who would've pulled off what Gene did that night.



    Originally posted by travestyny
    Did you want to put fighters that he only lost to on his resume???
    Shows how much you know about Boxing. You have never trained and you don't even watch it. A fighter can come up short andstill put on an excellent display. Only a casual would suggest otherwise.

    Originally posted by travestyny

    By the way, here's a great read for you to cry about
    And this is exactly what's wrong with Boxing.

    The fans.

    An idiot wrote this. And an even bigger idiot referred to it. I get it, you're in the business of repeating lies. You probably can't tell a lie from the truth at this point.

    But look at the ******ity of the article.

    Dempsey came of age in the still Wild West. When he arrived to NYC he was basically a bum. Underfed, undertrained, overworked, etc. Maybe he really was ready for Langford and was just being gracious - sounds like Jack. Or he was genuinely unprepared - makes sense, too. We can't be sure, but in both cases he's off the hook.

    He's not a circus freak like Wills. He's practically a Light Heavyweight. And only a bytch who doesn't train would suggest all fighters progress at the same speed. If anything, precociousness can be severely detrimental. Look at how people remember a horribly slow starter like Gans - in any other era his career would have been over before it (truly) started. And then how they rememebr McGovern - possibly the greatest raw talent Boxing has ever seen.

    Again, Boxing fans are dumb and care less about the Boxer's ability, and more about his story. But in terms of ability, McGovern was a young, green Featherweight, and he absolutely WRECKED the much bigger and more seasoned Gans. People remember Gans like a Robinson, though. McGovern is all but forgotten, he burnt out too young to really have a story.

    Dempsey beat much better men than Wills. There's no dis*****g that. He also trashed their shared competition - if you can call it that, when those guys fought Wills they weren't as good as when they fought Dempsey.

    Really, I know you just do this for attention. You're a sad sick waste of life. But I really do enjoy blasting my hot sticky load in your face.

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    • travestyny
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      #152
      Originally posted by Rusty Tromboni
      Not that I actually believe you know what reputable means. But that list would be precisely that.

      Seriously, when did Langford ever beat anyone as good as Greb, or go 15 rounds with anyone as good as Dempsey?

      Langford was very primitive. Gibbons, though not maybe on the level of his brother or Loughran, was one of the best defensive fighters of the era. It was men like Gibbons who ushered in the modern era of Boxing.

      Sure, in the land of the blind, the man with one eye is king. So langford, being slihtly more refined, was ability to exploit that absolute appaling lack of skills common in his Heavyweight opponents.

      It also wasn't beneath him to bully smaller men, especially if they were on their way out. Gans (whom Langford couldn't drop, though a Featherweight bombed him out in 2 rounds), Walcott (disputable), O'Brien (washed up, last pro-fight), Ketchel (already a junkie) are all legendary names, but were all smaller men.

      Really, Langford was a Heavyweight. A small one - even by the standard of the times. But a bigger man than Gibbons. He certainly hit harder, but Gibbons himself was a proficient puncher (77% KO to Langford's 50%), despite facing higher quality opponents.
      When did Dempsey beat anyone as good as Langford?


      Oh, that's right. He admit he was scared of him. What's next?


      Originally posted by Rusty Tromboni
      Gibbons was only stopped once - at the end of his career, by the inimitable Gene Tunney.

      So yeah, being Boxing, I really don't ever expect to see reputable lists. But that's my fault, I only rank fighters based on their ability as, ya know, Boxers. I don't give a sh.it if they couldn't eat at the same lunch counter as someone with different skin, or they were born in the shed, or they had the same haircut you had in high school, or they protested this or that (or didn't), or whatever. None of that matters. It don't matter when fighters are in the ring, does it? So why should it affect rankings?
      It's a matter of opinion. Your opinion quite honestly isn't worth shlt because you are a disgusting racist.

      Now show us a reputable list with Gibbons ranked over Langford. I'm still waiting.

      Originally posted by Rusty Tromboni
      I get it, reading ain't your thing. Pages upon pages in this thread have been filled with you being exposed as someone lacking even a 6th Grade Reading comprehension. But really, when you know I am gonna invade your keister everything you make a mistake, don't you think you should at least try to appear compotent?

      What did I say about Tunney?

      Now, show me a Heavyweight who's unleashed a combo like Jack did to floor Tunney.
      Who cares. Dempsey lost. Therefore, he doesn't get credit for Tunney on his resume. Sorry. Keep ducking it if you like


      Originally posted by Rusty Tromboni
      Maybe you will refer to the NYT for that one, too?

      Dempsey was a faded fighter by that point, but you can't find at fighter at 200 lbs. or below who would've pulled off what Gene did that night.


      Shows how much you know about Boxing. You have never trained and you don't even watch it. A fighter can come up short andstill put on an excellent display. Only a casual would suggest otherwise.

      And this is exactly what's wrong with Boxing.

      The fans.

      An idiot wrote this. And an even bigger idiot referred to it. I get it, you're in the business of repeating lies. You probably can't tell a lie from the truth at this point.

      But look at the ******ity of the article.

      Dempsey came of age in the still Wild West. When he arrived to NYC he was basically a bum. Underfed, undertrained, overworked, etc. Maybe he really was ready for Langford and was just being gracious - sounds like Jack. Or he was genuinely unprepared - makes sense, too. We can't be sure, but in both cases he's off the hook.

      He's not a circus freak like Wills. He's practically a Light Heavyweight. And only a bytch who doesn't train would suggest all fighters progress at the same speed. If anything, precociousness can be severely detrimental. Look at how people remember a horribly slow starter like Gans - in any other era his career would have been over before it (truly) started. And then how they rememebr McGovern - possibly the greatest raw talent Boxing has ever seen.

      Again, Boxing fans are dumb and care less about the Boxer's ability, and more about his story. But in terms of ability, McGovern was a young, green Featherweight, and he absolutely WRECKED the much bigger and more seasoned Gans. People remember Gans like a Robinson, though. McGovern is all but forgotten, he burnt out too young to really have a story.

      Dempsey beat much better men than Wills. There's no dis*****g that. He also trashed their shared competition - if you can call it that, when those guys fought Wills they weren't as good as when they fought Dempsey.

      Really, I know you just do this for attention. You're a sad sick waste of life. But I really do enjoy blasting my hot sticky load in your face.

      Again, Wills has a better resume than Dempsey easy. Just because your racist ass doesn't believe it means nothing. Do you want another one?

      9. Harry Wills

      The fact that Harry Wills and Jack Dempsey never fought for the heavyweight title in the early 1920s is tragic shame. It could have been a classic fight between two all-time greats.

      As a matchup, it would have been close to a "pick-em" fight. But for this ranking, I've given an edge to Wills over Dempsey, based purely on the strength of resume.

      Dempsey may have held the heavyweight championship, but Wills was fighting and beating the better opponents.

      Aside from Dempsey and Wills, the best heavyweight fighters of the late teens and early 1920s were Sam Langford, Sam McVea and Joe Jeannette. Since all three were black men, like Wills, Dempsey faced none of them.

      Wills, meanwhile, fought all three again and again and almost always won.

      At 6'2" and 220 pounds, the Black Panther had the size to match up with heavyweights of any era.

      All-time heavyweight boxing rankings are among the most reliable argument starters when it comes to sports talk. It's a subject where even the most casual fans will insist they have great insight...

      Come on, dumbo. Find us a reputable list that ranks Gibbons over Langford. You can't do it, can ya


      But I agree with you that some boxing fans are dumb. Like the idiot who said Lomachenko is P4P the greatest boxer of all time


      By the way, be honest. How much does it hurt to your soul that three black men made Dempsey shlt himself
      Last edited by travestyny; 03-27-2020, 06:27 AM.

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      • QueensburyRules
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        #153
        Originally posted by travestyny
        When did Dempsey beat anyone as good as Langford?


        Oh, that's right. He admit he was scared of him.



        It's a matter of opinion. Your opinion quite honestly isn't worth shlt because you are a disgusting racist.

        Now show us a reputable list with Gibbons ranked over Langford. I'm still waiting.



        Who cares. Dempsey lost. Therefore, he doesn't get credit for Tunney on his resume. Sorry. Keep ducking it if you like





        Again, Wills has a better resume than Dempsey easy. Just because your racist ass doesn't believe it means nothing. Do you want another one?




        Come on, dumbo. Find us a reputable list that ranks Gibbons over Langford. You can't do it, can ya


        But I agree with you that some boxing fans are dumb. Like the idiot who said Lomachenko is P4P the greatest boxer of all time


        By the way, be honest. How much does it hurt to your soul that three black men made Dempsey shlt himself
        - -Sweet justice seeing you two getting all kissy-kissy over Sam and Jack, both of whom were infinitely more honorable and respected than your mutual hysterrorism could ever hope to be.

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        • travestyny
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          #154
          Originally posted by QueensburyRules
          - -Sweet justice seeing you two getting all kissy-kissy over Sam and Jack, both of whom were infinitely more honorable and respected than your mutual hysterrorism could ever hope to be.
          Shut your senile ass up. Thanks.

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          • QueensburyRules
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            #155
            Originally posted by travestyny
            Shut your senile ass up. Thanks.
            - -U light in the loafer sissy orders as toothless as U credibility.

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            • travestyny
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              #156
              Originally posted by QueensburyRules
              - -U light in the loafer sissy orders as toothless as U credibility.
              - -U cryin truth got u panties in a knot ducking senile cretin.

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              • Rusty Tromboni
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                #157
                Originally posted by travestyny
                When did Dempsey beat anyone as good as Langford?


                Oh, that's right. He admit he was scared of him. What's next?




                It's a matter of opinion. Your opinion quite honestly isn't worth shlt because you are a disgusting racist.

                Now show us a reputable list with Gibbons ranked over Langford. I'm still waiting.



                Who cares. Dempsey lost. Therefore, he doesn't get credit for Tunney on his resume. Sorry. Keep ducking it if you like





                Again, Wills has a better resume than Dempsey easy. Just because your racist ass doesn't believe it means nothing. Do you want another one?




                Come on, dumbo. Find us a reputable list that ranks Gibbons over Langford. You can't do it, can ya


                But I agree with you that some boxing fans are dumb. Like the idiot who said Lomachenko is P4P the greatest boxer of all time


                By the way, be honest. How much does it hurt to your soul that three black men made Dempsey shlt himself

                I gotta admit, I'm impressed. usually when folks are presented with insurmountable facts they abandon argument because they've been convinced of the alternative, or because they have nothing else to say.

                But page after page of this thread you persist in replying. And you don't even attempt counter arguments! You just return to instigate another beating.

                Again, I get it, you're in it for the attention. But God almighty, I've never met such a glutton for punishment.

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                • BattlingNelson
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                  #158
                  Originally posted by ShoulderRoll
                  Why are you warning travestyny while Rusty Tromboni seems to have free reign to act like a racist moron on here?
                  Travesty and Pep had a fine argument going, that didn’t need mudslinging. Travesty is a fine friend of mine, so don’t look for ghosts where there’s none.

                  We all already know that Rusty is a troll and I don’t have the firepower to kick him from this section any more.

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                  • BattlingNelson
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                    #159
                    Originally posted by travestyny
                    Sorry for the delay. I've never looked much into the Fitzsimmons dealings because it was clear to me that it was only an excuse in a last ditch effort to get out of the fight. So I wasn't sure what was consideration for it exactly and the other details. The only thing I knew is that the story going around the interwebs was that it took place September 1925.

                    After reading your posts, I decided to look into it using my favorite source, the NYTs. Turns out that the bounced check had even less to do with this than I thought.

                    Apparently, the exact date that Dempsey let everyone know the money wasn't forthcoming was November 27th, 1925.

                    On December 19th, Dempsey declared that the fight was off, but said that Fitz had another offer that he was considering.

                    On December 21st, Dempsey signed new articles. New forfeits were posted as well. It was this that was transferred to the CAC.


                    This should stop all of the talk of a bounced check. Here's the proof.



                    Dec. 19th -- Fight off for failed payment


                    Dec. 21st -- New Articles Signed



                    Dempsey really had no excuse. He signed new articles 2 days after the bounced check debacle was revealed, then signed to the contract with CAC in March. Then, he broke the contract. That's really all there is to it.
                    A thought: Have you tried looking for newspaper articles from other cities that might not be biased? Maybe Chicago papers from the same period?

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                    • ShoulderRoll
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                      #160
                      Originally posted by BattlingNelson
                      Travesty and Pep had a fine argument going, that didn’t need mudslinging. Travesty is a fine friend of mine, so don’t look for ghosts where there’s none.

                      We all already know that Rusty is a troll and I don’t have the firepower to kick him from this section any more.
                      But you do have the firepower to warn travestyny?

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