Who Could Roy Jones Not Have Beaten?

[QueensburyRules]

I'd have more chance debating with a house plant.

I don't care where he popped up and what he said.

In 1996, Frankie Liles said in the media that Roy wouldn't fight him. Yet he then turned down his biggest payday, to the dismay of his manager, who ended up leaving him.

In 2001, Joe Calzaghe told the media that he wanted to fight Roy. Yet he wouldn't move up to LHW or fight in the U.S. with Showtime. He then continued to kill himself to make SMW, where he fought more B to C class guys to rack up his WBO title defences.

In 2002, Bernard Hopkins demanded a 50/50 split live on air. Yet when HBO execs met with him privately, he demanded $10m or no fight. He then had a year out before challenging out all of the JMW champs.

I can give you a ton of examples.

Talk is cheap.

Anybody can say anything.

So what if Dariusz said he wanted to fight Roy in 2003?

If you want straight up facts, you can have them.

It's a fact that 2 years earlier, Dariusz' promoter would not even answer or return HBO's calls where they wanted to sit down and discuss the specifics. Kerry Davis is on record stating this. You can have the links if you want. After repeated attempts at calling, he ended up sending a fax across, saying that he'd like to chat about a possible double header that could have seen Dariusz fight live in the U.S. for the first time. Yet that fax was turned down instantly. So they wouldn't take calls, yet the fax was instantly turned down, without even wanting to discuss any specifics.

Those are the facts that can be backed up.

When Roy was at LHW, Dariusz and his promoter weren't interested.

Yet 2 years later when Roy had LEFT the LHW division, up he pops suddenly wanting a fight?

How convenient.

Not only are you dumb enough to think that that was legit, you also criticise Roy for not dropping back and fighting him.

Honestly, you're too much.

Roy's a ducker, on the grounds that Dariusz SAID that he wanted to fight him, despite everything else that had happened beforehand?

Brilliant.

You are absolutely clueless.

At the time Dariusz made those comments, Roy would have been in talks to fight Corrie Sanders and other guys at HW.

In 2001, Roy-Dariusz was huge.

In 2003, all talk was dead.

The biggest fights for Roy that were realistic, were either Evander or Tarver. Both of which would have brought more money than fighting Dariusz.

Now run along because you are completely out of your depth.

- -So, after getting splattered for a 10 count, you jump up jabbing and proclaiming your marshmallow logic the winner is it?

And water wet, fire hot, and you go plop plop. These things are also incontestable and have nothing to do with Darius appearing in America at an HBO event trying to land a Roy fight. Generated months of dialogue, and sweetie dearie, there were no Sanders negotiations. Roy sent him a contract and Sanders sent it back signed, sealed, and delivered. It was just a tool to leverage $100 Mil out of the Lewis fight that was a similar Peter Pan fantasy you share with him. He also sent Field a contract to sign, but the ol'fool was too ****** to see how useless he was and never signed. Has nothing to do with Darius on HBO wanting to make the Roy fight.

It happened very much like you do no matter what he says/she says/it's may say in denial.

[robertzimmerman]

- -So, after getting splattered for a 10 count, you jump up jabbing and proclaiming your marshmallow logic the winner is it?

And water wet, fire hot, and you go plop plop. These things are also incontestable and have nothing to do with Darius appearing in America at an HBO event trying to land a Roy fight. Generated months of dialogue, and sweetie dearie, there were no Sanders negotiations. Roy sent him a contract and Sanders sent it back signed, sealed, and delivered. It was just a tool to leverage $100 Mil out of the Lewis fight that was a similar Peter Pan fantasy you share with him. He also sent Field a contract to sign, but the ol'fool was too ****** to see how useless he was and never signed. Has nothing to do with Darius on HBO wanting to make the Roy fight.

It happened very much like you do no matter what he says/she says/it's may say in denial.

I despair.

I must be being trolled.

There were no negotiations with Sanders? Yet Sanders sent a contract back? How did that happen then?

He also sent Evander a contract, yet Evander wouldn't send it back?

Have I just not repeatedly told you that in 2003, Roy was at HW looking for another HW fight?

You have just confirmed this.

So: In 2003, Roy was a HW.

He'd recently fought Ruiz and he was open to another fight at HW if it was the right one for him.

Basically, at that point in time, he didn't know if/when he was going to fight at LHW again. Yet you're criticising Roy and HBO for not acting upon Dariusz' supposed calling out of him? Why? Not forgetting of course, that Dariusz had snubbed HBO 2 years earlier when they wanted to try and make the fight.

So: You've no issue with HBO being snubbed in 2001, yet you were surprised that they didn't try and make a fight 2 years later, despite the fact that Roy wasn't even a LHW at that point?

Are you serious?

You're just wasting my time.

I have asked you for links, yet you have provided me with nothing.

I have questioned your dates, yet you've said your memory might be hazy.

I've given you examples of where fighters have said things but not backed them up, yet you have said they're irrelevant.

You have to be the dumbest guy on the forum.

Now either provide some actual evidence of your claims, or go and find another thread to pollute.

[QueensburyRules]

I despair.

I must be being trolled.

There were no negotiations with Sanders? Yet Sanders sent a contract back? How did that happen then?

He also sent Evander a contract, yet Evander wouldn't send it back?

Have I just not repeatedly told you that in 2003, Roy was at HW looking for another HW fight?

You have just confirmed this.

So: In 2003, Roy was a HW.

He'd recently fought Ruiz and he was open to another fight at HW if it was the right one for him.

Basically, at that point in time, he didn't know if/when he was going to fight at LHW again. Yet you're criticising Roy and HBO for not acting upon Dariusz' supposed calling out of him? Why? Not forgetting of course, that Dariusz had snubbed HBO 2 years earlier when they wanted to try and make the fight.

So: You've no issue with HBO being snubbed in 2001, yet you were surprised that they didn't try and make a fight 2 years later, despite the fact that Roy wasn't even a LHW at that point?

Are you serious?

You're just wasting my time.

I have asked you for links, yet you have provided me with nothing.

I have questioned your dates, yet you've said your memory might be hazy.

I've given you examples of where fighters have said things but not backed them up, yet you have said they're irrelevant.

You have to be the dumbest guy on the forum.

Now either provide some actual evidence of your claims, or go and find another thread to pollute.

- -Coming to America, ain't they made a remake of that movie by now?

Vitali also came to America to scare up a Tyson or Field bout to no avail. Ex soviet satellite states were then and now heavily disparaged by Americans still locked in the freezer of the Cold War.

Really now Zimmy, you're so provincial in your thought processes as to be "challenged." My apologies for thinking you you know anything about boxing.

Facts don't care what you "think" or "drink."

They exist just as sure as the earth, moon, and the stars.

[Rusty Tromboni]

The winning side of the debate?

Ha!

I've got to give credit where it's due.

You guys are entertainers.

I'll give you credit. You do a tremendous job cataloging favorable information. It's a little weird, but definitely thorough and exhaustive. I think we're familiar enough now, though, to admit that you simply deflect unfavorable information.

It's a shame because you bring good points, and definitely add depth to conversations, but most of it goes ignored because you're more a publicist than a rational participant in a conversation.

You can have your bias, and that can shape your opinions. But when it becomes an unhealthy zeal, and you sound more like a spokesman than a fan, people just tune you out.

[robertzimmerman]

- -Coming to America, ain't they made a remake of that movie by now?

Vitali also came to America to scare up a Tyson or Field bout to no avail. Ex soviet satellite states were then and now heavily disparaged by Americans still locked in the freezer of the Cold War.

Really now Zimmy, you're so provincial in your thought processes as to be "challenged." My apologies for thinking you you know anything about boxing.

Facts don't care what you "think" or "drink."

They exist just as sure as the earth, moon, and the stars.

Okay.

You've obviously now reached the end.

This is what you do when you can't take a debate any further.

If at some point you can find some links or something, then I'll carry on. But if not, there's just no point. I'm not going to continue this back and forth charade where you're just guessing when things happened. It's just a waste of time.

[robertzimmerman]

I'll give you credit. You do a tremendous job cataloging favorable information. It's a little weird, but definitely thorough and exhaustive. I think we're familiar enough now, though, to admit that you simply deflect unfavorable information.

It's a shame because you bring good points, and definitely add depth to conversations, but most of it goes ignored because you're more a publicist than a rational participant in a conversation.

You can have your bias, and that can shape your opinions. But when it becomes an unhealthy zeal, and you sound more like a spokesman than a fan, people just tune you out.

Hey man, I could have wrote out the above in reference to yourself.

Sometimes you make some great points.

Sometimes I think you're way off the mark.

If you want to question anything that I've wrote, then be my guest.

That's what we're here for.

It's all good.

[QueensburyRules]

Okay.

If at some point you can find some links or something, then I'll carry on. But if not, there's just no point. I'm not going to continue this back and forth charade where you're just guessing when things happened. It's just a waste of time.

- - Don't have a link for most things I witnessed and neither do you.

Always the hope that a new minder can show you the Darius boxrec record, a link he could look up!

[robertzimmerman]

- - Don't have a link for most things I witnessed and neither do you.

Always the hope that a new minder can show you the Darius boxrec record, a link he could look up!

I can provide links for anything that's been mentioned.

Why do you keep mentioning BoxRec?

If you really want to study Dariusz' resume on BoxRec, then it paints the picture of a guy who was happy to give up his main titles, in order to milk the lightly regarded WBO belt for all its worth. He was the polish Calzaghe.

[QueensburyRules]

- -For yer minder:

http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/4141

[ron davis]

Marcel Cerdan would ko him in three rds. Tony Zale would Ko him in five rds.

Ron