Flashback...Roid Jones, Jr: The Nunn-Rocchigiani-WBC Scandal

[BKM-]

Who is TeamElite and why are they saying these things? Curious.

I found his(or their?) youtube channel, pretty funny stuff on there too:
https://www.youtube.com/user/comTubedotYou/videos

[BattlingNelson]

Nice to have the timeline. Especially regarding the Michael Nunn avoidance.

[Dempsey-Louis]

I found his(or their?) youtube channel, pretty funny stuff on there too:
https://www.youtube.com/user/comTubedotYou/videos

Thanks for the link; I watched a few, some are funny (Don King doing a Top Ten count down of weight-in altercations was really strange.) and a few were hateful, most seemed to be produced by someone else, not TeamElite.

I still don't get these posts though, there is such a passionate hate for Roy Jones in these posts it makes me curious if TeamElite has a personal history with Jones.

P.S. I wish they would stop the "Roid" nonsense, it is childish. The post itself was quite interesting, a good argument making some good points (most of which I did not know; I got an education) but unfortunately it discredited itself with silly slurs.

I fear we are becoming a nation of "Trumps' - a good argument just isn't good enough anymore, everyone feels a need to include vulgar (unnecessary) insults.

[BKM-]

Thanks for the link; I watched a few, some are funny (Don King doing a Top Ten count down of weight-in altercations was really strange.) and a few were hateful, most seemed to be produced by someone else, not TeamElite.

I still don't get these posts though, there is such a passionate hate for Roy Jones in these posts it makes me curious if TeamElite has a personal history with Jones.

P.S. I wish they would stop the "Roid" nonsense, it is childish. The post itself was quite interesting, a good argument making some good points (most of which I did not know; I got an education) but unfortunately it discredited itself with silly slurs.

I fear we are becoming a nation of "Trumps' - a good argument just isn't good enough anymore, everyone feels a need to include vulgar (unnecessary) insults.

Yeah I would have thought that this kind of stuff would be more passionate atleast a decade ago. Roy has done such a splendid job of fighting past his prime getting ko'd by lower tier fighters that he hardly commands any respect these days.

One of those Roid photoshops lists what he hates about Roy and I noticed 'animal abuse'(didn't RJJ get involved in ****fighting at some point?) maybe that's what gets to him. Animal rights activists are very extreme when they have a cause.

[RJJ-94-02=GOAT]

Roid Jones, Jr: The Nunn-Rocchigiani-WBC Scandal

With what is now known, history will judge Roid Jones, Jr harshly, and rightly so.

Given his natural talent and his claims of being the best boxer in the world for so long, his career was a huge, tedious disappointment which left more questions than answers - not to mention massive controversy.

As well as being a roided-up drugs cheat who harboured a Glass Jaw, Jones - enabled by his ridiculously soft HBO contracts - was the biggest cherrypicking ducker of his era who used any means necessary to blatantly avoid the best opposition, his favourite method being the excuse of having to service the "mandatory challengers" to his meaningless paper ABC straps instead...the majority of which were a string of public service employees.

However, Roid wasn't opposed to even ducking his own ABC title challengers when he saw fit.

So let's remind ourselves, and educate any newcomers, of the depths that Jones and the governing bodies would sink to during Roid Jones' heyday. (It gets ugly);

Jones was truly ground-breaking when it came to ducking. In 1997 - in conjunction with the WBC - he began the most elaborate route of all-time to duck his top ranked title challengers.

In Jan '97 the soon-to-be #1 ranked WBC light-heavyweight challenger, resurgent Michael 'Second To' Nunn, was all but guaranteed a title shot, though the sceptical Nunn camp correctly predicted WBC title holder Roid Jones, Jr would duck him;



However, no one expected the ridiculous level of corruption which would unfold...

The farcical Jones-Nunn negotiations that followed were essentially Roid's usual attempts to either duck or rip off his #1 challenger, and backfired with great embarrassment; Roid was dumb & arrogant enough to believe he could pull off his usual cr@p without resistance, yet his team of amatuers were completely out of their depth dealing with Dan Goosen; greedy Roid had offered Nunn the typical, disgusting 10% split of the fight purse, got told to F off, then was dumb enough to lose the purse bidding to the Nunn camp. Now not getting the full license fee and unable to just keep all the extra revenue for himself, and also publicly unhappy with Nunn getting his rightful 25% split as challenger, shameless Roid pathetically tried to BUY the fight off Nunn's promoters and was told to F off again.

Roid then spat his dummy out and began a revolutionary, highly innovative 3-step strategic maneuver to pull off the most outrageous and scandalous duck of his career.

So...

Step 1...Roid officially relinquishes his WBC title in 1997 rather than give the #1 challenger his title shot on HBO for his rightful purse, then sat back and waited for the top 2 contenders, Michael Nunn & Graciano Rocchigiani, to box for the vacant title. In the meantime Jones - now free of his mandatory title obligation - could continue his career exactly how he wanted; as a shameless cherrypicker, with Roid's next bout being a non-title affair aginst a carefully selected big-name, slightly past-prime opponent for a career-high payday in the first fight of a new golden HBO contract.

Step 2...3 months after the new WBC champion Graciano Rocchigiani is crowned, Roid simply asks the governing body to just hand him back the title...which miraculously they did. (No one had ever been arrogant & brazen enough to even think to ask before Roid.)

When the next WBC rankings are released, Rocchigiani has inexplicably been demoted to "interim" champion. The WBC's explanation - that references to Nunn-Rocchigiani being a championship bout on all contracts and promotional material and then listing Rocchigiani as WBC champion in their rankings for 3 months were all simply "typographical errors" - was beyond laughable.

The WBC had instantly created a serious, embarrassing problem for themselves.

Predictably, Jones was reluctant to adhere to WBC policy in facing the "interim" champion to unify the WBC title, so Rocchigiani filed a lawsuit against M&M Sports and Square Ring, Inc. (Jones' handlers) due to Jones' refusal to fight him. As part of the settlement, Jones, had he failed to meet Rocchigiani, would have to surrender the WBC title and pay a penalty fee of $500k to Rocchigiani.

Step 3...When Jones' camp finally arranges a title fight to appear to be cleaning up the mess, it simply gets canceled by Jones' promoter using the first excuse available - however weak. Not very subtle but effective.

The excuse to call off the fight – that Roid's opponent had missed a press conference (yet had twice given assurance in writing that he was in training camp over in Germany and didn't want jetlag affecting his preperation) – was particularly bogus and hypocritical considering Jones regularly skipped press conferences himself and without explanation. But again that's the ******ity and arrogance of Roid Jones, Jr for you.

So as a bonus for Roid, with the #2 challenger defeating the #1 to become the new "interim" champion, Roid had actually managed TWO ducks in one go. A double-duck.

GENIUS.

Then there was the final, outrageous encore act of corruption; after initially threatening to strip Roid Jones in Nov 1999 if he didn't box new WBC "interim" champion Rocchigiani, the WBC - in an inexplicable U-turn - suddenly quit their attempt at damage control in trying to salvage the fight and scandalously erased Rocchigiani from their rankings altogether due to...wait for it...inactivity.

BIG MISTAKE.

Rocchigiani wasn't going to just disappear.

The blatant Double-duck was obviously illegal, unethical...and completely transparent, making it by far the dumbest duck in boxing history, and after the WBC dropped Rocchigiani he immediately filed a lawsuit against the corrupt governing body in Jan 2000.

Roid's shenanigans with ducking Nunn weren't quite over with just yet either; after Nunn defeated Glass Jawed Fraud Willian Guthrie (who Roid had also publicly ducked prior to Guthrie picking up Michalczewski's IBF title) in May 1999, Nunn was elevated to #1 in the WBC rankings again.

However, even after the WBC scandalously dropped Rocchigiani as interim champion at the end of that year, Nunn still wasn't any closer to a shot at Jones; instead he eventually was su****iously matched into a "final eliminator" by the WBC as Tarver was by the IBF. By this time Nunn was seemingly giving up, and after numerous eliminator pull-outs in 2001, Roid was finally free of Nunn.

Then in 2001 the WBC was ordered to trial.

Fast forward to April 2003; Rocchigiani inevitably won the lawsuit in devastating fashion. The rulings of the federal judge were;

• Rocchigiani was restored as the WBC light-heavyweight champion from when he defeated Nunn in May 1998 until he lost to Dariusz Michalczewski in April 2000 - a fight which the true world light-heavyweight champion Michalczewski, not being a greedy cherrypicking ducking coward, had no problem accepting - further putting Roid to shame.

• 'Reluctant' Roid Jones was retrospectively stripped of his unlawfully acquired WBC strap from 1997-2000. Owned.

• The judge then blasted the WBC with an order to pay Rocchigiani a figure of $31 million in damages. Owned again.

It was only Rocchigiani's compassion that saved the WBC from bankruptcy when he agreed to an eleventh hour 10-year financial settlement plan with the WBC in Aug 2004.

"We have gotten up off the canvas only seconds from disappearing", said WBC President Jose Sulaiman after the agreement was signed.

Officially, the WBC got off lightly.

However, the damage to their reputation has proven to be irrepairable.

And Roid Jones' name is obviously just dog**** these days.

Nunn was flat-out ducked. Numerous times.

Rocchigiani - who was easily world class when in the mood - was treated with contempt; robbed of his WBC title, earnings, and 2 years of his career - after which time he was over the hill as a top fighter. Disgusting.

Both Jones and the WBC didn't even stop to consider that Nunn and Rocchigiani weren't just mandatory bums and actually had strong management behind them in the Goosens and Klaus-Peter Kohl who wouldn't stand for their outrageous antics, hence were publicly humiliated and completely exposed for what they are;

• We Be Crooks

• Roid Jones, Jr; the worst cherrypicking ducker of his generation, and unbelievably arrogant brazen p.o.s.

"Although we always felt ourselves to be innocent, we want to leave this experience in the past", Sulaiman also said.

Innocent???

The sheer audacity of these scumbags...

It defies belief.

Roid Jones, Jr blatantly ducked the two best available opponents in Michalczewski & Rocchigiani plus a still-capable Nunn during Roid's farcial light-heavyweight trinket run, yet spuriously called himself the "undisputed world champion". He was a sick joke.

Also, to mention just one other duck, immediately after his golden HBO contract ran out in Sep 2000, Jones declared "I'm definitely moving back down to 168lbs" and looked set to face the best available opponent @168 in Joseph 'The Pride Of Wales' Calzaghe. Excellent. But it was all bs; Roid inevitably backed out, somehow conned HBO into offering an even softer contract, then continued boxing second raters @ 175lbs. zzzz...

While Roid pulled off some blatant embarrassing cowardly ducks during his prime years, the disgraceful Double-duck casts a huge shadow over them all.

This is all irrefutable, undeniable truth.

Do you really think people are gonna read all that bias nonsense?😂😂😂
I’d say y’all must’ve forgot but I don’t think you knew **** to begin with😭😭

[robertzimmerman]

Nice to have the timeline. Especially regarding the Michael Nunn avoidance.

Happy New year mate, thanks for the PM.

I'll gladly debate these topics with you if you wish, but I obviously can't debate with the TS. He doesn't want to debate with anybody. He's on a campaign of hate.

[TonyGe]

Happy New year mate, thanks for the PM.

I'll gladly debate these topics with you if you wish, but I obviously can't debate with the TS. He doesn't want to debate with anybody. He's on a campaign of hate.

That might be understating it. LOL

[BKM-]

Happy New year mate, thanks for the PM.

I'll gladly debate these topics with you if you wish, but I obviously can't debate with the TS. He doesn't want to debate with anybody. He's on a campaign of hate.

I would love to see you debate the issue of RJJ ducking Nunn. Not being sarcastic or anything, I just find it difficult to see anyone defending Roy in some of these cases.

[robertzimmerman]

That might be understating it. LOL

Ha!

Just slightly.

[robertzimmerman]

I would love to see you debate the issue of RJJ ducking Nunn. Not being sarcastic or anything, I just find it difficult to see anyone defending Roy in some of these cases.

I'll gladly debate the subject with you or anyone else.

I'll give you my honest opinions, and I'll give you some facts to ponder.

To be honest, it's obvious to see why many people believe that Roy ducked Nunn. Because Roy disrespected him and he messed him around. Roy should either have fought him or relinquished his title straight away. But he didn't, and I can't really excuse his actions. But personally, I think there's a big difference between ducking someone and dismissing someone. I think that people need to look at things very closely before claiming a duck. To me, the definition of a duck, is to avoid someone due to a fear of losing to them. And I don't believe that Roy ducked him out of a fear of losing to him. That's my honest opinion. And the reason I believe that is due to the following 5 factors:


1. Negotiations.

If he'd have had no intentions of fighting him at all, he'd never even have let things get as far as they did with the purse bids etc.



2. A no-win position.

I believe that he was in a no-win position. Nunn's style would have been problematic for low pay, and he wouldn't have gained much credit if he'd have beaten him.



3. Roy tried to fight Frankie Liles in 1996.

Both HBO and Frankie's manager at the time, Jack O'Halloran, have both confirmed that Frankie was offered his biggest purse to date to fight Roy. O'Halloran said "We had a great fight lined up against Roy, but Frankie blew it by going back and asking for more money" Again, HBO (who at times publicly criticised his opposition) also publicly backed Roy when they allowed him to conduct a live pre-fight, in-ring interview with critics and the audience, just prior to his fight against Bryant Brannon.

Look at things from a logical standpoint:

Why on earth would a guy who genuinely feared losing to Michael Nunn, have tried to have fought Frankie Liles the year before?

In my opinion, it's illogical.

Frankie was also a huge southpaw, possessing the same 77" reach that Nunn possessed. His size and his style would have presented Roy with huge stylistic issues. Also, Frankie had fought Roy 3 times as an amateur, beating him once, and he'd also beaten Nunn 2 years earlier in 1994. So in my honest opinion, if Roy had genuinely ducked Nunn out of a fear of losing to him, he'd have gone nowhere near a guy who was just as dangerous, if not more so.

http://ringsidereport.com/?p=2112

https://*************/watch?v=4TPjvtASn0c



4. He fought Tarver 3 times.

When Nunn was at his best, he was a better fighter than Tarver. I think we can all agree on that. But from the mid-90's onwards, Nunn was faded. He was still dangerous, but he was faded. In 1997, Roy was 28 years old and in his prime. Whereas in 2003, he was past his best at 34. In my honest opinion, fighting Tarver at 34, after dropping back from HW in his 50th fight, brought a bigger challenge to him than what Nunn would have brought 6 years earlier.



5. Roy had spoken of a huge HW fight before Nunn became his mandatory.

Even before Roy fought Griffin in the rematch, he spoke of wanting a huge mega money fight at HW. Then in his post-fight interview after his 1st round demolition of Griffin, he again mentioned wanting to fight the likes of Evander. After he'd messed Nunn around and he'd relinquished his belt early in 1998, he then negotiated to fight James "Buster" Douglas for a reported purse of around $6m. Everything was pretty much agreed upon, when at the last moment, Roy's father intervened and said he wouldn't let Roy go ahead with it. Up until that point, Roy and his father hadn't spoken to each other for 6 years.

After he'd walked away from the Douglas fight, he then targeted his initial interest - Evander Holyfield. Along with his advisor, Roy flew to Atlanta where he met with Evander and his attorney, Jim Thomas. They met in a restaurant and had a chat about a potential fight. But Evander politely declined, as he felt as though he was in a no-win position at the time. He did however tell Roy that he would be interested in fighting him in the future if he went on to achieve something in the division. This is documented in Jim Thomas' 2005 autobiography.

After he'd missed out on the HW fights and the dust had settled, Roy then fought the guy who he'd had an eye on fighting for some time - Virgil Hill.

https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=...2oAnoQ6AEITTAK



To summarise:

In order to establish whether or not a guy has ducked an opponent, I think you have to put the incident under the microscope, where you objectively analyse all factors. You also have to look at the alternate actions of the fighter in question, before also looking at what they went on to do afterwards.

Although Roy did mess Nunn around and he didn't end up fighting him, he did pursue bigger challenges, before going on to fight the likes of: Virgil Hill, Reggie Johnson, John Ruiz, Antonio Tarver and Joe Calzaghe etc.

Personally, I find it hard to believe that a guy who feared Nunn, would then have gone on to have taken those fights above.