who did liston beat to be so highly regarded as good??

[Verstyle]

holmes was 37, and spinks is a lhw. no way they compare to a prime williams, and a prime patterson.

spink cleaned out the lightweavyweight division. and holmes didnt even try to fight tyson he jus ran. and the 4th round u could see he still had it when he was doing the jabs so he wasnt that old then also spinks beat a person some ppl regard as being a harder hitter then tyson gerry cooney and we all saw what happened to old spinks

[butterfly1964]

spink cleaned out the lightweavyweight division. and holmes didnt even try to fight tyson he jus ran. and the 4th round u could see he still had it when he was doing the jabs so he wasnt that old then also spinks beat a person some ppl regard as being a harder hitter then tyson gerry cooney and we all saw what happened to old spinks

"spinks cleaned out the light hw division!" what the hell does that mean? what does that have to do with hw's? thats like me saying since my 6yr. old brother beat up all other 6yr. olds, and if i beat him up then it means i'm the best fighter of all time! what kind of logic is that? and forgetaboutit, holmes was old, he was not in his prime. he was scared of tyson, and he could not do anything. gerry cooney was a junky by the time spinks fought him, so that makes no sense, that's like saying larry holmes is the greatest fighter of all time, since he beat ali, when ali had parkinson's and was on drugs.

liston crushed HOF'ers in their primes like patterson twice, williams twice, folley, machen, etc. tyson never beat a great HW fighter in their prime, unless you want to call spinks a hw. so your argument is just plain trash.

[Verstyle]

"spinks cleaned out the light hw division!" what the hell does that mean? what does that have to do with hw's? thats like me saying since my 6yr. old brother beat up all other 6yr. olds, and if i beat him up then it means i'm the best fighter of all time! what kind of logic is that? and forgetaboutit, holmes was old, he was not in his prime. he was scared of tyson, and he could not do anything. gerry cooney was a junky by the time spinks fought him, so that makes no sense, that's like saying larry holmes is the greatest fighter of all time, since he beat ali, when ali had parkinson's and was on drugs.

liston crushed HOF'ers in their primes like patterson twice, williams twice, folley, machen, etc. tyson never beat a great HW fighter in their prime, unless you want to call spinks a hw. so your argument is just plain trash.

and?? he still had power. and what i was tryin to refer to spinks is many ppl regarded him very highly. of his skill in that time period. many ppl had him beating tyson even

[Yogi]

liston crushed HOF'ers in their primes like patterson twice, williams twice, folley, machen, etc.

Again I ask...What boxing HOF are Williams, Folley and Machen a part of?

[butterfly1964]

Again I ask...What boxing HOF are Williams, Folley and Machen a part of?

well, they should be HOF'ers.

[butterfly1964]

and?? he still had power. and what i was tryin to refer to spinks is many ppl regarded him very highly. of his skill in that time period. many ppl had him beating tyson even

plus cooney had a weak chin.

[Kid Achilles]

I never said Liston had a better career than Mike overall or would beat him in a fight. I said his opposition before winning the title was better which is a true statement. In fact, Liston had one of the best pre-title runs of any heavyweight champion: he absolutely demolished everyone in his sight. The result of Liston-Patterson was pretty much a forgone conclusion and everyone knew that Sonny would obliterate Floyd; they only hoped he wouldn't kill him.

I don't know how I can possibly get it through all of your heads how dangerous and respected Liston in his prime was. People were comparing him to Jack Dempsey and Joe Louis (which no one ever said about Foreman). He wasn't afraid of anyone, he fought every viable contender in his way to the title, ducked no man, and knocked most of them out. He was quick, powerful, tough as hell, and had very good head movement. He was a slower Mike Tyson, but he was taller, rangier and physically much stronger.

Also I don't care what anyone says about the Ali fights, Liston had heart. The guy fought on with a broken jaw early in his career (and still lost by only a split decision while fighting in severe pain). Tyson never did anything of the sort. Tyson didn't have half the heart or inner strength of Sonny Liston.

Liston quit against Ali because he was fed up with boxing and fed up with his life. He had a miserable time since the day he was born (in the worst kind of povery, with over twenty siblings) and saw boxing as a road to success and happiness. He got the success, but the happiness was never there for him.

No one respected him, they just feared him. The guy only wanted to be treated like a human being of worth and distinction but instead he just got gawked at. Everyone, black and white, saw him as a grotesque monster. So at the point that Ali got to him, yeah he was depressed and fed up with it all. He had no heart then, I'll agree with you on that. But that wasn't Sonny Liston any more than the Tyson who quit against Williams and McBride was Mike Tyson.

Liston in his prime was without a doubt a top ten heavyweight and IMO a greater fighter (in terms of head to head matchup and actual skill and talent) than George Foreman. Foreman arguably accomplished more when you factor in his comeback but I think he was easier to outbox and is given far too much slack in his losses to Ali and Young. A prime Liston had more skill, both defensively and offensively, and much better stamina. This forum is high on Foreman because he's a nicer guy but the truth is that Sonny was a bigger badass and a better all around boxer.

[hellfire508]

Anyone who beats Cleveland Williams twice, Eddie Machen and Zora Folley - all in their primes (or extremely close to it) - is a great fighter.

Add to that wins over quality opponents like Nino Valdes.

Add to that two first round annihalations of a top 20 heavyweight HOFer in Floyd Patterson, and you have yourself an ATG heavyweight.

Liston was the most feared fighter of all time - and with his boxing skills and punching power, this is rightfully so.

He is looked down upon because of his losses to Ali. Give the man his dues.

[Verstyle]

plus cooney had a weak chin.

versus ****in michael spinks come on now.

[Verstyle]

I never said Liston had a better career than Mike overall or would beat him in a fight. I said his opposition before winning the title was better which is a true statement. In fact, Liston had one of the best pre-title runs of any heavyweight champion: he absolutely demolished everyone in his sight. The result of Liston-Patterson was pretty much a forgone conclusion and everyone knew that Sonny would obliterate Floyd; they only hoped he wouldn't kill him.

I don't know how I can possibly get it through all of your heads how dangerous and respected Liston in his prime was. People were comparing him to Jack Dempsey and Joe Louis (which no one ever said about Foreman). He wasn't afraid of anyone, he fought every viable contender in his way to the title, ducked no man, and knocked most of them out. He was quick, powerful, tough as hell, and had very good head movement. He was a slower Mike Tyson, but he was taller, rangier and physically much stronger.

Also I don't care what anyone says about the Ali fights, Liston had heart. The guy fought on with a broken jaw early in his career (and still lost by only a split decision while fighting in severe pain). Tyson never did anything of the sort. Tyson didn't have half the heart or inner strength of Sonny Liston.

Liston quit against Ali because he was fed up with boxing and fed up with his life. He had a miserable time since the day he was born (in the worst kind of povery, with over twenty siblings) and saw boxing as a road to success and happiness. He got the success, but the happiness was never there for him.

No one respected him, they just feared him. The guy only wanted to be treated like a human being of worth and distinction but instead he just got gawked at. Everyone, black and white, saw him as a grotesque monster. So at the point that Ali got to him, yeah he was depressed and fed up with it all. He had no heart then, I'll agree with you on that. But that wasn't Sonny Liston any more than the Tyson who quit against Williams and McBride was Mike Tyson.

Liston in his prime was without a doubt a top ten heavyweight and IMO a greater fighter (in terms of head to head matchup and actual skill and talent) than George Foreman. Foreman arguably accomplished more when you factor in his comeback but I think he was easier to outbox and is given far too much slack in his losses to Ali and Young. A prime Liston had more skill, both defensively and offensively, and much better stamina. This forum is high on Foreman because he's a nicer guy but the truth is that Sonny was a bigger badass and a better all around boxer.

in what era in years wise did liston demolish every1 to become undisputed champ