Marvin Hagler vs. Ray Leonard

[Chet's Revenge]

I am a big Hagler fan but I do think think Leonard outpointed him. In that fight Hagler was slow to start and gave up too many early rounds, and was just in general off his game.

[Dude]

I just can't see how someone can say they scored a fight 115-113 and then say they'd be disgusted if someone scored it for the other fighter.

I had it 115-113 for Ray.

Hagler threw the fight away fighting foolishly in the first four rounds.

I wouldn't call someone crazy for having it 115-113 Hagler, that's reasonable.

But so is 115-113 for Ray.

It was a close fight.

You missunderstood me than. I said it was a close fight and that implies that I could see why someone could possibly score it 115-113 in favour of Leonard.

But than again I don't see how anyone could possibly score it 118-110 in favour of Leonard. That being the crucial scorecard just makes it even more digusting.

Now Leonard won that fight and even if it was no robbery (though Guerra was paied) I can't understand all the people who recently proclaimed that Leonard clearly won the fight. Just because he didn't. It was a close fight and the verdict could've gone either way. I favour Hagler, you favour Leonard. That's ok. But Leonard didn't win this won clearly, nor did he dominate or fool Hagler.

If anything Hagler gave the fight away in the prefight-negotiations and during the first four rounds. Leonard made an incredible comeback, nobody is trying to deny this, but personally I think the glamour boy blazons his record with yet another win that really wasn't a clear one.

[Dude]

[QUOTE=NutzNYaMouf]

First Round: Hagler comes out northpole, Leonard seems very excited in the first twenty seconds. Leonard manages to establish the jab, moves faster than Hagler. Hagler follows Leonard around the ring, consistently talking to Leonard. Hagler connects with a right and Leonard unleashes his first flurry. Nothing of any impact, now Leonard turns southpole. Hagler continues to be the aggressor. As the bell rings Leonard does a little pose and off they go to the corner.
First Round scored for Sugar Ray Leonard!
10-9 Sugar Ray Leonard

Second Round: Hagler still fighting northpole and connects with a lead left hand. Trys to follow up but Leonard is too quick. Leonard goes to the body, connects with an overhand right. Richard Steele warns Leonard for holding. Hagler follows Leonard around the ring. Hagler connects with a right and Leonard flurries to steal round 2. Close round.
Second Round scored for Sugar Ray Leonard!
20-18 Sugar Ray Leonard

Third Round: Hagler comes out southpole, hits Leonard with two lefts. Leonard to the body, Hagler to the head. Hagler outpunches Leonard in the exchange, puts pressure on. Leonard pushes Hagler back, gets a warning for pushing. Leonard connects with some right hand leads, still showboats, flurries a little. Hagler with a solid left hand at the bell. Now personally it's really hard for me not to score this round for Hagler. In my opinion he should've won it. But maybe I'm being subjective. So as it was close I'll give it to Leonard.
Third Round scored for Sugar Ray Leonard!
30-27 Sugar Ray Leonard

Forth Round: Hagler staying southpole, hiting Leonard with a left hand lead. Continues to put pressure on Leonard but keeps missing. The crowd cheers for every move Leonard makes. Hard Low Blow by Leonard. Steele warns him for holding. Leonard connects to the body, connects with a showboatpunch and hits a flurry. Hagler smiles and follows him around. Another flurry by Leonard. No punch landed clean.
Forth Round scored for Sugar Ray Leonard!
40-36 Sugar Ray Leonard



WATS THIS NORTHPOLE SOUTHPOLE STUFF....

Northpole meaning orthodoxe stance with the left hand and the left foot leading.

Southpole meaning unorthodoxe stance with the right hand and the right foot leading.

Hagler was a natural southpole but could box northpole as well.

[Dude]

I watched it recently, and still had it for Leonard.

I thought he used the ring better, whilst Hagler just plodded forward, missing wildly.

Leonard threw better combinations, and was economic. He was more accurate then Hagler, and although Hagler landed punches, i thought Leonard's punches had more quality. (he put more into them)

Haglers defense was bad, and he was breathing very heavily early on.

Now, without trying to offend, that is bull****. Leonard really wasn't accurate and had nothing in his punches. He sacraficed speed for power. His punches had no snap in them (with very, very few exceptions).

Hagler certainly landed the harder and more meaningfull punches. It's just when he missed you cleary saw the he missed. He missed with some big shots during the twelve rounds.

Now Leonard flurried and let his hands go to dish out a lot of shots in a short amount of time. The thing is that most of this shots either clearly missed (went on Haglers guard or shoulder) and the rest of them had nothing in them at all. Hagler just walked through them. Leonard admited more than once that he tried to steal the rounds by flurring once the 30-secs to go mark was approached. Hagler landed by far more powershots and outlanded Leonard in the last 8 rounds by some margin.

[Bozo_no no]

You missunderstood me than. I said it was a close fight and that implies that I could see why someone could possibly score it 115-113 in favour of Leonard.

But than again I don't see how anyone could possibly score it 118-110 in favour of Leonard. That being the crucial scorecard just makes it even more digusting.

Now Leonard won that fight and even if it was no robbery (though Guerra was paied) I can't understand all the people who recently proclaimed that Leonard clearly won the fight. Just because he didn't. It was a close fight and the verdict could've gone either way. I favour Hagler, you favour Leonard. That's ok. But Leonard didn't win this won clearly, nor did he dominate or fool Hagler.

If anything Hagler gave the fight away in the prefight-negotiations and during the first four rounds. Leonard made an incredible comeback, nobody is trying to deny this, but personally I think the glamour boy blazons his record with yet another win that really wasn't a clear one.

I feel you dude, that's fair.

But if Hagler had have got the nod it could have been said that it was a win that wasn't really a clear one as well.

A W is a W, and if a comptitive and close fight can't be talked about admirably for a fighter, there's a ton of fights and fighters that have something taken away from them.

[Dude]

I feel you dude, that's fair.

But if Hagler had have got the nod it could have been said that it was a win that wasn't really a clear one as well.

A W is a W, and if a comptitive and close fight can't be talked about admirably for a fighter, there's a ton of fights and fighters that have something taken away from them.

You know, I totally see where you're comeing from and I don't want to take away from Sugar Rays record. He got the decision that night and he should be credited for it.

It's just that I think Hagler should be credited as well as he came as close to win this bout (with many, me including, believing he won it) as one possibly could.

People get on my nerves when they write that Leonard dominated Hagler and that only diehard Hagler fans could deny the fact that Leonard soundly beat him. It just wasn't like that. Thats basicly all I wanted to say.

[Bozo_no no]

You know, I totally see where you're comeing from and I don't want to take away from Sugar Rays record. He got the decision that night and he should be credited for it.

It's just that I think Hagler should be credited as well as he came as close to win this bout (with many, me including, believing he won it) as one possibly could.

People get on my nerves when they write that Leonard dominated Hagler and that only diehard Hagler fans could deny the fact that Leonard soundly beat him. It just wasn't like that. Thats basicly all I wanted to say.

A draw would have been a very fair outcome as well.

[Tha Greatest]

I am a Hagler fan, but I wouldn't really call that a robbery, I can see how people had Ray winning, but I had the Marvelous one winning.

[Dude]

A draw would have been a very fair outcome as well.

Yeah, I think we both can agree on that.

I am a Hagler fan, but I wouldn't really call that a robbery, I can see how people had Ray winning, but I had the Marvelous one winning.

I didn't say it was a robbery. I just believe that Guerra was paied and that people forget how close the fight really was.

[RastaSmoker]

Do illiterate people get the full effect of alphabet soup?