History of the Heavyweights part 6 (Jack Johnson)

[butterfly1964]

yea he was prime 1937 ya know 2 years before he won the title for his near 10 year title reign

i didn't say prime i said close to prime.

[RockyMarcianofan00]

i didn't say prime i said close to prime.

o
doesn't matter cause just over 2 years later he nearly killed Schmeling in the first round

that fight was ridiculous lasted like 1 and a half minutes and Louis really only landed two shots to take everything away from schmelling

one jaw shot one body

his corner thought Louis had broke schmelings neck

[butterfly1964]

o
doesn't matter cause just over 2 years later he nearly killed Schmeling in the first round

that fight was ridiculous lasted like 1 and a half minutes and Louis really only landed two shots to take everything away from schmelling

one jaw shot one body

his corner thought Louis had broke schmelings neck

but my point is that this guy says that louis' career is unblemished, when there are plenty of blemishes.

[Yogi]

how about the fact that a close to prime louis was smashed by a washed up max "friggin" schmeling!! lol!

i guess you have nothing to say about that, do you?

Yeah, I got something to say about that and the first thing is that was not a "washed up" version of a mere 30 year-old Max Scmeling...If it's not very obvious to you by the fight footage that you probably didn't even watch (which shows Schmeling looking as good or better than he ever did), then check out some of the articles written by the boxing/sports writers during his time. After a rough patch a couple years previous, Schmeling got right back on track and the second fight before the first Louis bout saw Schmeling knock out the then #1 ranked Ring Magazine contender, Steve *****. After that knockout, Schmeling was right back near the very top the title picture (Ring Magazine, NYSAC, NBA...all ranked Schmeling as one of the two best contnders, and he held at least that position right up 'til the Louis rematch) and even though a title fight never came to pass, all it takes is a little bit of research to see that there was PLENTY of talks about pitting Schmeling in title fights or at the very least, title eliminators.

And even though Louis was the heavy favourite, that was more to do with how highly Louis was thought of during that time, rather than a way of belittling Schmeling...Louis was on a role & ripping through some of the elite fighters of the division, which had very rarely if ever been seen before during a fighter's pre title challenging days. Look through the newspaper reports before the first Louis/Schmeling fight and see what they were saying about the buildup to the fight...A quick glance of those contemporary reports doesn't once indicate Schmeling as being "washed up" or past his prime, and instead much is written on how excellant Schmeling had looked through the vast majority of his training & sparring sessions and how much confidence he had...Even the Heavyweight champion at the time, James Braddock, was VERY impressed with how Schmeling looked in training and he stated in print that it wouldn't suprise him if Schmeling was the one with his hand raised at the end of the night (which is what happened, not to Braddock's suprise)

Babble, babble, babbble...yeah I know, but the film, contemporary reports, etc., etc. all suggest that Schmeling was still in his prime for the first Louis fight, and that performance by both fighters shouldn't be looked upon as a black mark against Louis, but as a HUGE compliment to what Schmeling was capable of doing as a fighter...and Ring Magazine, IBRO, etc., all give Schmeling that credit, because he's most often ranked amongst the 20-25 best Heavyweights of all-time by those "experts".

[RockyMarcianofan00]

there's no fighter in history thats record went with out blemishes

[SuzieQ49]

Yeah, I got something to say about that and the first thing is that was not a "washed up" version of a mere 30 year-old Max Scmeling...If it's not very obvious to you by the fight footage that you probably didn't even watch (which shows Schmeling looking as good or better than he ever did), then check out some of the articles written by the boxing/sports writers during his time. After a rough patch a couple years previous, Schmeling got right back on track and the second fight before the first Louis bout saw Schmeling knock out the then #1 ranked Ring Magazine contender, Steve *****. After that knockout, Schmeling was right back near the very top the title picture (Ring Magazine, NYSAC, NBA...all ranked Schmeling as one of the two best contnders, and he held at least that position right up 'til the Louis rematch) and even though a title fight never came to pass, all it takes is a little bit of research to see that there was PLENTY of talks about pitting Schmeling in title fights or at the very least, title eliminators.

And even though Louis was the heavy favourite, that was more to do with how highly Louis was thought of during that time, rather than a way of belittling Schmeling...Louis was on a role & ripping through some of the elite fighters of the division, which had very rarely if ever been seen before during a fighter's pre title challenging days. Look through the newspaper reports before the first Louis/Schmeling fight and see what they were saying about the buildup to the fight...A quick glance of those contemporary reports doesn't once indicate Schmeling as being "washed up" or past his prime, and instead much is written on how excellant Schmeling had looked through the vast majority of his training & sparring sessions and how much confidence he had...Even the Heavyweight champion at the time, James Braddock, was VERY impressed with how Schmeling looked in training and he stated in print that it wouldn't suprise him if Schmeling was the one with his hand raised at the end of the night (which is what happened, not to Braddock's suprise)

Babble, babble, babbble...yeah I know, but the film, contemporary reports, etc., etc. all suggest that Schmeling was still in his prime for the first Louis fight, and that performance by both fighters shouldn't be looked upon as a black mark against Louis, but as a HUGE compliment to what Schmeling was capable of doing as a fighter...and Ring Magazine, IBRO, etc., all give Schmeling that credit, because he's most often ranked amongst the 20-25 best Heavyweights of all-time by those "experts".

spot on yogi. i might add schmeling also didnt show any signs of aging during the 2 years before his title fight louis in 1938. he was still the # 1 contender who was fighting as good as ever. louis ruined schmeling, and you dont need to be an expert to know that. just look at the physical injuries schmeling suffered in this fight. its amazing even after the louis fight, schmeling was able to knockout a good contender like adolf hueser in one round.

[smasher]

louis ruined schmeling, and you dont need to be an expert to know that. just look at the physical injuries schmeling suffered in this fight. its amazing even after the louis fight, schmeling was able to knockout a good contender like adolf hueser in one round.

What's so amazing that Schmeling was able to score a 1 round KO victory after losing to Louis? Schmeling was starched in under a round from Joe and thus did not recieve ANY sustained beating. Schmeling was actually hit with very few punches in that fight, so precise and accurate was the execution by Louis.

The physical injury Schmeling recieved in the Louis fight was to his back. This was most likely caused when Schmeling was staggered and responded by grabbing the top rope and turning sideways from Louis who hammered Schmeling with right hands to his kidney and back area.

Fighters throughout the history of boxing have taken serious beatings in fights and returned to have success. This was not a beating. It was a very quick KO. Schmeling did himself no favours by not throwing a meaningful punch then grabbing the top rope and turning away from Joe when hurt.

You wouldn't be a biased Joe Louis fan by any chance would you?

[Kid Achilles]

If Louis beating Schmeling was not a beating than Foreman beating Frazier wasn't either. That was a TERRIBLE battering and Schmeling was lucky to have been able to fight again, let alone against pretty good competition. Ringsiders remarked that Schmeling squeeled like a pig when he was struck in the side by Louis. The whole thing was sickening and if that's not a beating I don't know what is. Schmeling went straight to the hospital and it was soon discovered that Louis's punches had fractured two of his vertebrae.

Needless to say (well on this forum perhaps it does need to be reiterated), that fight destroyed Schmeling as a world class boxer.

[SuzieQ49]

Schmeling was starched in under a round from Joe and thus did not recieve ANY sustained beating.

I agree. I mean fracturing your vertabae is not a bad injury right?

i mean, schmeling was only beaten unmercifully for 2 minutes that had schmeling screaming out like a little school girl

[smasher]

The whole thing was sickening and if that's not a beating I don't know what is.

Gimme a break. "The whole thing was sickening?" Maybe you're too much of a humanitarian and don't have the stomach to be watching boxing then. That or a drama queen.

Louis quickly and efficiently executed Schmeling. It was not 2 minutes of a sustained beating. After a feeling out process of over a minute which saw Louis as the agressor, Schmeling backed towards the ropes and was hurt by a right hand to the head. Schmeling's punishment was then recieved when he turned away, grabbed the rope and failed to defend himself.

Schmeling's injury was the result of Louis landing a punch to Schmeling's back. I'm not criticizing Louis for it, a fighter must defend himself at all times, but judging from the look on Schmeling's face when that punch landed, it's likely that's how the injury occurred.

Once the referee let Schmeling off the ropes he was doubled over from the back injury and Louis was able to drop him with a single right cross. Schmeling got up was hit by a combination and his gloves touched the canvass. Schmeling was sent down a third time, the towel was thrown in and the fight was then over.

Not a sustained beating but instead a quick and efficient execution by the best finisher in heavy-weight history. Case closed.