Did Buster Douglas Really Beat Mike Tyson??

[smasher]

im confused.


smasher are u saying a 1990s foreman beats a 1980s mike tyson?

These men were supposed to have fought in 1991. They were co-featured on a card that had Tyson-Tillman and Foreman-Rodrigues. The idea was for both guys to win then meet in a non-title showdown. It would have been the biggest money fight in boxing at the time but the fight didn't happen because Tyson didn't want it to happen.

Who the **** is Razor Ruddock? A one handed, one punch, limited bum who was destroyed by Lennox Lewis in 2 rounds after going 12 with Tyson. No jab, no right hand, no defence no nothing. Who the **** did he ever beat but an old, used up, shopworn ex-coke addict Michael Dokes.

Don't compare 1988 Holmes to 1991 Foreman. Foreman was a very active fighter in the years leading up to 1991. Holmes was inactive for 2 years when he fought Tyson and was completely un-prepared, under-trained, coming out of retirement and only took the fight because he needed a pay day to purchase real estate. Holmes was a rusty inactive shell in that fight, nothing like the 1991 Foreman.

Foreman did not fight Morrison in 1991. Foreman was slipping, yet even still Morrison ran like a thief in that fight. Had he came to Foreman in his usual style would have been KO'd. Morrison knew that, that's why he spent the 12 rounds on his bicycle.

1991 Foreman KO's 1991 Tyson.

[K-DOGG]

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/fea...flashback/kod/
The eighth round opened with Douglas again getting the better of Tyson, but it closed with a sudden, classic Tyson right uppercut that dropped Douglas to the canvas with six seconds left. It was the only time that Douglas got careless, and it nearly cost him his eventual stunning upset. Worse, though, was referee Meyran's shabby handling of the count, which, if promoter Don King has his way, may serve to deprive Douglas of the crown that he rightfully deserves. At the moment Douglas's backside touched the surface of the ring, the knockdown timekeeper began his count. Instead of picking up that cadence, Meyran began his own count, two beats behind.
As generations of felled fighters have done before him, Douglas kept his attention fixed on the referee's hands. As Meyran signaled nine, Douglas rose, but the bell ended the round. If there was any doubt that Douglas was clearheaded and could have risen to his feet on the timekeeper's count, it had been erased right after the knockdown when Douglas pounded his left fist on the mat, in obvious annoyance at his own lapse.
Yet King, who saw his world tour coming to a screeching halt about three continents short of his grand plan, would later seize on the discrepancy in the counts as grounds to bully others into awarding Tyson a victory by knockout.
But King was not willing to allow his investment in the franchise called Mike Tyson to take the hit that inevitably comes from losing a title fight. King summoned officials from two of the major sanctioning bodies, the WBC and WBA, and representatives from the Japan Boxing Commission to a small room off the arena. Emerging two hours later, King called a press conference to announce that tapes of the bout clearly showed that "two knockouts took place, but the first knockout obliterates the second. Buster Douglas was knocked out, and the referee did not do his job and panicked. As the promoter of both fighters, I'm only seeking fair play."
Two hours after that declaration, King again summoned the press. This time, he brought along Meyran, who said, "I don't know why I start my count and make my mistake. Yes, he was down longer than 10 seconds." Also in attendance was the fallen champion. His swollen left eye hidden by dark glasses, he said, "I thought I knocked him out. I thought he was counted out."
Not surprisingly, given the sway he holds over the sport, King's transparent attempts to alter the obvious were persuasive enough for the WBC and WBA to announce that they would suspend recognition of the outcome until further review, which is expected to take place during this coming week. Even as Douglas relaxed in his hotel room with the WBC belt around his waist, the organization's president, Jose Sulaiman, was saying, "I'm very confused." Later, at the second press conference, he was no longer so confused. He said a rematch "was absolutely mandatory." But the damage is pretty much done. All King's men can't put Tyson together again.
Of course, if you want confusion, boxing is, once more, for you. For starters, there is the blabbering of governing bodies whose only apparent purpose is to collect sanctioning fees. Tyson had consolidated all three titles -- WBC, WBA and IBF -- on Aug. 1, 1987, but because the Japan Boxing Commission does not recognize the IBF, no one from that organization was represented in Tokyo. Yet the IBF did sanction the fight, and does not recognize the challenge to Douglas's victory. So at the very least, Douglas now holds the IBF title.

It's really unfair how tyson's belt was taken away from him although he clearly won the bout. If the referee counted right and claimed Tyson as the winner, Tyson would have realized that he almost could have been knocked out (which happened) and would have been more careful in the future. Tyson even claims that his career ended at the buster douglas fight. Maybe it led to his to fallout not only in the ring but outside of it as well.

Pathetic. Absolutely Pathetic. Douglas got up before the ref counted 10, which is all that is required of a fighter...and finished kicking Tyson's ass. End of story. Get over it.

[SuzieQ49]

1991 Foreman KO's 1991 Tyson.

now thats ridiculous, i cant agree with this. even if tyson couldnt knock him out, he would easily outbox him like he did tony tucker and razor ruddock. there is no way foreman could possibly beat tyson. 1990s foreman DOES NOT HAVE enough power or punching skills anymore to knock out mike tyson. 1990s foreman does not have enough skill or speed to keep from avoiding tysons blows. 1990s foreman is not good enough to outbox tyson.

- there is no way a 1990s foreman could possibly win this fight.


- tyson hit harder and was a much devastating puncher than ron lyle who nearly knocked george out. tyson will be beating foreman to the punch the entire fight, and foreman does not have a good enough chin to take tysons hardest punchers and deadly combinations.





- first of all, ruddock would have beat george in 91. george was shutout by a glass jaw fighter tommy morrison which is PATHETIC!

[paul750]

- first of all, ruddock would have beat george in 91. george was shutout by a glass jaw fighter tommy morrison which is PATHETIC!

Morrison was still a talented fighter though, be fair.

[smasher]

foreman DOES NOT HAVE enough power or punching skills anymore to knock out mike tyson.

You are grossly downplaying the '91 Foreman. Foreman adopted a cross-arm defence and was much harder to hit than he was in the 70's. He was energy conservative, efficient, calm, focused and very accurate with his power punches. Foreman's jab was a battering ram. Check the punch stats in some of his fights around this time. Foreman was never backed up, seriously hurt or floored during his comeback and was never DOMINATED by anyone in the 90's.

1991 George at 42 yrs fought a PRIME Holyfield jarring and backing up Holyfield on several occasions and giving Holyfield a very tough and competitive fight. Foreman stood up in between rounds the entire fight showed stamina and power late in the fight and it was Holyfield that was holding on at the bell.

1996 Tyson at 30 yrs fought an older shot Holyfield was completely dominated, only won one round, got floored and KO'd. Don't tell me Holyfield was anywhere near his prime. Holyfield hadn't scored a KO in 5 years. Watch the Czyz fight. Holyfield was awful. Life and death with under achiever Ray Mercer, KO'd by Bowe and decisioned by Moorer. After Tyson, Holyfield scored 1 CAREER KO in the next 8 years. So in 13 years Holyfield scores 2 KO's and won of them is a convicing one over Tyson.

The Nevada state Athletic commision wouldn't even sanction the Holyfield-Tyson fight until Holyfield was examined by the Mayo clinic and given a clean bill of health. This was because HOLYFIELD LOOKED SHOT AS A FIGHTER AND THE NSAC WAS WORRIED HOLYFIELD WOULD BE SERIOUSLY HURT. Ring Magazine picked Tyson by 1 Round KO and Holyfield was a huge betting underdog. Don't give me **** about Tyson being shot. The boxing media couldn't get enough of Tyson when he KO'd Bruno that year. NO ONE was writing about Tyson being shot until conveniently after Holyfield manhandled and kicked the **** out of him.

Think Holyfield was stronger than Tyson the way he pushed Mike off him, backed him up, and bullied him? Watch Foreman against PRIME Holyfield. Foreman was knocking Holyfield back with jabs. Foreman was substantially stronger than Holyfield and Foreman was infinitely stronger than Tyson.

How many fights did Holyfield fight like he fought Foreman? Maybe Bowe II that's it. Holyfield knew if he stood in front of Foreman (like Holyfield was able to and thoroughly dominate Tyson) he would be stopped.

91 Foreman had strength, a battering ram accurate left jab and power. Tyson was staggered by Bruno, KO'd by Douglas, staggered by Smith and rocked and backed up by Ruddock. What makes you think Foreman couldn't hurt Tyson?

Foreman doesn't have the skill to avoid Tyson's blows? I guess the limited Bonecrusher Smith did who went 12 rounds with Tyson without being hurt did. Smith isn't in Foreman's league power wise or accuracy wise and he staggered and backed up PRIME TYSON when he decided to let his hands go.

Foreman came back for one reason. To fight Tyson. The match was in negotiations until talks broke down because of Tyson's unwillingness to fight Foreman. That's why Foreman ended up fighting Holyfield.

And there is no way in hell Ruddock would have beaten Foreman. With what? He had no jab, no right hand, no defense, a very average chin nothing but a telegraphed left hand. Ruddock was stopped by David Jaco, Tommy Morrison and killed by Lennox Lewis. What the **** did Ruddock ever do or who did he ever beat to make you think he would have defeated Foreman?

[SuzieQ49]

You are grossly downplaying the '91 Foreman. Foreman adopted a cross-arm defence and was much harder to hit than he was in the 70's. He was energy conservative, efficient, calm, focused and very accurate with his power punches. Foreman's jab was a battering ram. Check the punch stats in some of his fights around this time. Foreman was never backed up, seriously hurt or floored during his comeback and was never DOMINATED by anyone in the 90's.

1991 George at 42 yrs fought a PRIME Holyfield jarring and backing up Holyfield on several occasions and giving Holyfield a very tough and competitive fight. Foreman stood up in between rounds the entire fight showed stamina and power late in the fight and it was Holyfield that was holding on at the bell.

1996 Tyson at 30 yrs fought an older shot Holyfield was completely dominated, only won one round, got floored and KO'd. Don't tell me Holyfield was anywhere near his prime. Holyfield hadn't scored a KO in 5 years. Watch the Czyz fight. Holyfield was awful. Life and death with under achiever Ray Mercer, KO'd by Bowe and decisioned by Moorer. After Tyson, Holyfield scored 1 CAREER KO in the next 8 years. So in 13 years Holyfield scores 2 KO's and won of them is a convicing one over Tyson.

The Nevada state Athletic commision wouldn't even sanction the Holyfield-Tyson fight until Holyfield was examined by the Mayo clinic and given a clean bill of health. This was because HOLYFIELD LOOKED SHOT AS A FIGHTER AND THE NSAC WAS WORRIED HOLYFIELD WOULD BE SERIOUSLY HURT. Ring Magazine picked Tyson by 1 Round KO and Holyfield was a huge betting underdog. Don't give me **** about Tyson being shot. The boxing media couldn't get enough of Tyson when he KO'd Bruno that year. NO ONE was writing about Tyson being shot until conveniently after Holyfield manhandled and kicked the **** out of him.

Think Holyfield was stronger than Tyson the way he pushed Mike off him, backed him up, and bullied him? Watch Foreman against PRIME Holyfield. Foreman was knocking Holyfield back with jabs. Foreman was substantially stronger than Holyfield and Foreman was infinitely stronger than Tyson.

How many fights did Holyfield fight like he fought Foreman? Maybe Bowe II that's it. Holyfield knew if he stood in front of Foreman (like Holyfield was able to and thoroughly dominate Tyson) he would be stopped.

91 Foreman had strength, a battering ram accurate left jab and power. Tyson was staggered by Bruno, KO'd by Douglas, staggered by Smith and rocked and backed up by Ruddock.
Think Holyfield was stronger than Tyson the way he pushed Mike off him, backed him up, and bullied him? Watch Foreman against PRIME Holyfield. Foreman was knocking Holyfield back with jabs. Foreman was substantially stronger than Holyfield and Foreman was infinitely stronger than Tyson.

Foreman doesn't have the skill to avoid Tyson's blows? I guess the limited Bonecrusher Smith did who went 12 rounds with Tyson without being hurt did. Smith isn't in Foreman's league power wise or accuracy wise and he staggered and backed up PRIME TYSON when he decided to let his hands go.

Foreman came back for one reason. To fight Tyson. The match was in negotiations until talks broke down because of Tyson's unwillingness to fight Foreman. That's why Foreman ended up fighting Holyfield.

And there is no way in hell Ruddock would have beaten Foreman. With what? He had no jab, no right hand, no defense, a very average chin nothing but a telegraphed left hand. Ruddock was stopped by David Jaco, Tommy Morrison and killed by Lennox Lewis. What the **** did Ruddock ever do or who did he ever beat to make you think he would have defeated Foreman?

Foreman was never backed up, seriously hurt or floored during his comeback and was never DOMINATED by anyone in the 90's.

he never faced the 2nd greatest heavyweight puncher of all time like he would with tyson

1996 Tyson at 30 yrs fought an older shot Holyfield was completely dominated, only won one round, got floored and KO'd.

tyson was a lot more past his prime than holyfield was. and tyson defintley won at least 3 rounds.

tyson was 8 years past his prime, in comparison holyfield was just about 2-3 years past his prime.

Don't give me **** about Tyson being shot. The boxing media couldn't get enough of Tyson when he KO'd Bruno that year. NO ONE was writing about Tyson being shot until conveniently after Holyfield manhandled and kicked the **** out of him.

- bruno was a scared jack rabbit who was pissing his pants the whole fight. he was nothing of an opponent. seldon was so scared he went down without being hit. u call this mike "showing his old form"??????????


NO FIGHTER WHO EVER CAME BACK FROM A 4 YEAR LAYOFF WAS EVER THE SAME AGAIN. look at joe louis, muhammad ali. u said it urself u thought ali was worse in the FOTC because of ring rust. well tyson leading up to the holyfield fight had fought just 8 rounds in the past 5 years and was coming off a 4 year layoff 91-95! tyson during those years had no boxing training whatsoever. tyson not only was mentally messed up, he was terribly ring rusty and was far past his peak . tyson was a earlier bloomer, and early bloomers usually are past there prime well before age 30.


- also, holy lost to michael moorer in 94. yet in 97 AFTER THE TYSON FIGHTS, holy dominated moorer knocking him out. in 99, holyfield fought 12 even rounds IN THE REMATCH with lennox. so how fast his prime can he be??


- if u watch holyfield-tyson I, holy clearly looks a lot closer to a prime holyfield than tyson does to himself. many reports claim holy fought the best fight of his career vs tyson.


ALSO, THAT WAS THE MIKE TYSON OF 96, NOT 1991 MIKE TYSON.

1991 George at 42 yrs fought a PRIME Holyfield jarring and backing up Holyfield on several occasions and giving Holyfield a very tough and competitive fight. Foreman stood up in between rounds the entire fight showed stamina and power late in the fight and it was Holyfield that was holding on at the bell.

- dont forget thats the same holyfield who was nearly knocked out by journeyman late sub bert cooper.

- also dont forget a older, worse larry holmes fought 12 close competitive rounds with evander yet tyson knocked out a MUCH YOUNGER HOLMES OUT IN 4 EASY ROUNDS.

Think Holyfield was stronger than Tyson the way he pushed Mike off him, backed him up, and bullied him? Watch Foreman against PRIME Holyfield. Foreman was knocking Holyfield back with jabs. Foreman was substantially stronger than Holyfield and Foreman was infinitely stronger than Tyson.

that tyson was A LOT WORSE THAN THE 1991 MIKE TYSON WHO WAS 5 YEARS YOUNGER AND WASNT COMING OFF A 4 YEAR LAYOFF!


- i also watched foreman lose to alex stewart and get lucky to win the decision. incidentley, tyson knocked out alex stewart in 1 easy round.


- george foreman could NOT EVEN KNOCK OUT alex stewart who is far less of a fighter than mike tyson and is far less durable than tyson. foreman couldnt even put him away yet hes going to put tyson away!

- foreman DID NOT HAVE HIS SAME POWER IN 91. razor ruddock was defintley a harder puncher than the 1990s george foreman.

91 Foreman had strength, a battering ram accurate left jab and power. Tyson was staggered by Bruno, KO'd by Douglas, staggered by Smith and rocked and backed up by Ruddock. why wouldnt foreman be able to hurt rocky

- TYSON TOOK RAZOR RUDDOCKS BEST PUNCHES. RAZOR WAS A HARDER PUNCHER THAN THE 1990S FOREMAN.


- foremans jab was slow, and easy to avoid. foreman was STAGGERED BY KEN LAKUSTA, MICHAEL MOORER, EVANDER HOLYFIELD, AND OTHERS WHO WERE ALL far LESS PUNCHERS THAN TYSON.


- tyson has 100X FASTER HANDSPEED THAN FOREMAN, THREW FAR BETTER COMBINATIONS, MUCH BETTER ACCURACY, MORE POWER, SHORTER PUNCHES, i mean tyson will literally beat foreman to the punch the entire fight!

tyson will have already landed 5 devastating punches by the time foreman gets 1 in

Foreman doesn't have the skill to avoid Tyson's blows? I guess the limited Bonecrusher Smith did who went 12 rounds with Tyson without being hurt did. Smith isn't in Foreman's league power wise or accuracy wise and he staggered and backed up PRIME TYSON when he decided to let his hands go.

- boneCLUTCHER held on for his dear life the entire fight, his goal was to survive not win.

- prime bonercusher smith was just as good as the 1990s foreman.


1990s foreman lost to shannon briggs, axel shulz, alex stewart, shutout by glass jaw morrison.




- 87 holmes was just as good as the 91 foreman. in fact, the 92 holmes who was 5 years older gave holy a closer fight than the 91 foreman.





- ruddock had too much power, speed, youthness for foreman, it would end up like the morrison fights. morrsion beat ruddock when ruddock was FAR PAST HIS PRIME






jsut remember...........


alex stewart beat george foreman- stewart was awful too


tyson KO 1 alex stewart



this would be a joke of a fight



tyson TKO 4 1990s foreman

[SuzieQ49]

What the **** did Ruddock ever do or who did he ever beat to make you think he would have defeated Foreman?

what did foreman ever do?


foreman lost to morrison, C level alex stewart, axel shulz.


ruddock only lost to tyson and that was in 2 very competitive fights.



dokes was shot when ruddock beat him? wasnt this the same dokes who had recentley gived a PEAK EVANDER HOLYFIELD 10 life and death even rounds before getting stopped? ruddock was able to put dokes away with 1 punch. U SEE BY THIS TIME, HE WAS OFF THE DRUGS, AND IN THE BEST SHAPE OF HIS CAREER, WHICH EXPLAINS WHY HE CAME CLOSE TO BEATING A PEAK EVANDER HOLYFIELD.

[Yogi]

ruddock was able to put dokes away with 1 punch. U SEE BY THIS TIME, HE WAS OFF THE DRUGS, AND IN THE BEST SHAPE OF HIS CAREER, WHICH EXPLAINS WHY HE CAME CLOSE TO BEATING A PEAK EVANDER HOLYFIELD.

Oh man, Brockton...Judging by the very noticable amount of chub Dokes possessed around his middle in the Ruddock fight, and also the very noticable decrease in his handspeed at the time (compared to the early 80's Dokes), for the life of me I cannot see why you could possibly say that he was "IN THE BEST SHAPE OF HIS CAREER".

[Heckler]

****, its hilarious how people become delusional when someone percieved as INVINCIBLE gets his ass handed to him. Happened with Foreman against Ali. Every ****en exscuse under the sun. Douglas had the assets and the attitude to pick Tyson apart, expose his flaws. Simple. Do you think a boxer goes into a fight in TOP form every fight? no, but they are professionals and thus should be able to deal with it. Tyson didn't, he lost, simple. Long count, bull****. Douglas knew exactly where he was and waited until the last second to give himself as much recovery time as possible.

[Heckler]

I believe a 1990's Foreman would beat Tyson. Infact im certain. Tyson would be beaten before he stepped in the ring. He used to watch footage of Foreman with Cus who noted that no swarming fighter had a chance against Foreman. Tyson BLATENTLY ducked Foreman and this is noted by all those who were close to him, he was ****-scared and thus would not perform well on the night. Foreman definately wasn't scared of him, STILL had awesome power and a style effective for dealing with swarming fighters. Tyson can't fight on the backfoot, he is no boxer. He would be nervous and hesistant, thus not applying pressure. Foreman Ko's him with a gigantic uppercut.