Tunney on Sonny Liston: "Dempsey KOs him in 2 Rounds"

[sonnyboyx2]

http://cyberboxingzone.com/boxing/ca...eyChampion.htm

You have to ask yourself, Do you know more than Ray Arcel".. Who seen Dempsey fight... we can only go by what guys like Arcel tell us, because to simply trash their word and claim Dempsey was rubbish and would be destroyed by Vitali Klitschko or some other alphabet belt holder is ridiculous... What would Arcel say of Klitschko?

[Joeyzagz]

Many historians/fighters/journalists, and trainers, rated Dempsey as the greatest fighter who ever lived. It can't be chalked up to only nostalgia. Dempsey had the skills that gave him his legacy as the GOAT in the minds of many. Only nobody today has seen him fight in action and in sparring. The best we have are shaky black and white, incomplete films of four of his most famous fights. Willard, Firpo, Gibbons, and Tunney.

I dunno about "fighter" as I think Greb was far superior, but as far as Heavyweight is concerned, Dempsey was no doubt the greatest from 1890-1948.

By 1960 I have Marciano and Joe Louis leap-frogging him. Marciano's style wins more H2H matches I think.

By 2005 I have Lennox, Ali and Foreman leap-frogging him, which would place Dempsey 6th all time. Not too bad....

[SBleeder]

you are entitled to your own opinion yet the opinion of many boxing historians is that he was by far the GOAT.. here is a couple of links from the thousands you will find on-line.. it is difficult to find links for any other fighter being labeled as the GOAT...

I'm pretty sure far more historians rank SRR as the GOAT... Ali is generally ranked above Dempsey too.

As for Dempsey/Liston, this is perhaps the worst style matchup in history for Dempsey... not to mention the fact that Dempsey never fought anyone who hit as hard as Liston.

Liston KO4.

[Great John L]

GOAT description was usually given to Dempsey as heavyweight, not Pound for Pound. Those who saw both felt that Ali was in the middle range, 5-8 on the list of best heavyweights. But even those who felt Ali was great still had Demspey a little higher, like Arcel. You don't see many lists today with Dempsey held so high with so much esteem, but nobody living today has see him in person fighting and training, sparring.

[sonnyboyx2]

GOAT description was usually given to Dempsey as heavyweight, not Pound for Pound. Those who saw both felt that Ali was in the middle range, 5-8 on the list of best heavyweights. But even those who felt Ali was great still had Demspey a little higher, like Arcel. You don't see many lists today with Dempsey held so high with so much esteem, but nobody living today has see him in person fighting and training, sparring.

yes quite true... Dempsey was rated the greatest heavyweight of all time right up to the 1960s when all who rated him passed away

[TheGreatA]

Keep in mind that this was an immediate reaction to Liston's horrible effort against Ali in the rematch, a fight where Liston was certainly not at his best.

Imagine what Ali would say if he saw Dempsey get knocked out by Fireman Flynn in one round, he would probably say that Liston would slaughter him inside two rounds as well.

[sonnyboyx2]

Keep in mind that this was an immediate reaction to Liston's horrible effort against Ali in the rematch, a fight where Liston was certainly not at his best.

Imagine what Ali would say if he saw Dempsey get knocked out by Fireman Flynn in one round, he would probably say that Liston would slaughter him inside two rounds as well.

Was Dempsey KOd by Fireman Jim Flynn or did he take a dive in your opinion?

[Kid McCoy]

After the 1965 heavyweight fight when Ali beat Liston with the so called "anchor punch" Tunney, normally quiet and reserved from the fight game, called the bout an utter disgrace and a shame to boxing.

Tunney was not enthralled with the abiltiy of either fighter, but declared that Liston had no real skills as a fighter, and that Jack Dempsey would KO Liston in 2 rounds.

What do you think of Tunney's degrading of Liston's skills?

The fact that Dempsey was Tunney's most celebrated win was purely coincidental. He's hardly going to say Liston would have flattened Dempsey. Dempsey couldn't even walk through Tommy Gibbons, Bill Brennan or Willie Meehan but he's going to KO one of the meanest, strongest heavyweights of all time in two rounds. Right.

[TheGreatA]

Was Dempsey KOd by Fireman Jim Flynn or did he take a dive in your opinion?

There is no way to know. Dempsey never admitted to taking a dive nor did the newspapers at the time question the legitimacy of the knockout. Flynn KO'ing Dempsey sounds questionable but then again he was a veteran and may have just rushed an unprepared Dempsey.

[sonnyboyx2]

There is no way to know. Dempsey never admitted to taking a dive nor did the newspapers at the time question the legitimacy of the knockout. Flynn KO'ing Dempsey sounds questionable but then again he was a veteran and may have just rushed an unprepared Dempsey.

http://news.google.co.uk/newspapers?...im+flynn&hl=en