Mike Tyson ATG Living Legend of the Sport

[GymRat]

So a fighter is now "past his prime" if he CHOOSES to be lazy and allows lousy people into his life? Fascinating.

Yes. Whatever the reasons may be, at the end of the day they are still past their prime, no? If I choose to throw a ham sandwich into a sewer, I no longer have that ham sandwich, do I? Whether I chose to do it or not, I no longer have it. Get it? Mike's prime was taken from him probably through only half of the things he had a choice over anyway.

Every fighter is an ATG if we define their prime as "the period when they weren't losing.

Actually, I'M the greatest fighter who's ever lived. My prime lasted for one round against the double-end bag in my basement, back on November 4, 2006. I was unstoppable. But alas, I've been lazy ever since. But in my prime, nobody could have beaten me. If I had trained harder, I would be able to knock out the Klitschko's in 30 seconds each.

Or how about this guy? (http://boxrec.com/list_bouts.php?hum...8949&cat=boxer) He was great in his prime. Unfortunately, his prime only lasted for one fight- his second career bout- where he scored a knockout. After that he just stopped training and had bad people around him, which of course means that a guy is simply "past his prime", which relieves him of having to work hard.

Have you or that guy cleaned out your divisions and unified the belts and been the youngest and most exciting heavyweight champions of the world? No? Didn't think so. Case closed.

Twist it however you want it. At the end of the day, it all boils down to:
1.) Tyson was in his absolute prime in 1987 and up until the Spinks fight of 1988.
2.). Tyson was far past his prime (through the reasons I listed, which do indeed include reasons he had control or choice over) when he fought Buster Douglas, and in the fights after the Spinks fight which was his last fight with Kevin Rooney.
3.) He is an ATG because he defeated everyone on the list at the time who needed to be defeated, he unified the belts, he cleaned out (and struck fear) into the heavyweight division, he was the youngest world champion on record, and is one of (if not the) the most recognized people of boxing and the world.

[SBleeder]

Yes. Whatever the reasons may be, at the end of the day they are still past their prime, no? If I choose to throw a ham sandwich into a sewer, I no longer have that ham sandwich, do I? Whether I chose to do it or not, I no longer have it. Get it? Mike's prime was taken from him probably through only half of the things he had a choice over anyway.

Wow, what a great analogy. Have you ever considered being a teacher?

Let me ask you this: When did Leon Spinks' prime begin, and end?

Have you or that guy cleaned out your divisions and unified the belts and been the youngest and most exciting heavyweight champions of the world? No? Didn't think so. Case closed.

Twist it however you want it. At the end of the day, it all boils down to:
1.) Tyson was in his absolute prime in 1987 and up until the Spinks fight of 1988.
2.). Tyson was far past his prime (through the reasons I listed, which do indeed include reasons he had control or choice over) when he fought Buster Douglas, and in the fights after the Spinks fight which was his last fight with Kevin Rooney.
3.) He is an ATG because he defeated everyone on the list at the time who needed to be defeated, he unified the belts, he cleaned out (and struck fear) into the heavyweight division, he was the youngest world champion on record, and is one of (if not the) the most recognized people of boxing and the world.

No, but I could have unified the titles and cleaned out the division in my prime. You'll just have to believe me. I get to decide when my prime was, after all, and even though I've never beaten a great fighter in their prime, I'm still the GOAT, since my lack of accomplishments were solely the result of being lazy in the gym.

I could have beaten Buster Douglas in my prime, too. I just didn't feel like it, and that's ok. Because I’m good enough, I’m smart enough, and dog-gone it, people like me. Heavyweight champions shouldn't have to prepare for championship fights.

Besides, 23 years old is practically senior-citizenry. How could Tyson not be past his prime after three years of pro experience?

UH-OH!!! I just pooped myself. But no problem- I'm past my prime.

For some silly reason, I always thought that a champion was supposed to work hard and keep himself together mentally. But I'm glad that that's not necessary. All we have to do is slap the phrase "past his prime" on every crappy fight a guy has and he's all of a sudden a legend.

[GymRat]

Wow, what a great analogy. Have you ever considered being a teacher?

Let me ask you this: When did Leon Spinks' prime begin, and end?



No, but I could have unified the titles and cleaned out the division in my prime. You'll just have to believe me. I get to decide when my prime was, after all, and even though I've never beaten a great fighter in their prime, I'm still the GOAT, my lack of accomplishments were solely the result of being lazy in the gym.

For some silly reason, I always thought that a champion was supposed to work hard and keep himself together mentally. But I'm glad that that's not necessary. All we have to do is slap the phrase "past his prime" on every crappy fight a guy has and he's all of a sudden a legend.

I wouldn't know when Leon Spink's prime began and ended, but I do know that probably 99% of boxers have had a prime and then a past prime era, Mike included. You not knowing that makes you look dumb, no offense.

Feel how you want to feel. Nothing you say can change history or the facts. I suppose you think Muhammad Ali was in his prime when Trevor Berbick beat him, right? Or you think that Roy Jones Jr. was in his prime when Danny Green beat him too. Or how about the guy you're arguing for: Buster Douglas. The guy trained for his fights by eating 400 pounds of cake and he's lost almost every fight he's been in. I still think it's funny that instead of responding to the facts as they've been presented to you, you choose to make up silly analogies and dodge the facts at hand, while showing yourself as a moron for not knowing that fighters have a prime and past-prime.

[SBleeder]

I wouldn't know when Leon Spink's prime began and ended, but I do know that probably 99% of boxers have had a prime and then a past prime era, Mike included. You not knowing that makes you look dumb, no offense.

Feel how you want to feel. Nothing you say can change history or the facts. I suppose you think Muhammad Ali was in his prime when Trevor Berbick beat him, right? Or you think that Roy Jones Jr. was in his prime when Danny Green beat him too. Or how about the guy you're arguing for: Buster Douglas. The guy trained for his fights by eating 400 pounds of cake and he's lost almost every fight he's been in. I still think it's funny that instead of responding to the facts as they've been presented to you, you choose to make up silly analogies and dodge the facts at hand, while showing yourself as a moron for not knowing that fighters have a prime and past-prime.

Are you really this ******ed?

Ali was 39 years old against Berbick and had fought 540 rounds. He had taken punishment from some of the hardest punchers and toughest fighters in history. He was physically torn to shreds from age and experience.

Tyson was 23 years old, had boxed only 126 rounds, and had never been hurt, nor gone through a long layoff. He was at an age when he should have been at his best. He had some adversity and folded.

One man was "past his prime", the other simply was lazy and mentally weak. THERE'S A DIFFERENCE.

[GymRat]

Are you really this ******ed?

Ali was 39 years old against Berbick and had fought 540 rounds. He had taken punishment from some of the hardest punchers and toughest fighters in history. He was physically torn to shreds from age and experience.

Tyson was 23 years old, had boxed only 126 rounds, and had never been hurt, nor gone through a long layoff. He was at an age when he should have been at his best. He had some adversity and folded.

One man was "past his prime", the other simply was lazy and mentally weak. THERE'S A DIFFERENCE.

You have now admitted that Mike Tyson was not indeed in his prime during the Buster Douglas fight. Thank you. You could have simply admitted to this from the beginning and saved us all this time and effort.

[Tyson.]

Tyson is an ATG not just heavyweight but P4P also.

Anyone who denies this is most likely a racist bigot who looks at someones personal life instead of what they achieved in the ring. Anyone who doesnt recognise his greatness should follow another sport.

[SBleeder]

You have now admitted that Mike Tyson was not indeed in his prime during the Buster Douglas fight. Thank you. You could have simply admitted to this from the beginning and saved us all this time and effort.

Fail. There's a difference between being at one's best and being in one's prime. One is within a fighter's control, the other isn't.

You want me to agree with you? Fine:

I will agree that Mike Tyson was great...

as long as he wasn't 22 years old and had Kevin Rooney with him and it hadn't been too long since D'Amato died and Don King and Robin Givens weren't in his life and he was training hard and wasn't ****ing Japanese hookers and as long as the other guy wasn't tall with a good jab like Tucker and Tillis and as long as every other possible condition was aligned in his favor... then sure, best EVER.

[GymRat]

Fail. There's a difference between being at one's best and being in one's prime. One is within a fighter's control, the other isn't.

You want me to agree with you? Fine:

I will agree that Mike Tyson was great...

as long as he wasn't 22 years old and had Kevin Rooney with him and it hadn't been too long since D'Amato died and Don King and Robin Givens weren't in his life and he was training hard and wasn't ****ing Japanese hookers and as long as the other guy wasn't tall with a good jab like Tucker and Tillis and as long as every other possible condition was aligned in his favor... then sure, best EVER.

Mike Tyson beat Tucker and Tillis. But other than that, I thank you.

[SBleeder]

Mike Tyson beat Tucker and Tillis. But other than that, I thank you.

Both guys pushed him. And neither had a lot of talent. Both took 4 rounds; Tucker did so with a broken hand.

[GymRat]

Both guys pushed him. And neither had a lot of talent. Both took 4 rounds; Tucker did so with a broken hand.

But in the end they lost and Mike won, no?