who had better handspeed- Tyson or Ali?

[Fighting Marine]

You just go out of your way to be obnoxious don't you? You immediately reverted to a single instance everyone points to of Ali throwing a fast flurry (just like they always point to Terell to illustrate his defense). Why don't you try being original and actually give some useful evidence? I was simply providing the parallel example that Tyson fans tend to point to, and despite your criticism of it being shadowboxing, he is throwing the punches with fight intensity. Personally I think Ali was probably faster which should be no surprise given his style - he threw 90% straight punches and stayed on his toes, not loading up on shots.

Your reply was silly. I gave my opinion and you acted like a little smart arse. Again, regardless of how much intensity Tyson is throwing those punches it is still shadowboxing. You are asking for useful evidence? So according to you Ali's flurry vs London should be totally discounted just because it is the example that gets posted most often? Your logic is flawed.

And I agree with you that Ali was faster and lets just end the petty little squabble.

Oh and just to add another example of Ali's speed tengoshi.

Ali vs Frazier III......watch from 2.20 - 2.40...Tyson cannot compare and albeit a past prime Ali

[Spartacus Sully]

As far as hand speed they are equal.

ali barely compares to tysons top speed while tyson barely compares to alis combo speed.

[Miburo]

And I agree with you that Ali was faster and lets just end the petty little squabble.

Right, you just completely trash me and then say "let's end this petty little squabble" like you're talking down to a child. Here's an idea - how about not.

My logic? You completely misinterpreted the purpose of my post, despite me clarifying so someone as thick headed as you could comprehend, and then falsely accuse me of discounting Ali's hand speed displayed in the London fight (something you just did in relation to Tyson incidentally) when I was merely pointing out that it contributed about as much to the dialogue as the example frequently cited for Tyson. Leaving it at the simplistic level you thought proved your point, Calzaghe is clearly the fastest ever because he could throw far quicker punches in a flurry like that than Ali or just about anybody else There is no such thing as "pure objective hand speed", it's relative to the type of shots being thrown, a point others have brought up but you have failed to address adequately and dismissed out of hand.

[Fighting Marine]

Right, you just completely trash me and then say "let's end this petty little squabble" like you're talking down to a child. Here's an idea - how about not.

My logic? You completely misinterpreted the purpose of my post, despite me clarifying so someone as thick headed as you could comprehend, and then falsely accuse me of discounting Ali's hand speed displayed in the London fight (something you just did in relation to Tyson incidentally) when I was merely pointing out that it contributed about as much to the dialogue as the example frequently cited for Tyson.

I find it quite funny that the most objective thing you have posted in this thread was a video of Mike Tyson shadow boxing. You have not given any examples of Tysons speed, in a flurry, a single punch etc

Leaving it at the simplistic level you thought proved your point, Calzaghe is clearly the fastest ever because he could throw far quicker punches in a flurry like that than Ali or just about anybody else There is no such thing as "pure objective hand speed", it's relative to the type of shots being thrown, a point others have brought up but you have failed to address adequately and dismissed out of hand.

Would you like me to provide examples of the speed of Ali's jab? or a single left hook? And please quote the post I made in which I dismissed another posters objective view on how he interprets true handspeed. If you cannot do so, than you are a proven liar.

[Fighting Marine]

As far as hand speed they are equal.

ali barely compares to tysons top speed while tyson barely compares to alis combo speed.

Yep I quite agree and Ali's jab was also faster than Tyson's.

[Miburo]

And please quote the post I made in which I dismissed another posters objective view on how he interprets true handspeed. If you cannot do so, than you are a proven liar.

Easily done, knave.

The question was who has better handspeed. Not who loaded more power, who had more power in their combos. Ali had better handspeed and that's including his power punches.

Here you discount the fact that since Tyson threw harder shots and sat down on them, which affects the speed of shots (the point being referenced), they appear slower than Ali's.

I find it quite funny that the most objective thing you have posted in this thread was a video of Mike Tyson shadow boxing. You have not given any examples of Tysons speed, in a flurry, a single punch etc

Again you prove that you missed the entire point I don't have to provide examples, because I was never defending the claim that Tyson had faster hand speed in the first place. Christ, you are absolutely brilliant

[Spartacus Sully]

Yep I quite agree and Ali's jab was also faster than Tyson's.

ali's jab was faster then ssr's too. out and back in like .34 for srr and .31 for ali.

but thats not top speed as the out is just as important as the in for speed and it makes more sense to move at a smooth average speed then as fast as possible stop then come back.

top speed is top speed at the moment of impact how fast is the fist going ali could never achieve tysons top speed because he was so fast with his combos.

to put everything into the punch makes it that much harder to bring it back. ali would throw a left hook: rotate off the left. tyson would throw a left hook: rotate off the left foot, rotate the trunk, swing back the right shoulder hurl forward the left bring up the elbow rotate the palm facing down (moving so fast that hes actually left the ground) make contact with opponets face.

while ali would be already throwing out a flury of jabs Tyson's barely even facing the correct direction but his punch was going faster at top speed then anything ali's ever thrown.

[Fighting Marine]

Easily done, knave.



Here you discount the fact that since Tyson threw harder shots and sat down on them, which affects the speed of shots (the point being referenced), they appear slower than Ali's.




Again you prove that you missed the entire point I don't have to provide examples, because I was never defending the claim that Tyson had faster hand speed in the first place. Christ, you are absolutely brilliant

Did I claim you were defending Tyson? NO. I'm asking you to provide evidence of Tyson's speed. And I never discounted the fact Tyson sat down on his shots just simply that Tysons speed could not match Ali's.

Again you are claiming to know absolutes. I never agreed to it nor denied it. Its obvious you are looking to troll so I'm placing you ignore for the simple fact I have no time for losers like you.

[Fighting Marine]

ali's jab was faster then ssr's too. out and back in like .34 for srr and .31 for ali.

but thats not top speed as the out is just as important as the in for speed and it makes more sense to move at a smooth average speed then as fast as possible stop then come back.

top speed is top speed at the moment of impact how fast is the fist going ali could never achieve tysons top speed because he was so fast with his combos.

to put everything into the punch makes it that much harder to bring it back. ali would throw a left hook: rotate off the left. tyson would throw a left hook: rotate off the left foot, rotate the trunk, swing back the right shoulder hurl forward the left bring up the elbow rotate the palm facing down (moving so fast that hes actually left the ground) make contact with opponets face.

while ali would be already throwing out a flury of jabs Tyson's barely even facing the correct direction but his punch was going faster at top speed then anything ali's ever thrown.

Great post..........And I read somewhere that the speed Ali's and SRR's jab were measured.....is that what you were referencing??? where was that from??

[Miburo]

Did I claim you were defending Tyson? NO. I'm asking you to provide evidence of Tyson's speed. And I never discounted the fact Tyson sat down on his shots just simply that Tysons speed could not match Ali's.

Again you are claiming to know absolutes. I never agreed to it nor denied it. Its obvious you are looking to troll so I'm placing you ignore for the simple fact I have no time for losers like you.

So despite claiming you acknowledge that I wasn't defending Tyson, you're holding me accountable to an expectation I never intended to address? Once again your brilliance is in full flourish That said, maybe I would've been inclined to had you not been needlessly insulting right out of the gate (though I will admit that hardcore Tyson fans who have a strong memory and have seen all his bouts will be able to point to better examples than I in any case).

Run away little boy, like the coward you are. Insulting uncivil ****s like yourself don't deserve attention in the first place. Although you won't see this, don't worry, I don't have you on ignore - I'm not a whiny *****, I'm happy to rumble anytime.