Top 10 Heavies from best to worst

[Brassangel]

This is a pretty interesting take on the rating(s) system, and systematic is a good way to go. Some things I noticed, however, which should probably be changed or reconfigured were the categories such as "Impact on the Sport" and "Quality of Opposition." Both are fairly relative, meaning they could have wildly different values depending on who is asked.

Many of these fighters, Muhammad Ali, for example, met their toughest competition when they didn't have the title. Who had a large impact on the sport is almost 100% relative, not absolute, because the impact factors in many things. Joe Louis, for example, was someone who aided in bringing heavyweight boxing to the front of all sports, while Mike Tyson almost single-handedly drove it into ground by making a mokery of it. Both had titanic impacts, with shades of positive and negative effect. Lennox Lewis, meanwhile, while a successful champion, was barely known by the general public, because he came in when the last era of "greats" were fading away. George Foreman actually didn't make a tremendous impact on the sport until he started making the Foreman Grill during his comeback. Rocky Marciano's impact was felt long after everyone realized that no one will retire as an undefeated heavyweight champion; that's a hindsight impact. Really, I think that this category in particular should be avoided, especially when it can vary by as much as 20 points.

I will post again soon, as my break is now over, and I will give more input in regards to a points system.

[-CANE-]

This is a pretty interesting take on the rating(s) system, and systematic is a good way to go. Some things I noticed, however, which should probably be changed or reconfigured were the categories such as "Impact on the Sport" and "Quality of Opposition." Both are fairly relative, meaning they could have wildly different values depending on who is asked.

Many of these fighters, Muhammad Ali, for example, met their toughest competition when they didn't have the title. Who had a large impact on the sport is almost 100% relative, not absolute, because the impact factors in many things. Joe Louis, for example, was someone who aided in bringing heavyweight boxing to the front of all sports, while Mike Tyson almost single-handedly drove it into ground by making a mokery of it. Both had titanic impacts, with shades of positive and negative effect. Lennox Lewis, meanwhile, while a successful champion, was barely known by the general public, because he came in when the last era of "greats" were fading away. George Foreman actually didn't make a tremendous impact on the sport until he started making the Foreman Grill during his comeback. Rocky Marciano's impact was felt long after everyone realized that no one will retire as an undefeated heavyweight champion; that's a hindsight impact. Really, I think that this category in particular should be avoided, especially when it can vary by as much as 20 points.

I will post again soon, as my break is now over, and I will give more input in regards to a points system.

Thanks mate, all input gratefully received, the idea of this is to get as many of us as possible to try and find a way we all agree on to come up with the greatest champions of all time. The list is in no way complete, it is a work in progress list and will probably change a few more times before it is finally finished. Then when we or I am happy with it I will then try it on some of the other weight divisions

[Brassangel]

We could approach it by their attributes as well. For example:

Out of 10 possible points in each category

Power
Speed
Agility
Chin
Stamina
Heart
Defense
TOTAL:

[Lubutheimmortal]

We could approach it by their attributes as well. For example:

Out of 10 possible points in each category

Power
Speed
Agility
Chin
Stamina
Heart
Defense
TOTAL:

Thats what I try to do with my p4p lists! Like some kind of Video game stats, for lack of a better example!

[-CANE-]

We could approach it by their attributes as well. For example:

Out of 10 possible points in each category

Power
Speed
Agility
Chin
Stamina
Heart
Defense
TOTAL:

Yeah we could but like you said earlier regarding Quality of Opposition and Impact they are subjective and everyone will have their own opinion, but I could try if you want, and also try adding what Iron Man said as well regarding youngest and oldest champs, unifying titles etc. This may take some time. When in*****g the stats on the spreadsheet I did I put in everyone's record and title fight record and then worked out percentage of wins in both categories and also percentage of wins by ko in both categories, so that would help me with the power. I could also take how many times they have been knocked down and out and by who. This is going to turn into something really big and it will be a long hard job, but it will be satisfying when it is all done.

[hhascup]

We could approach it by their attributes as well. For example:

Out of 10 possible points in each category

Power
Speed
Agility
Chin
Stamina
Heart
Defense
TOTAL:

This has been done many times in the past. It would be very hard to rate them by any standards BUT it's fun trying to do so.

[Brassangel]

That's true. Plus, this list of relative abilities could simply be a lumped category, worth a total of 70 possible points (no one will score perfectly, mind you), that is placed beside length of reign, record, KO %, etc.

Again, quality of opposition is such a relative category, along with impact, and the opposition only actually looks that good against one another. There's truly no telling how good they would have been in any other era. I also think that many of today's critics are hardcore 70's nuts, who felt that time when boxing was nationally broadcast, and made to be the biggest sport in the world. Like I said on another thread, these things have to be taken in a vacuum sometimes, without the surrounding mythical hype.

[Wiley Hyena]

This is a pretty interesting take on the rating(s) system, and systematic is a good way to go. Some things I noticed, however, which should probably be changed or reconfigured were the categories such as "Impact on the Sport" and "Quality of Opposition." Both are fairly relative, meaning they could have wildly different values depending on who is asked.

Many of these fighters, Muhammad Ali, for example, met their toughest competition when they didn't have the title. Who had a large impact on the sport is almost 100% relative, not absolute, because the impact factors in many things. Joe Louis, for example, was someone who aided in bringing heavyweight boxing to the front of all sports, while Mike Tyson almost single-handedly drove it into ground by making a mokery of it. Both had titanic impacts, with shades of positive and negative effect. Lennox Lewis, meanwhile, while a successful champion, was barely known by the general public, because he came in when the last era of "greats" were fading away. George Foreman actually didn't make a tremendous impact on the sport until he started making the Foreman Grill during his comeback. Rocky Marciano's impact was felt long after everyone realized that no one will retire as an undefeated heavyweight champion; that's a hindsight impact. Really, I think that this category in particular should be avoided, especially when it can vary by as much as 20 points.

I will post again soon, as my break is now over, and I will give more input in regards to a points system.

Brass, I would have to respectfully disagree with this when trying to rank the greatest heavies in boxing history. It's too difficult to try and form an accurate opinion of what Joe Louis would have been like in 1985. It's impossible. Boxers are different from generation to generation. Impact on the sport and quality of opposition must be considered to have a valid comparison.

[-CANE-]

Brass, I would have to respectfully disagree with this when trying to rank the greatest heavies in boxing history. It's too difficult to try and form an accurate opinion of what Joe Louis would have been like in 1985. It's impossible. Boxers are different from generation to generation. Impact on the sport and quality of opposition must be considered to have a valid comparison.

So Wiley, did you manage to check out my new list and how it has changed and how the scoring was done, want to know your opinion on this

[Wiley Hyena]

So Wiley, did you manage to check out my new list and how it has changed and how the scoring was done, want to know your opinion on this

Checking.....one moment please.