The Daily Bread Mailbag returns with Stephen "Breadman" Edwards tackling topics such as heavyweight contender Luis Ortiz, numerous mythical matchups, Stephen Fulton vs. Naoya Inoue, Demetrius Andrade, Roy Jones vs. Oleksandr Usyk, Keyshawn Davis, Frank Martin, more
During the Ortiz/Martin fight last Saturday, the camera kept showing their young children and their reactions to the action that was taking place in the ring. What are your thoughts on this? Have you ever discussed with boxers you are training whether or not they should have their child attend on fight night? Also, we’ve recently seen boxers laying hands on their opponent during the face off in two high profile fights. Specifically, where one boxer aggressively pushes the other. What are your thoughts on this? If you were the trainer of the boxer that got pushed, or if you were the one who was pushed, would you let it go? Or do you think a strong physical response is warranted? Although I don't like it, I wouldn’t mind seeing a response such as Rocky’s leg sweep against Tommy at the end of Rocky V from the boxer who was attacked. Thanks.
Bread’s Response: Man this is a great question. I have seen fighters do both. I don’t know the answer. A child seeing his father ko'd brutally is more than traumatic. But who says the fighter has to be kod. There are wins and losses in boxing.
To add on to it. From my personal observations. Kids, friends and family are the biggest distractions to boxers at fights. If you have a tight knit support group who is resourceful you can pull it off. But fighters often have to worry about how everyone is doing. Where they are sitting? How many tickets they have? Etc Etc Etc. Most times the people who are there to support the fighter, turn it around and make it about them instead of about the fighter.
I actually had an experience where a family member was banging on the ring walk out stage connected to the ring, in order to get the fighter’s attention while I was speaking to him in between rounds in the corner. I couldn’t believe it. They literally thought they were justified and doing so. The family member didn’t spend 1 day in camp with the fighter. But they inserted themselves in order to be important. They weren’t supporting they were being distracting.
It’s tough because fighters need and want support. But often times, the support becomes a distraction.
I am not a fan of pre fight scuffles. They can cost everyone a payday because if the fighters hit each other in the face, more than likely someone will get cut or get a broken hand. Fight is OFF! I’ve never had someone push or touch any of my fighters in 11 years and well over 60 professional fights as a head trainer. I’m glad they didn’t because I expect my fighter to respond, violently. I don’t want my fighter touching anyone and I don’t want anyone touching my fighter. The fighters who do that stuff know who they can get away with that stuff with.
Breadman--happy new year and thank you for all you do for boxing fans through this mailbag. I have a ton of respect for Luis Ortiz skills, heart, and determination...And his accomplishments He bit down to get that win on a night that looked like it was going to be a tough one for him. he deserves props, that said, I am worried about him fighting top guys in the division after he the two knock downs against Prince Charles and given he is 42. maybe he should fight once more get a big pay day and retire, but as someone who wants him to win in life I am wondering if his advisors should begin thinking of life after boxing. At the heavyweight level, a lot of guys have lights out life changing power and I worry for Ortiz after the knockdown by a jab. Am I making too much of what could have been a flash knock down (like when cotto knocked down clottey in MSG) what do your eyes see?
I know you are a big fan of Monster Inouye, if he beats Nonito Donaire (IF) and wants to continue to add to his legacy by moving to 122, how do you see a fight going with Stephen Fulton? is this a 50/50 fight or do you favor one over the other?
Also, I heard Fulton say in an interview that he is a big super bantamweight as well and he could eventually move up to 126. While I see someone as tall as Figueroa moving up to 126 and 130 even, i wonder how his stature in terms of arm length, leg strength and punching power project to featherweight, we know his hand speed, punch release, punch selection, fitness, stamina, foot work and ring IQ all are world class and on the level. Not that Isaac Dogboe is on Fulton's level, but i think that his stature, length, and power are not at world champion level for 126 whereas they were for 122. It is the same question i ask about Tank and Lomachenko at 140 and 147.
Bread’s Response: Stephen Fulton is a lot bigger than Monster Inoue. Sometimes the tale of the tape doesn’t exactly clarify the visual size difference. I have seen fighters the same weight with the same height and reach but when they line up in front of each other, there is a drastic difference in size. Inoue is at a size disadvantage vs Donaire. It will be even bigger vs Fulton.
I don’t know who I would favor. I think Inoue would open as a slight favorite because of his reputation. But it’s a very close fight. 122lbs is where Fulton is starting out. 122lbs is where Inoue is ending up after going through 5 divisions. The physicality will be different and whatever advantages Inoue has in power etc, may get nullified. Tough fight for Inoue. But he’s a remarkable talent so…
I can’t tell if Ortiz has slipped because when an older fighter has an off night, everyone says they slipped. But when a younger fighter has an off night, it’s just an off night. If Ortiz looks that bad again, I think we can say he slipped but right now it’s hard to tell.
Bread is out here spreading false information/phony Andrade narratives: "Andrade was the WBO champion at 154 while Canelo was the WBC champion and Canelo had no interest in fighting him". Wrong. Canelo had lost his titles to Floyd. And Andrade's sole activity as 154 WBO champ was a single defense vs his mandatory Rose while Canelo was busy facing the far more proven Lara (who Andrade wanted no part of. Andrade then pulled out of a Charlo fight, gave up his belt and went MIA while turning down other fights, but he's the avoided fighter in that scenario? lol"
But Andrade gives up his belt and Liam Smith won it and the WBO belt becomes interesting enough for him to move down in weigh to fight for it"Nope that's not the way it transpired. Canelo didn't swoop in as soon as Andrade gave up his belt, Smith was attempting his third defense as champ which is more than what One and Done Andrade did with it."
Jacobs is a little more well known and he had the GGG fight, but Andrade had a belt, the WBO belt. Canelo had the WBC, WBA and IBF. All he needed was the WBO to get the same 4 he has now at 168. He chose to fight Jacobs who was not a champion then moved up from 160. He was 1 belt away from the undisputed champion at 160;All that stood in the way was Andrade."
Wrong and wrong. First of all, little more well known? Jacobs was far more proven than Andrade's ever been, and yes he was a champ holding the IBF. And undisputed was never on the table with the IBF declaring he immediately had to come to terms with his mandatory Derev who ended up dragging his feet turning down career high money.
"He's from the same exact era as Canelo. He's 31-0. He's been in the same divisions as Canelo, held belts in those divisions and he's been on the same networks. It's at least worth mentioning that if it's not a duck, it's pretty clear Canelo doesn't want to fight him."
Yep, Andrade is from the same era as Canelo (and older) but that's where the similarities end because Andrade has never fought a single champ or ex champ in his career because he turned down the step up opportunities that came his way, unlike Canelo who fought more champs than anyone, but he's the one whose ambition is questioned? Canelo by 23 accomplished more and displayed more ambition than Andrade in his career. He had a step up fight vs Trout whereas Andrade pulled out of his vs Jermell. Canelo accepted lowball money and met Floyd's catchweight to land a fight with him, then faced high risk/low reward Lara who Andrade was still openly avoiding years later. Imagine how differently Canelo's career would have turned out if he had avoided those fights and instead adopted the attitude of Andrade who's spent the bulk of his career protecting his 0 waiting for cash out. This is what a fan had to say, he's been asked to send these to you so that you can address them, but I have the feeling he won't, so I've taken it upon myself to send his rebuttals, with out altering a thing.
I'd love to hear your thoughts on these....peace
Bread’s Response: Whoever the fan was, was right about a few details but it doesn’t change the premise of what I said. Demetrius Andrade is the one leading 154lber and 160lber that was available to fight Canelo and the fight was never made for whatever reasons. I don’t think it’s a big criminal duck. But if you look close for the last 8+ years, Andrade is the one guy who didn’t get a chance to fight Canelo that was relevant.
Yes Canelo lost his 154lb title in September of 2013. Andrade didn’t win his WBO belt until later that same year. I was off by a few months. No excuses. I made a misstatement. But I knew Canelo didn’t fully move up to middleweight until a few years later. After he lost to Floyd, he kept making fights at a 155lb catchweight which I forgot they were catchweights, I just knew he fought Angulo, Kirkland and Lara all stand out 154lbers from that era.
Angulo, Lara, Kirkland in that order were fights at 155lbs. I forgot all were non title fights, hence is why I said Canelo and Andrade were champions at the same time. Again, I just remembered him fighting those 3 after the Floyd Mayweather loss. I have said several times the Lara fight was such a great legacy move. Canelo did NOT have to take that fight! I’m not suggesting he ducked Andrade right there. But I keep hearing that Andrade can’t fight. And Andrade is not a worthy opponent. But what made Angulo and Kirkland more worthy than Andrade? I’m not an advocate for Demetrius Andrade. I just don’t get what makes Kirkland and Angulo more worthy opponents.
Again, Canelo is the boss, so at that moment, he doesn’t have to fight Andrade. So then Canelo fights Cotto for the lineal title at middleweight at a catchweight. No duck there. Cotto has the lineal title so anyone in their right mind would choose Cotto over Andrade. I surely would. But then Canelo defends against Amir Khan again at 155lbs. Again that’s a money fight and I don’t blame Canelo. But don’t tell me Andrade doesn’t deserve a shot at Canelo more than Amir Khan did who never won a title at 147lbs or 154lbs and got a shot at the lineal middleweight title. The excuse that Andrade didn’t deserve a shot went out the window with the Khan fight. And I will go on record to say I would have taken the Khan fight too. Boxing is about money and legacy. Both should be comingled.
So Canelo is known to have struggled to make weight. So after the Khan fight he moved back down to 154 to fight Liam Smith for the WBO belt. In 2016 it didn’t seem like Andrade was in a good place business wise. Someone from his team screwed up the Charlo title defense and he was still paying for business blunders. But that has nothing to do with Canelo. Don’t tell me Canelo was punishing Andrade for not fighting Charlo. Jermell Charlo was a leading contender for the WBC also and he never got the Canelo fight. Jermell wanted both Andrade and Canelo at that time. If you remember he was highly ranked for the WBC belt and when he did fight for a title, it was the vacant WBC title. Charlo has been on record to say Golden Boy kept Canelo away from him. For clarity, Jermell has more fights than his brother, turned pro earlier and was ranked before him, so he could’ve got a title shot.
I never brought either Charlo, Hurd, Williams or Harrison up as misses because in all honestly although they are the same age as Canelo, but he was moved faster than them and he moved up before they were relevant enough. He was moved at the same time the older more established 154lbers were in Trout, Kirkland, Angulo, Lara and guess who Andrade. He fought all of the latter, except Andrade. So my comments stands. If Liam Smith can get the fight, Andrade can. Again, I never use the term that a fighter doesn’t deserve this or that. It’s really up to A sides or networks to want to put certain fighters in certain positions. So after Canelo fights Liam Smith at 154lbs, he fights Julio Cesar Chavez Jr at 164lbs at another catchweight fight. I’m not even mad at him for that fight. Canelo mixes his money fights in well with his legacy fights. But again don’t tell me Andrade doesn’t deserve a shot more than Chavez Jr. who is one of the most privileged fighters in history.
After Chavez Jr, Canelo is officially a 160lber and he fights the big dog, GGG in 2017. I know the WBC, WBA and IBF belts were on the line. So again I made a mistake with my next comment. I said that Canelo chose to fight Jacobs who didn’t have a belt but when he could’ve fought Andrade for the WBO belt. The truth is Jacobs had just won the vacant IBF belt that was vacated….. I had totally forgot the IBF belt wasn’t on the line when Canelo didn’t pay sanctioning fees in the GGG rematch in 2018. That was weird because he paid the sanctioning fees of the IBF when he fought Jacobs in 2019. I’m not sure what happened or why…. But nevertheless Andrade had the WBO belt and he never got a shot at Canelo who had 3 belts. The only reason why Canelo vs Jacobs was a unification was Canelo didn’t pay sanctioning fees and the belt became vacant and he doubled back and picked it up. So the person was being a WORDSMITH to prove a point when knows darn well what really happened. I just stated it in specific detail so he can’t be a WORDSMITH anymore to justify why Andrade didn’t get a shot when he was available for a huge unification/undisputed fight. The undisputed title became a thing at 168lb but Canelo was one fight away from it at 160 also....
In between GGG and Jacobs, Canelo tested the water at 168 vs Rocky Fielding. Andrade again was available but again I get Canelo wanted to test the bigger weights. So in 2019 Canelo fights Jacobs at 160 and he leaves 160 for good with one belt to go for the undisputed title. Andrade holds that one belt, the WBO. Andrade was with Matchroom on DAZN so there was no crossing the street….
At this current moment it’s not a duck because they aren’t in the same division. I’m not sure at any specific point it was a criminal duck. But don’t tell me Andrade is not a good enough fighter or is not worthy enough to fight Canelo Alvarez when Rocky Fielding, Alfredo Angulo, James Kirkland, Julio Cesar Chavez Jr, Amir Khan and Liam Smith got the fight when Andrade was a viable undefeated belt holder and one except Liam Smith fit those credentials. And don’t tell me he couldn’t have fought Andrade in 2019 when Danny Jacobs got the shot by winning a belt Canelo had just indirectly vacated when he decided to not pay sanctioning fees and then decided to pay them when he fought Jacobs.
I hope I was clear and more direct with my comment. The devil is in detail and I would never shy away from a fan or anyone else correcting me. But with my rebuttal there is nothing to correct and I don’t understand why people get so upset about something that’s clear. Canelo’s legacy won’t be affected if he doesn’t fight Andrade. Just like Oscar’s wasn’t when he didn’t fight Winky Wright or Vernon Forest. But the truth is Andrade was worthy and available for a shot at the great Canelo Alvarez and for whatever reasons (Canelo would be the favorite if they fought) the fight hasn’t happened, and I can’t believe that it’s Andrade’s fault. Most times when a fight doesn’t happen it’s the A sides responsibility. Now, it doesn’t matter because Canelo is a 168lber. No one will care. I was just pointing out, Andrade is the one guy that got left on the table.
Hi Bread - a huge thank you from a longtime 'fan' for all the outstanding analysis. I just wanted to point out something about boxing vs mma. Their stances are very different. They have to be. An mma fighter isn't just defending against punches, he has to guard against kicks. This means, for example, that he has to be ready at all times to check low leg kicks. If you watch the two different styles of fighting, once you know what you are looking for, you will see that the differences is marked, even for mma fighters who are known for their ability to strike with their fists. This difference means that mma fighters who move into the boxing ring have to try to unlearn something pretty fundamental and that is a hard thing to do, especially if you don't have a lot of time to do it. It would be exactly the same if a boxer were to have a quick camp then fight in mma, Even if we ignore the risk of him being taken down, he would likely get his legs kicked so badly he would be disabled. Two very different sports.
Bread’s Response: I agree 100%. I don’t even like the comparisons. I’ve had MMA fighters ask me to hit pads with them as far as boxing. But I always remind them that their mind sets will be different in an MMA fight because even when they are doing stand up, they still have to worry about take downs, kicks etc. They also have to defend their entire bodies where as boxers only have to defend their upper body. I don’t like the comparisons. I don’t like the rivalry. I don’t even want to be part of it. It’s ridiculous. Both may be combat sports but they are way too different.
Hey Bread, I wanted to get your opinion on Luis Ortiz. This weekend the entire FOX heavyweight card was entertaining but I feel like Ortiz goes largely unmentioned among the top 5 heavyweights. Ortiz’s only losses both came to Wilder and even if he is really 60 years old he carries his power late into fights. Charles Martin came to win and he actually looked better than I have ever seen him but Ortiz’s one- punch power eventually caught him and stopped him . I wanted to get your thoughts on him and if you saw any slippage in punch resistance or with his legs.
Also, I was wondering if you could explain how a fighter’s purse is broken down percentage wise specifically what percentage does a trainer usually get , cutman, 2nd cornerman etc . I also wanted to get your thoughts on Al Haymon being an advisor and a promoter and whether that is a conflict in interests for his fighters in your opinion. Finally, if you could be ringside for only one mythical matchup from all of the matchups that have been submitted which would you choose to see?
Take Care, Aaron from Cleveland
Bread’s Response: Luis Ortiz is a really good fighter. This is a weak era for heavyweights but it’s top heavy. I think Ortiz is top 5 and he has a chance to beat everyone except Tyson Fury. People attack his resume but all resumes can be attacked. The truth is as far as who’s fought who Anthony Joshua has the best resume but he isn’t the best fighter. Joshua has fought Whyte (undefeated), Parker (undefeated), Klitschko, Ruiz 2x, Usyk (undefeated), Breazeale (undefeated), Martin (undefeated ) who just gave Ortiz life and death. Other than Joshua, they all have holes in their resumes.
As for the eye ball test, I think Ortiz is very, very dangerous. He may have slipped....I dont know.... Ask me that after his next fight so I can gauge better.
Fighter’s Purse: Head Trainer 10% but it varies on the purse and how long the head trainer has been the head trainer. But 10% is the standard for a top guy.
Assistant Trainer: 5% or often a flat rate.
Cutman:2%-3% or a flat rate for larger purses over 250k
Strength & Conditioning Coach: weekly pay or an agreed upon flat rate.
Manager or Advisor: Can be anywhere from 5%-33%. 40% if they agree to pay the rest of the team.
I’m glad you asked this and I want to point something out. There is a growing trend where fighters are finding ways to save money and not pay their trainers correctly. There are fighters out here who pay their trainers late. When I say late, I mean 3 or 4 weeks after the fight. A few days after the fight is no biggie but actually the team should be paid on the night of the fight just like the fighter.
So trainers are going into fights not knowing what they are getting paid. Their pay is getting cut depending on the purse size. After a certain amount they don’t get a percentage anymore. I get a trainer not getting 10% if he comes on after the fighter is already established. But if the trainer was with fighter early or before he became a 6 figure fighter, why is it so imperative to cut the trainer’s purse? They can save money in a dozen ways, yet the trainer is targeted.
The trainer should be the last person’s purse the fighter should want to cut. It’s the person who spends the most time with him hour for hour and it’s the person who has his life in his hands. And if you are going to cut the trainer’s purse, tell him before camp starts and allow him to make the decision if he still wants to work. It’s dishonorable to allow a trainer to go all the way through camp. He knows the fighter is making 1M for the first time. So he thinks he’s making 100k because he’s been taking 10% the whole career. And then after the fight he gets told he’s only making 50K. But often times trainers have to take this because they don’t have much else going on. It’s not something that gets talked about openly but it’s happening and it’s not a good thing. This is a business and the most important person on the team besides the fighter shouldn’t be shortchanged or disrespected.
One MYTHICAL MATCHUP I would have to attend. Sugar Ray Leonard vs Floyd Mayweather
I have a mythical matchup which I haven't heard before, which would be great to get your opinion on. Roy vs Usyk at Cruiserweight, I know Roy never fought at cruiser, but if you were to interpolate his performances between heavy and light heavy, who you got? For me this would be really intriguing. On a separate question, there's a bookie who's quoting 6/1 on Keyshawn Davis to win a legit world title by Jan 2024 (2 years from now). Based on his talent, the way his promoters typically match their fighters and the depth in and around lightweight, would you say that's a good bet?
Bread’s Response: I think Usyk is too big for Roy.
I would take that bet on Keyshawn Davis. He’s the real deal and I would favor him over just about half of the top 20 right now. The titles will be broken up by 2024 and he should be able to grab one. The biggest issue for Davis will be Shakur Stevenson who is older than him and moving up. Stevenson and Davis are friends and Stevenson is huge for 130lbs. Someone will have to figure out how they will allow them two to co exist. Stevenson is a killer and he wants to fight everyone. I don’t know Davis’s personality but he seems like one too. Other than that Davis is on the fast track. He’s that good.
Hi Bread, hope all is well. I was thinking about top 5 favorite fighters of all time. After Ali, Pacquiao, Jones Jr I got into some fantasy picks like Edwin Valero, I asked myself how good could he have really been? Then I said "I can't not have a Mexican". So because I was born in '80 and am a huge fan, but partially ignorant of many of the greats that came before I started watching boxing around the mid 90's. I gotta ask...Does De La Hoya have an argument as the best Mexican Fighter of all time? Over Chavez Sr., Sanchez or Lopez or even Alvarez.
Now Alvarez is my current favorite fighter. He was my number 1 way back, then he wasn't for a while when I thought he got too routine and now I love him again. Now I know that Oscar is technically American but that come-ahead So-Cal fighting style is so sizzling & simple to me (Oxnard. Think Vargas, Garcia) that I rate him real high. For the record, Canelo already passes him in my mind, after he retires. I'm letting his body of work play out. If Canelo wins at Cruiser, and then possibly Heavyweight then we're talking Greatest of All weight Divisions ever. Right? RIGHT???
What do you think man?
Bread’s Response: De La Hoya is American and he won a Gold Medal for the USA. I’m not sure if he would be considered a top Mexican fighter ever. He’s Mexican American. I don’t want to speak for him but I remember hardcore Mexicans not liking him when he fought because of this. I think we are jumping the gun on Alvarez. He has to win the Cruiserweight and heavyweight titles first before we say that. However I do rate Alvarez high. If you haven’t watched Chavez Sr. and Sal Sanchez I suggest you do so. I think Alvarez is ascending but I don’t know if he’s better than them two just yet.
Would like to get your thoughts on LW contender Frank Martin . He looks great in every fight so far . Does he pass your eyeball test . He seems like the real deal to me . I would love to see him fight Tank Davis . And I have been wanting to ask you, if you have ever mixed it up with any elite fighters . I see you doing pad work , have any fighters ever slipped up and hit you , and if so what did it feel like. Also if Jerry Quarry were fighting today, he would be perfect for CW Division . He fought all the big name heavyweights in the 70's era . How would a prime Jerry Quarry do today.
Thank You, J.B.
Bread’s Response: Frank Martin looks good. I also like that he’s with Derrick James. Let me explain. Derrick James’s top gun is Errol Spence. Spence is a hard nosed southpaw, who is a pressure technician. So Frank Martin is of that same exact cloth, only he’s a lightweight. It’s an easier transition for a trainer when he can mold fighters who have the same traits as his first top guy. Look at Angelo Dundee. Ali was his guy. His next top guy was Ray Leonard. Watch how Ray Leonard fought when he was young.
Look at Emanuel Steward. Tommy Hearns is his top dog. So he molds Milton McCrory, Steve McCrory, Geradl McClellan, Jimmy Paul etc all after the tall stalking Hearns.
I think Martin is in good hands. I think Martin looks good but I have to see how he performs as he moves up. Martin is solid but I’m not sure if he’s as naturally talented as Davis, Lopez, Haney and the rest of the young crop around the weight. Let me see more so I can answer.
By Mixed it up with any elite fighters….do you mean spar or hit pads. Yes to both but I’m not going to name drop. It’s just sparring. Yes I have had guys hit me while holding the pads. I’m not sure if it was on purpose or not. Each time I ate the shot. I have a big hard head and I can take a punch. It didn’t feel good or bad. It’s part of the game and you just keep working. You don’t think of it in terms of feeling good or bad.
Jerry Quarry would be a major player at Cruiserweight today. He was very, very, very good. He fought in a Golden Era and he has some very good wins. He held his own in the late 60s and 70s and no one did him any favors.
Assalaam alaykum Mr. Edwards,
I had a question based on the notion that I believe you popularized of better vs greater. I asked you your opinion of the very best performance/boxer in a championship fight at each of the current weight classes. But I asked during a busy week in boxing, when you had a lot of better questions from other fans that were specific to that week's fights. My list of the best night at each current weight class follows, but I'm much more interested in yours.
I'd really like to know if you think of a different boxer on a specific night who you believe could beat the man I've listed.• minimumweight - Finito Lopez on August 23, 1997 (vs Sanchez) or maybe Chocolatito Gonzales on September 15, 2008 (vs Niida, his first title win)• light flyweight - Chocolatito Gonzales on November 17, 2012 (first Estrada fight)• flyweight - Jimmy Wilde on November 16, 1914 (vs Symonds) or on December 18, 1916 (vs Young Zulu Kid)• super flyweight - Khaosai Galaxy on November 1, 1986 (vs Contreras)• bantamweight - Eder Jofre on April 4, 1963 (vs Aoki)• super bantamweight - Wilfredo Gomez on October 28, 1978 (vs Zarate) maybe Rigo on April 13, 2013 (vs Donaire)• featherweight - Willie Pep on June 7, 1946 (third Bartolo fight, when Pep broke his jaw)• super featherweight - Alexis Arguello on July 8, 1979 (vs Bazooka Limon)• lightweight - Roberto Duran on January 21, 1978 (vs de Jesus); or maybe Julio Cesar Chavez on November 21, 1987 (vs Rosario)• super lightweight - Aaron Pryor on August 2, 1980 (vs Cervantes) or maybe Kostya Tszyu on November 3, 2001 (vs Judah)• welterweight - Sugar Ray Robinson on March 4, 1946 (vs Angott) OR on July 11, 1949 (vs Gavilan)• super welterweight - Thomas Hearns on June 15, 1984 (vs Duran) or either of Sugar Ray Robinson's welterweight nights noted above• middleweight - Sugar Ray Robinson on February 14, 1951 (the Massacre) • super middleweight - Roy Jones Jr on November 18, 1994 (vs Toney)• light heavyweight - Ezzard Charles on January 13, 1948 (third Moore fight)• cruiserweight - Evander Holyfield on April 9, 1988 (vs De Leon); but I think there's a good chance that Oleksandr Usyk on July 21, 2018 (vs Gassiev) and Rocky Marciano on May 15, 2953 (Walcott rematch) would beat The Real Deal in '88.• heavyweight - Muhammad Ali on November 13, 1966 (vs Williams); I'd also put Joe Louis on June 22, 1938 (Schmeling rematch).Sorry to resubmit this question, but your response to my more recent email has me hungry for more of your knowledge of boxing history. If you don't publish this go around, I'll be sure to keep my emails short (I usually do try, I know it's your preference).
As always, peace to you and yours and thank you for everything you do for boxing.
Ma salaam, John
Bread’s Response: Great Question. I don’t remember this one but let me try to take a stab.
Strawweight: Ricardo Lopez is the most consistent fighter I have ever studied on film. There are literally 20 fights you can pick from with him. He never has an off night. So if you want to pick the Sanchez fight that’s cool. But that was towards the end of his reign at 105Lbs. I like his fight vs Ala Villamor. My goodness he was PERFECT. I agree Choc vs Niida was also ONE of those nights but give me Lopez as the most unbeatable night at 105.
Junior Flyweight: Choc had a tough night vs Estrada in that 1st fight. He won but I don’t feel like he was unbeatable in that performance. If you ask me the BEST performance I have seen at that weight. I will say Michael Carbajal winning the title vs Mungchai Kittikasem. Carbajal scored 4 knockdowns in a brutal punching performance.
Flyweight: I didn’t see Jimmy Wilde and I haven’t had a chance to study him to the extent to put him on a list that I have to submit in 2 days. How about we go with Mark Johnson vs Arthur Johnson. Too Sharp was ridiculous that night. I don’t like to pick 1st rd kos but he was ON. Too Sharp deserves some love.
Super Flyweight: Johnny Tapia vs Danny Romero.
Bantamweight: We agree on Jofre but I like his performance vs Jose Medal better
Super Bantamweight: Gomez vs Zarate is a safe bet. Rigo vs Nonito was as good as it gets. But Barrera vs Morales1. Barrera’s performance. Forget the official result, Barrera won that fight. We was a monster in that fight and I don’t know if Gomez or Rigo could have beaten him. He was bigger than both and had a better chin.
Featherweight: Pep vs SaddlerII. Pep was unbelievable that night. Salvador Sanchez vs Wilfredo Gomez is on par.
Super Featherweight: Floyd Maweather vs Diego Corrales. People forget how good Mayweather was that night. Not sure if anyone at 130lbs can beat him on that night. Arguello destroyed Bazooka Limon and he’s on par.
Lightweight: Everyone picks Duran over DeJesus 3 because it was a unification but he was better in fight 2 or his fight with Hector Thompson. By 1978 weight was becoming an issue. Chavez was just as good as Duran vs Rosario. And Pernell Whitaker was just as good as both vs Greg Haugen.
Junior Welterweight: Aaron Pryor vs Alexis Arguello 1. Also put Oscar De La Hoya vs Chavez 1 in there. People overlook that performance because Chavez was past it. But look at Oscar’s body and reaction time. Oscar was a legit 5’10 and he went on to carry 154 well. I’m not sure if any fighter at 140lbs would have been physical enough to beat him in the form he was in that night.
Welterweight: to my knowledge there isn’t enough footage of Robinson vs Angott in 1946. There is some earlier footage of Robinson at 147….. My grandfather attended Robinson vs Gavilan. I wish I saw it but I didn’t. So if I go by what I saw I would say Leonard vs Hearns1. Ray Leonard was so good and calculated on that night, he beat the most difficult challenge in the history of the division. He did it with patience, IQ and remarkable killer instincts.
Junior Middleweight: Again Ray Robinson has so many performances between 147 and 154 that he deserves mention. But for official fights at the limit Hearns vs Duran is the fight.
Middleweight: Robinson’s performance vs Lamotta in the massacre was a great win but I don’t think it was his best performance. Lamotta outjabbed him for too many spots. Robinson was just Robinson. He was more destructive vs Rocky Graziano in 1952. Monzon was just as good vs Benvenuti in their 1st fight. But I have to mention Bernard Hopkins vs Felix Trinidad. For that one night I’m not sure if anyone can beat Hopkins. He was PERFECTO.
Super Middleweight: Roy Jones vs James Toney
Light heavyweight: You picked Ezzard Charles over Archie Moore. But it’s not on video and it wasn’t for a title….So my pick will be Michael Spinks vs Dwight Qawi.
Cruiser weight: Evander Holyfield vs Dwight Qawi 2. In the 1st fight Holyfield was a puppy. In the rematch he was a big dog in his physical prime. No one beats him on that night in 1988. He destroyed Qawi in the rematch.
Heavyweight: You picked the right fights. Ali vs Williams. Louis vs Schmeling 2. But listen, throw in Holmes vs Cooney. Holmes was $ that night and would’ve been a rough out on everyone no matter the era.
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