By Stephen "Breadman" Edwards
The Daily Bread mailbag is back, with Stephen 'Breadman' Edwards discussing Julio Cesar Chavez Sr., Adrien Broner vs. Shawn Porter, Errol Spence, and more.
How's it going Breadman, I love it that you have Julio Cesar Chavez and Salvador Sanchez on the list. They were both machines and great technicians in the prime. So I have a question regarding these two fighters. If Sanchez had never past away, who do you think would have won in a fight between the two. I know Sanchez was a featherweight fighter at the time of his death and If I'm correct Chavez won his first title in the junior lightweight division. So if Sanchez didn’t past away he would have easily been in the same division as Chavez was when he was coming up. So I’d love to read your analysis on who you think would win and why. Thanks Breadman keep up the great work, love your reads.
A Big Fan
Bread’s Response: Man tough question. Here is the thing. I assume Sanchez was at his peak when he died in 1982. I don’t know for sure because he was only 23 but he was so dam good and he already had 46 fights it’s hard for me to assume he could get too much better although it’s possible. Chavez won his first title in 1984 but he wasn’t the machine we saw from 87-91. I thought he peaked out at lightweight.
I have studied both a great deal because I am intrigued with the Mexican style and I try to incorporate that with the urban style. So if the fight would have happened at 130 I think Sanchez would have been a little too advanced. Chavez was slightly green back then. I don’t know how Sanchez would have looked over 130, he had a slight body frame so it’s hard to tell.
I actually asked Juan Laporte the same question last year at the Ring 8 meeting up in New York. He fought and loss to both fighters. He said Sanchez was a little better but Chavez was stronger. He fought Sanchez at 126 at his peak, he fought Chavez at 130 while great but a little green. Now the Chavez that fought Edwin Rosario in 1987 I have no idea who wins. That Chavez was as good as Roberto Duran.
Hi Bread,
What did you think of this fight?
I absolutely loved it.
Precision power boxing at its best, shame people booed, I just don't get it.
Walters had such a weight advantage, he really needs to move on up 2 divisions.
Thx, Craig.
Bread’s Response: I thought Walters turned back a determined real contender. That was no showcase fight. Walters needs to work on some things but he’s top 20 p4p in the world right now.
I think Errol Spence has clearly proven himself to be the best US Olympian from the 2012 team and he looked good in beating the Canadian kid. But what has he done for Floyd to just give him a shot at one of his vacant belts. I’m looking at his record and the kid has not fought one fighter in the top 15. How do you get in position to fight for a vacant belt and not beat one fighter in the top 15? If he does get a shot at one of Floyd’s belts how do you think he fares against Khan, Broner, Porter, Brook and Thurman?
Bread’s Response: Errol Spence was showcased in front of a nation wide audience. They just needed to see him and they did. From that perspective it doesn’t matter if Phil Lo Greco your Canadian kid reference is not a world beater. Spence’s talent is evident.
Now here is the tricky part. Spence has not fought or beat a top 15 fighter. And he probably has not accomplished enough to fight for a world title. And It’s obvious the kid is in favor with Floyd Mayweather….
But that doesn’t mean he can’t beat the guys you named. There is a difference in accomplishments and who will win head to head. I think Spence knocks Khan out right now. Khan simply can’t fight when you invade his space and Spence would run him out of the ring. Spence is too active and too strong for Broner. Believe it or not I would also favor him to beat Porter. That would be a tremendous fight but I just think Spence is too sharp and he wouldn’t put his hands in his pocket like Broner did when Shawn attacks.
Kell Brook is a little too advanced and too developed. Spence needs to stay away from Brook at this moment. And I’m back and forth with Spence vs Thurman. Right now let’s just say it’s a 50/50 fight. I see things in both guys that the other would exploit big time. That’s a great fight.
I have a few comments about Porter vs Broner. Here goes. Is it me or does Porter’s dad seem like a dictator. I’ve been a around the guy and he really talks down to Shawn in public. From my research everything Broner said at the press conference was the truth. He also won’t let his son have an interview by himself, he’s a bigger camera whore than Sam Watson. What did you think of Broner’s terrible performance. Do you think he needs a new coach. Broner seemed like he was special early on but this performance was dreadful.
Bread’s Response: I’m never going to comment on the dynamics of a father son personal relationship.
What Broner said at the press conference may or may not have been true but he didn’t back it up with a good performance. I agree with you, Broner’s performance was lackluster. It’s one thing to just not be better than your opponent. But it’s something different to fight a poor fight. Broner fought a poor fight.
You can clearly see Broner was the more talented fighter. But just because you look better than your opponent it doesn’t mean you can beat them. Broner has cheated the grind far too long and now he’s getting embarrassed with defeat.
Broner didn’t use his jab nearly enough. Porter bit everytime Broner jabbed. Meaning he made an extra move to avoid Broner’s jab. Broner could have set traps for Porter because of that and more importantly wore out Shawn’s legs because he was forcing him to make that extra move. Instead Broner looked to counter Porter with a check hook or uppercut all night. And it’s difficult to counter more than one punch. So he made it easy on Porter. Porter jumped in and threw more than one punch, which forced Broner to tie up, push Shawn off and attempt to restart over and over.
Broner doesn’t need a new coach. He needs to listen. He needs to mature. He had the best fighter in the world giving him all of his resources. Floyd was acting as a coach for Broner. On top of that he has his long time coach Mike Stafford. I picked Broner to win and I don’t mind saying I was wrong. The kid just didn’t deliver. Everything was in his favor and he still didn’t come through. This loss was on him not the coach.
I’m glad you brought up early on that Broner looked special. He did. But who did he beat for his title a 130? Yes I forget too. He did beat Antonio Demarco for his title at 135 and Demarco is a solid fighter but far from special. That was his best victory. He beat Paulie Malignaggi in a competitive fight at 147 but he didn’t set the world on fire. Broner just won against Paulie and that alarmed some people.
Then there was the Maidana loss. No shame in that, Maidana can fight. But if you research only 3 fighters in history have won the 130lb title and then won the 147lb title. Oscar De La Hoya, Floyd Mayweather and Manny Pacquiao. Broner seemed to be moving faster than those guys. And we can agree he’s not as good as any of them. So maybe we set our expectations too high for Broner because being a 3 division champ on paper at 23 is special but if you look at his resume piece by piece you don’t see special. Broner is still a supreme talent but the masses were expecting another Floyd Mayweather. I have a hunch we will see more of a Hector Camacho or Zab Judah.
Shawn Porter won the fight but he just seems so sloppy. He doesn’t seem like a star. He seems there for the taking but Broner just couldn’t do anything. What was odd to me was Broner looked bigger when they got in the ring. The catchweight didn’t affect the outcome.
Bread’s Response: The catchweight excuse only gets used when the B side fighter loses. In this case the B side fighter won…..
Big props to Shawn Porter he won the fight despite giving in to the catchweight demands.
Here is the thing about Shawn that only Floyd Mayweather seemed to understand and not Adrien Broner. If you listen to Floyd’s comments he knew Porter would be tough and he tried to warn Broner. But it seems that a lot of the urban mentality classifies Shawn as corny because he doesn’t wear a bunch of chains or dress in the latest Neiman Marcus fashion. That has nothing to do with how well someone can fight. I know lots of dudes who are not part of the “in crowd” who can throw down. I know plenty of dudes who are in the “in crowd” who can’t fight. Shawn has star potential he just won’t appeal to the same people that Broner does. I give Shawn a lot of props for being himself, especially in this era.
As for his fighting style, Porter is not what you call a smooth operator. He doesn’t put his pressure on like say a Roman Gonzales or Julio Chavez Sr. When he’s in box mode he doesn’t look like Ray Robinson. I get that. In all honesty he makes lots of mistakes. But the kid works his ass off, he’s true to himself and he never stops trying. His style does not have visual appeal to most but it’s effective. Sometimes the results are more important than the look. Gene Fulmer and Dick Tiger weren’t always visually appealing either but both made it to the Hall of Fame. Nobody has an easy time with Porter.
Been reading you since around 2009-2010 and I'm a big fan of your knowledge of the sport. Keep doing your thing.
This is a short story of the downfall of Broner, from what I've seen up close and from a distance the last 3 years. Broner was and still is one of my favorite fighters, but I think being accepted as a C-list celebrity by the urban crowd has attributed to his decline as a fighter. Me and a couple homies of mine, who at the time were just casual boxing fans (I've since converted one of them to one of us and the other one is close), went to the Broner fight in AC against Antonio Demarco. They were pumped to see him live after I showed them video of the whole "Can Man" routine. After he destroyed Demarco, we ran into Broner and his camp in the hotel and at the craps table in Caesar’s. We were all so surprised at how cool Broner was. He had a fun type of swag, but he wasn’t really cocky or anything. His personality was like that of your little brother who just got laid for the 1st time, and he just doesn’t know how to contain himself with enthusiasm afterwards. He was charismatic, funny, and his boastful cockiness appeared all in good fun.
I saw him again at the beginning of the next year when me and a couple buddies went to the Lamont Peterson-Kendall Holt fight in DC. In just a few months’ time, I noticed a significant change in him. He was a little less approachable, a little cockier, and way flashier in his appearance. That’s a little normal when you’re young and you start getting money, so I didn’t think too much of it. It wasn’t until I saw him in the VIP section at a concert back home in Bmore, in August 2013, when I realized that he wasn’t going to stay at the elite level for too much longer. He was fat (at least 180 pounds), he was drinking liquor like a fish, and he just seemed too eager to want to impress everybody in the VIP section. He got upset when a few of the ladies didn’t know who he was and didn’t give him any rap. The funny and charismatic guy that I met less than a year from then was gone and he was replaced with a guy walking around with an “I’m The Man” persona.
His next fight after the concert was the Maidana fight and we all know how that played out. What I paid attention to the most in that fight was how he treated Mike Stafford in the corner, while he was trying to give him instruction. Even Floyd, who is arguably the best fighter of the last 20 years, didn’t treat his father like that during the Pac fight when Sr. was giving him the blues in the corner while he was comfortably ahead. Since the Maidana fight didn’t do it, hopefully this loss against Shawn Porter humbles Broner a little and lets him know that he has to behave like a fighter in and out of the gym to be elite. He can’t be drinking and partying and think that that lifestyle wasn’t going to have an effect on how he performs in the ring. Some things that Broner needs to work one are his transition from offense to defense and his activity level. He has too many stretches during rounds where he is inactive and just waiting to throw punches. During his fight against Emmanuel Taylor, he was losing rounds because of activity a lot of times.
Lemieux-N’dam definitely takes the cake on the fight of the weekend. It’s a shame that we had so many fight cards this weekend and so few people actually watched this card in The States. I’m in 2 different boxing groups on Facebook, with over 1000 people in each, and not a peep about this card. Their loss. N’Dam was like the damn terminator. He just kept getting back up from the knockdowns when I was sure he wasn’t going to get up anymore. I want to see Lemieux get some more rounds before Oscar feeds him to GGG. But he does have that eraser so you never know.
Keep an eye on Baltimore native Gervota“Tank” Davis. I’ve been watching him since he was an amateur and he is definitely the goods.
Ghost, Baltimore
Bread’s Response: Thanks for following bro.
I actually trained a boxer who fought on the Broner vs DeMarco undercard. I remember that night vividly. I don’t want to come down too hard on Broner. But it’s alarming to me that this kid is 5’7 and he jumped 4 weight classes in under 2 years. And yes you’re right he gets way too heavy in between fights. Adrien Broner simply Cheats the Grind.
Some guys think they can train hard when they have a fight scheduled and shake off the weight according to the fight date. But as you pointed out it’s the lifestyle. There are toxins in your body that you accumulate when you eat and drink whatever you want. And drinking hard alcohol is the worst habit a fighter can indulge in. I actually stopped boxing because of drinking. Because I knew it would compromise my ability to take a punch.
So Broner is a drinker, sexer and a guy who balloons up in weight between fights. Rumored to get 40lbs over the fight weight. I wouldn’t be surprised if Broner peaked back in the DeMarco fight at 23 years old.
Floyd Mayweather seems to have a switch. He may be flashy outside of the ring but in the corner he’s a consummate boxer. He looks his trainer in the eye, he shuts up and he’s completely humble. In Broner’s most trying time he talked while his corner was talking and it was a sign of panic in my opinion. He was more calm and relaxed against Porter. He just didn’t perform. Here is the thing that I hope Adrien realizes. His personality and comments get people to tune into to his fights. They expect greatness. And when he underperforms it’s the most counterproductive thing he can possibly do. It’s not just that he loss, it’s how he loss. I really like Broner and I hope he comes out of this but I’m not sure if he will.
I picked Lemieux to beat N dam and I also expected a great fight. It surpassed my expectations. I usually go with the boxer in those types of fights but for some reason N dam is easy to hit. You can always jump in and catch him and it’s not hard to put him on the ropes. Maybe that’s why he uses his legs as his defensesbecause he doesn’t have great defensive eyes where he can sort of sit in the box and slip shots. Whatever the case may be he has the best recuperative skills I have ever seen. Yes I said that. I have never seen a fighter get hit so clean and so often, look to be clinically concussed then moments later be able to function and not be stopped. I can’t believe the heart and recuperative powers of that kid. I hope he’s not permanently damaged. He took a terrible beating.
I can’t believe Lemieux is the same guy who loss back to back fights to Juan Rubio and Joachim Alcine. His stamina and staying power has seemed to improve. He’s explosive with both hands and he’s fast. He makes for great TV. But GGG ruins him if he doesn’t land a hail mary. Usually the relaxed pressure of a guy like GGG takes apart the big frantic puncher. See Mike McCallum vs Julian Jackson, Marvin Hagler vs John Mugabi and Julio Cesar Chavez vs Edwin Rosario.
I’ve seen Gervonta Davis the kid looks good but it’s early bro. I’m never too fast to anoint these young kids when they are feasting on turkey sandwiches. Hit me up when he’s 17 or 18-0. One thing I observed. He seems to be really thick for his height and weight division. I hope he doesn’t get too heavy too fast. He has the build of a kid who carries a lot of weight but shouldn’t jump too many divisions.
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