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Old 01-23-2018, 08:53 AM #1
Mr Objecitivity Mr Objecitivity is offline
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Great post - Boxing Goat 
Default Define common boxing terms / words such as bums, journeymen and etc

So here are some common boxing terminology that can be written in a boxing dictionary which contains common terms used by boxing associates (fans, journalist, boxers, media, commentators and etc.). Provide your definitions and make them as specific as possible whilst also providing examples if possible.

Here are the terminology and my definitions of them:

- Bum (Below - Usable - Measure): A boxer with 12 bouts or more that has 25% losses out of his overall bouts (7 losses out of 24 bouts)

- Rookie / Novice: A boxer with less than 12 bouts who still hasn't faced a non-bum opponent in a 12 round bout (E.G. when Lomachenko faced Orlando Salido).

- Contender: A boxer who contests for a championship title.

- Champion: Any boxer with a championship title.

- Lineal champion: Any boxer with minimum 10 mandatory title defenses or any boxer who beats a champion with minimum 10 mandatory title defenses (such as Tyson Fury when he beat Wladimir Klitschko and Wladimir Klitschko before he lost to Tyson Fury).

- Undisputed champion: Any boxer with every championship title in a weight division. (E.G. Terence Crawford at 140 pounds before moving up to 147 pounds).

- Journeyman: Any boxer who is below contender level due to failure of becoming a contender by losing to other contenders (E.G. Alexander Dimitrenko and Alexander Ustinov)

- Bum beater: A boxer who has faced and beaten more than 50% of opponents that are bums out of their career record (E.G. LaMar Clark and Eric Esch / Butter Bean).

- ATG (All - Time - Great): A boxer who wins minimum 20 bouts against non-bum opponents (E.G. Wladimir Klitschko, Lennox Lewis and Vitali Klitschko).

- Unified champion: A boxer that possesses minimum 2 championship titles (E.G. Anthony Joshua currently).

- Featherfist (Butterfly, Powder Puncher, Pillow Puncher): Someone who's knockout percentage is 50% or lower (Evander Holyfield at heavyweight).

- Career-Record : All wins + losses + draws + no-contests from the first fight of the career to the last fight. It's quadruple number like "34-9-1-2" meaning "34 Wins, 9 Losses, 1 Draw, 2 No Contests"

- Prospect: Someone with at least 5 wins against non-bum opponents.

- Running: A boxer ceating distance without attacking or without showing intention of attacking (landing
punches upon the opponent). Or a boxer putting themselves in a position where they can't get hit by their opponent but also whilst not being in a position to land any punches on their opponent themselves (E.G. Canelo Alvarez running against Gennady Golovkin and Hughie Fury running against Joseph Parker).

- Boxing: A boxer positioning themselves in a position and at a distance where they can land punches on their opponent without getting punched themselves by the opponent in return (hit and not get hit - Vasyl Lomachenko against Guillermo Rigondeaux).

- Out-boxing: A boxer out-landing their opponent in terms of clean punches (punches that land accurately in the scoring areas of opponent's body - Vasyl Lomachenko out-boxing Guillermo Rigondeaux).

- Over-powering: A boxer overwhelming an opponent by landing punches that are more damaging / inflicts more damage than the punches that they receive from their opponent (George Foreman over-powering Joe Frazier).

- Ducking: A boxer who avoids a bout against a mandatory challenger or another champion in their own, respective weight division or a boxer who refuses to box against someone who they call out (E.G. Riddick Bowe ducking Lennox Lewis by throwing his belt into the garbage, Gennady Golovkin ducking Andre Ward by calling him out and not facing him and Floyd Mayweather ducking Amir Khan by making a poll and claiming he would fight the winner of who the fans want him to face next most and then refusing to fight Amir Khan after Amir Khan won the vote).

Last edited by Mr Objecitivity; 01-24-2018 at 01:45 AM.
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Old 01-23-2018, 08:57 AM #2
Thraxox Thraxox is online now
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What? the ATG and Prospect sis entirely deceiving.

ATG - A fighter that marked his history on his respectable sports with his achievements and records.

Prospect: An upcoming fighter, usually undefeated that has potential in the top world competition.

Bum: A fighter that has no hopes against defeating fighters inside the top 20, usually are fighters that are used in tune ups against world class fighters.

Salido is not a bum despite 25% of his record are losses and draws, And JCC Sr. Is not a bum beater for beating more than 80 opponents that are classed as bums.

Last edited by Thraxox; 01-23-2018 at 09:01 AM.
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Old 01-23-2018, 09:08 AM #3
Mr Objecitivity Mr Objecitivity is offline
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Great post - Boxing Goat 
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Originally Posted by Thraxox View Post
What? the ATG and Prospect sis entirely deceiving.

ATG - A fighter that marked his history on his respectable sports with his achievements and records.

Prospect: An upcoming fighter, usually undefeated that has potential in the top world competition.

Bum: A fighter that has no hopes against defeating fighters inside the top 20, usually are fighters that are used in tune ups against world class fighters.

Salido is not a bum despite 25% of his record are losses and draws, And JCC Sr. Is not a bum beater for beating more than 80 opponents that are classed as bums.
Salido is not a bum because he has less than 25% losses out of his career record (22.2%)

And your definitions aren't specific enough and are subject to various different interpretations.

How do we determine which upcoming undefeated fighter is a prospect or not?

How do we determine which boxer has any hopes of beating any boxer in the top 20?

What does it mean for a boxer to 'mark history' in ther sport and exactly what achievements / records do they need to qualify as an ATG?

Can you provide definitions that are specific enough to the point where they raise no questions?
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Old 01-23-2018, 09:10 AM #4
asgarth asgarth is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Objecitivity View Post
So here are some common boxing terminology that can be written in a boxing dictionary which contains common terms used by boxing associates (fans, journalist, boxers, media, commentators and etc.). Provide your definitions and make them as specific as possible whilst also providing examples if possible.

Here are the terminology and my definitions of them:

- Bum (Below - Usable - Measure): A boxer with 12 bouts or more that has 25% losses out of his overall bouts (7 losses out of 24 bouts)

- Rookie / Novice: A boxer with less than 12 bouts who still hasn't faced a non-bum opponent in a 12 round bout (E.G. when Lomachenko faced Orlando Salido).

- Contender: A boxer who contests for a championship title.

- Champion: Any boxer with a championship title.

- Lineal champion: Any boxer with minimum 10 mandatory title defenses or any boxer who beats a champion with minimum 10 mandatory title defenses (such as Tyson Fury when he beat Wladimir Klitschko and Wladimir Klitschko before he lost to Tyson Fury).

- Undisputed champion: Any boxer with every championship title in a weight division. (E.G. Terence Crawford at 140 pounds before moving up to 147 pounds).

- Journeyman: Any boxer who is below contender level due to failure of becoming a contender by losing to other contenders (E.G. Alexander Dimitrenko and Alexander Ustinov)

- Bum beater: A boxer who has faced and beaten more than 50% of opponents that are bums out of their career record (E.G. LaMar Clark and Eric Esch / Butter Bean).

- ATG (All - Time - Great): A boxer who wins minimum 20 bouts against non-bum opponents (E.G. Wladimir Klitschko, Lennox Lewis and Vitali Klitschko).

- Unified champion: A boxer that possesses minimum 2 championship titles (E.G. Anthony Joshua currently).

- Featherfist (Butterfly, Powder Puncher, Pillow Puncher): Someone who's knockout percentage is 50% or lower (Evander Holyfield at heavyweight).

- Career-Record : All wins + losses + draws + no-contests from the first fight of the career to the last fight. It's quadruple number like "34-9-1-2" meaning "34 Wins, 9 Losses, 1 Draw, 2 No Contests"

- Prospect: Someone with at least 5 wins against non-bum opponents.
Prospect: Someone who hasnt beaten a gatekeeper/fringe contender yet, but looks good so far. Doesnt have to have a minimum amount of fights. Olympic guys are always right away hot prospects without even fighting yet.

Bum: Doesnt provide any challenges, only there to pad your KO-record. Goes down as soon as it gets heated.

journeyman: Can give you rounds, due to being tough or elusive enough, but cant win rounds, due to poor offense and most of the time no power.

Gatekeeper: Loses against top20 fighters, but has enough tools (experience, toughness, defense) to test young and upcoming prospects and beats the prospects who doesnt have it.

Fringe contender: Someone who hasnt beaten a top10 contender yet, but already passed the test against a gatekeeper/top 20 or often an aging ex-champ. (Josh Taylor)

Contender: Someone who has beaten a top10 ranked fighter. Guys who just get in the top10 by default are not contenders.

You are fixating too much on numbers.
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Old 01-23-2018, 09:17 AM #5
Ray Corso Ray Corso is offline
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BUM..has nothing to do with a record! It defines a fighter performance not being a max effort for success.
Ali had a BUM performance against Leon Spinks in their first bout. Ali is certainly not a bum by any means.

Journeyman..a good quality talent at one time but for various reasons doesn't contend on an upper level any more.
They are capable of testing an up and coming talent but most circumstances are void of power.
Once they accept this role they become a professional looser who make it "look good".

The journeyman in the heavyweight division usually earn money as sparring partners because it has always been difficult securing sparring for heavies.

Ray
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Old 01-23-2018, 09:54 AM #6
caritafan caritafan is offline
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Terrible thread.
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Old 01-23-2018, 10:05 AM #7
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A bum is someone that prospects build their records with early on. It's extremely rare to see a top fighter fighting a real bum. The last bum I can think of that got a good fight was Rod Salka. Maybe Adonis Stevenson resume since being with PBC, not counting Fonfara.

Journeymen are hard, tested fighters who are not elite, but are very experienced. They can give top fighters a good test, but come up short against top talent.

An ATG is someone who is good enough to be a champion in any era. They might not be able to beat the best ATGs from another era, but they will always be competitive against other ATGs. Also have a resume to back up the ATG status.

Everything else is self explanatory. For example, does anyone really not know what a champion or rookie is?

Last edited by Willy Wanker; 01-23-2018 at 10:08 AM.
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Old 01-23-2018, 10:30 AM #8
Mr Objecitivity Mr Objecitivity is offline
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Terrible thread.
Proof or it didn't happen!
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Old 01-23-2018, 10:47 AM #9
Luilun Luilun is offline
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Originally Posted by Mr Objecitivity View Post
So here are some common boxing terminology that can be written in a boxing dictionary which contains common terms used by boxing associates (fans, journalist, boxers, media, commentators and etc.). Provide your definitions and make them as specific as possible whilst also providing examples if possible.

Here are the terminology and my definitions of them:

- Bum (Below - Usable - Measure): A boxer with 12 bouts or more that has 25% losses out of his overall bouts (7 losses out of 24 bouts)

- Rookie / Novice: A boxer with less than 12 bouts who still hasn't faced a non-bum opponent in a 12 round bout (E.G. when Lomachenko faced Orlando Salido).

- Contender: A boxer who contests for a championship title.

- Champion: Any boxer with a championship title.

- Lineal champion: Any boxer with minimum 10 mandatory title defenses or any boxer who beats a champion with minimum 10 mandatory title defenses (such as Tyson Fury when he beat Wladimir Klitschko and Wladimir Klitschko before he lost to Tyson Fury).

- Undisputed champion: Any boxer with every championship title in a weight division. (E.G. Terence Crawford at 140 pounds before moving up to 147 pounds).

- Journeyman: Any boxer who is below contender level due to failure of becoming a contender by losing to other contenders (E.G. Alexander Dimitrenko and Alexander Ustinov)

- Bum beater: A boxer who has faced and beaten more than 50% of opponents that are bums out of their career record (E.G. LaMar Clark and Eric Esch / Butter Bean).

- ATG (All - Time - Great): A boxer who wins minimum 20 bouts against non-bum opponents (E.G. Wladimir Klitschko, Lennox Lewis and Vitali Klitschko).

- Unified champion: A boxer that possesses minimum 2 championship titles (E.G. Anthony Joshua currently).

- Featherfist (Butterfly, Powder Puncher, Pillow Puncher): Someone who's knockout percentage is 50% or lower (Evander Holyfield at heavyweight).

- Career-Record : All wins + losses + draws + no-contests from the first fight of the career to the last fight. It's quadruple number like "34-9-1-2" meaning "34 Wins, 9 Losses, 1 Draw, 2 No Contests"

- Prospect: Someone with at least 5 wins against non-bum opponents.
What about TBE ? A Duck ? IV Cleanse ?
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Old 01-23-2018, 10:56 AM #10
FrankieClutch FrankieClutch is offline
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Gatekeeper- Someone who was once good, or hyped to be good, and is now just a nice name on a resume for a young fighter to use as a stepping stone.
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