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Old 12-26-2005, 05:36 AM #1
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Default Marvin Hagler vs. Ray Leonard

Once again... Now right from the beginning I have to admit I am a diehard Hagler fan. He's my favourite fighter of all time and maybe that's why I can't let go. As of late I've heard a lot of people say that Ray Leonard deserved the decision he got this April night in 1987 at the Caesars Palace. I've watched the fight at least more than five times and I always scored it in favour of Hagler. Though the last time I watched it was more than a year ago. Inspired by the "Fighters of the '80s" thread I decided to watch and score it once again even though it might be painfull. Maybe I'll realize where I went wrong and maybe afterwards I can make my peace with the judges and Sugar Ray Leonard. So I'll try as hard as I can to judge as objectivly as possible.

Hagler coming into this fight as WBC Middleweight Champion who defeated Mugabi via KO11 and Thomas Hearns by TKO3 defending his WBC, WBA, IBF titles in his last outings. He hadn't lost for over 1 years and though people wondered when father time will finally get to him he was the heavy favourite.

Leonard came right from a 3 year lay off. He had beaten Kevin Howard in '84 in a very medicore performance by his high standards. Before beating Howard he had not fought for more than 2 years. Leonard didn't want a tune-up for the Hagler fight and many believed he was crazy returning against the undisputed champion while moveing up in weight and haveing been out of action for so long.

In the negotiations Hagler gave Leonard all he asked for. All Hagler seemed to care about was that the money was right. Leonard managed to make the fight a 12 rounder and the ring bigger. He also chose the gloves. Many, including myself, believe that if the fight had been over 15 rounds we wouldn't even have to argue about this anymore because Hagler would've won clearly.

Now here we go, Richard Steele gave his instructions, the fighters are ready, the bell rung:

First Round: Hagler comes out northpole, Leonard seems very excited in the first twenty seconds. Leonard manages to establish the jab, moves faster than Hagler. Hagler follows Leonard around the ring, consistently talking to Leonard. Hagler connects with a right and Leonard unleashes his first flurry. Nothing of any impact, now Leonard turns southpole. Hagler continues to be the aggressor. As the bell rings Leonard does a little pose and off they go to the corner.
First Round scored for Sugar Ray Leonard!
10-9 Sugar Ray Leonard

Second Round: Hagler still fighting northpole and connects with a lead left hand. Trys to follow up but Leonard is too quick. Leonard goes to the body, connects with an overhand right. Richard Steele warns Leonard for holding. Hagler follows Leonard around the ring. Hagler connects with a right and Leonard flurries to steal round 2. Close round.
Second Round scored for Sugar Ray Leonard!
20-18 Sugar Ray Leonard

Third Round: Hagler comes out southpole, hits Leonard with two lefts. Leonard to the body, Hagler to the head. Hagler outpunches Leonard in the exchange, puts pressure on. Leonard pushes Hagler back, gets a warning for pushing. Leonard connects with some right hand leads, still showboats, flurries a little. Hagler with a solid left hand at the bell. Now personally it's really hard for me not to score this round for Hagler. In my opinion he should've won it. But maybe I'm being subjective. So as it was close I'll give it to Leonard.
Third Round scored for Sugar Ray Leonard!
30-27 Sugar Ray Leonard

Forth Round: Hagler staying southpole, hiting Leonard with a left hand lead. Continues to put pressure on Leonard but keeps missing. The crowd cheers for every move Leonard makes. Hard Low Blow by Leonard. Steele warns him for holding. Leonard connects to the body, connects with a showboatpunch and hits a flurry. Hagler smiles and follows him around. Another flurry by Leonard. No punch landed clean.
Forth Round scored for Sugar Ray Leonard!
40-36 Sugar Ray Leonard

Fifth Round: Both come out fast, Hagler continues to talk to Leonard and smiles at him. Hits him with a left hand lead but keeps missing most shots. Leonard with a right hand. Hagler begins to find his range. Misses with a big left hand, Leonard trying to make him pay but Hagler covers up. Hagler hits Leonard with a hard right uppercut that forces Leonard to hold. Hagler has Leonard against the ropes, gets some good shots hit. Leonard tries to flurry but Hagler wont let him. As the bell rings Hagler pushes Leonard in the back to his corner.
Fifth Round scored for Marvelous Marvin Hagler!
49-46 Sugar Ray Leonard

Sixth Round: Hagler connects (as usual when the round starts) with a left hand lead, goes to the body. Leonard with a right hand lead of his own. Hagler misses some big punches, Leonard does nothing to make him pay. Leonard with a quick 1-2, he is sacraficing power for speed. Steele warns Leonard for hitting while holding. Hagler presses the action, connects with some solid blows, Leonard tries to give as good as he gets.
Sixth Round scored for Marvelous Marvin Hagler!
58-56 Sugar Ray Leonard

Seventh Round: As they come out Hagler surprisingly misses with his his first left hand lead. Leonard seems tired, breathes heavy. Hagler to the body. Leonard with a left hook, gets nailed in return by Hagler with a hard left and another one for Hagler. Hagler pushes back Leonard, Steele warns him. Hagler following Leonard around and now starting to connect with more punches. Leonard does a little Muhammed Ali, Hagler shows him his tongue. Hagler has Leonard against the ropes, Leonard gets warned for holding. Hagler with some solid shots to the body and a uppercut just before the bell rings. Leonard with a right hook after the bell rung.
Seventh Round scored for Marvelous Marvin Hagler!
67-66 Sugar Ray Leonard
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Old 12-26-2005, 05:37 AM #2
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Eight Round: They come out and Hagler nails some hard right jabs. Richard Steels interrupts because of some lose tape on Leonards gloves. Leonard gets some extra time. Hagler continues to land his stiff jab. Leonard has nothing in his punches. Hagler keeps marching forwards. Steele warns Leonard for holding. Hagler misses and Leonard counters. Leonard with a right. Hagler just marches through it. The bell rings and Leonard hits Hagler again after the bell. That's two in a row.
Eight Round scored for Marvelous Marvin Hagler!
76-76 draw

Ninth Round: Leonard with a quick 1-2. Hagler cruising forwards. Hagler pound on Leonard, hitting him with the best shot of the fight so far, a streight left hand. Leonard flurring to Haglers head, connecting with some shots. Hagler doesn't move back, dishing out the more solid blows. Leonard flurring again, gets very tired and is warned for holding. Again Leonard on the ropes, Hagler to the body and tries an uppercut, Leonard with another flurry, can barley hold his hands up. Gets another warning. I give this round to Hagler becose he hit the solid shots compared to Leonards flurries.
Ninth Round scored for Marvelous Marvin Hagler!
86-85 Marvelous Marvin Hagler

Tenth Round: Both fighters seem tired. Hagler is slow getting his shots off. Leonard keeps getting warned for holding. At some point one would think Richard Steele has to take a point away. Hagler keeps on going forward, still being the aggressor. Leonard with some jabs and the occasional right hand. Hagler searching for a big shot, meanwhilst landing left hand leads and jabs but missing with most of his hooks. Big miss by Hagler but recovers quick and tags Leonard with a right. Leonard with a beautiful combination. Hagler keeps on marching forward.
Tenth round scored for Marvelous Marvin Hagler!
96-94 Marvelous Marvin Hagler

Eleventh Round: Hagler pressing the action, looking to rough Leonard up. Leonard haveing none of it. Leonard with a flurry. Hagler keeps coming but doesn't let his left hand go. Leonard showboating again. Another flurry by Leonard. The crowd loves it. Hagler to the body, Leonard drops his hands and sticks his head out and Hagler misses as Leonard leans back. Another flurry by Leonard. None of these punches are serious. Leonard holds the ropes as the bell rings and has a hard time getting back to the corner.
Eleventh Round scored for Sugar Ray Leonard!
105-104 Marvelous Marvin Hagler

Twelfth Round: Before the twelfth round Leonard stands up in his corner and raises his hands. Leonard makes this little sign with his glove to Hagler "Lets get it on". Hagler smiles and does the same. Hagler hiting a lead left hand to the body. Follwing Leonard around, getting the better of the exchanges. Leonard makes his famous flurry against the ropes, doesn't connect with most of his punches and starts running around the ring, raising his hands. Hagler raises his hands as well. Hagler with some hooks to the body, and a left to the face. Hagler has Leonard against the ropes, Leonard looking to his corner all the time, barely throwing a punch. The bell rings, Leonard raises his arms, the crowd chants his name.
Twelfth Round scored for Marvelous Marvin Hagler!
115-113 Marvelous Marvin Hagler

Final Result: 115-113 Marvelous Marvin Hagler!

Marvin is dancing around the ring, Leonard climbs on one apron, gettin cheered. The announcer has the decision.

Lou Filippo 115-113 Hagler

Jose J. Guerra 110-118 Leonard (WTF?!)

Dave Moretti 113-115 Leonard

Winner by Split Decision and New Middlweight Champion of the World Sugar Ray Leonard!

The crowd likes it, they have there Cinderalla story. Marvin is disgusted, so am I. 110-118 for Leonard, c'mon, don't noone try to convince me ****ing Guerra wasn't paid. It was a close fight, I tried to be as objective as I could. I wrote every round report right after I've seen the round. Might be that I mixed up the chronological order once or twice but that should be it. Marvin Hagler, the fighter of the 80's won this bout. It doesn't matter what so called experts and diehard Leonard fans say. He won this bout. It was close and I can accept that one or the other likes some flashy flurries over solid punching but everyone who scored this bout 110-118 needs to stick to watching Curling.

I hoped that I could see this bout different but I couldn't. I still saw an old Marvin Hagler beating a tremendous comeback Sugar Ray.

How do you like it?


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Old 12-26-2005, 06:56 AM #3
Bozo_no no Bozo_no no is offline
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I just can't see how someone can say they scored a fight 115-113 and then say they'd be disgusted if someone scored it for the other fighter.

I had it 115-113 for Ray.

Hagler threw the fight away fighting foolishly in the first four rounds.

I wouldn't call someone crazy for having it 115-113 Hagler, that's reasonable.

But so is 115-113 for Ray.

It was a close fight.
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Old 12-26-2005, 10:44 AM #4
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I have the fight, and have watched it numerous times.

I scored it 115-113 Leonard.

I think he dictated the fight.
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Old 12-26-2005, 12:07 PM #5
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hagler ud over Leonard
 
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don't get me started
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Old 12-26-2005, 02:18 PM #6
DiegoFuego DiegoFuego is offline
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I thought Hagler won 7 rounds. That judge who had it 10 rounds to 2 needs to be shot. Sure, there were a lot of close rounds, but no way could you feel like Leonard was winning that many of them.
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Old 12-26-2005, 03:18 PM #7
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I agree that the one landslide card for Leonard was a joke,

but,

that's no reason to call the fight a robbery.

I (and many others) felt he legitimatly did win the fight 115-113.

That one judge had his head up his ass with his wide score card, but he had the right guy winning (imo).
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Old 12-26-2005, 03:26 PM #8
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[QUOTE=Dude]
First Round: Hagler comes out northpole, Leonard seems very excited in the first twenty seconds. Leonard manages to establish the jab, moves faster than Hagler. Hagler follows Leonard around the ring, consistently talking to Leonard. Hagler connects with a right and Leonard unleashes his first flurry. Nothing of any impact, now Leonard turns southpole. Hagler continues to be the aggressor. As the bell rings Leonard does a little pose and off they go to the corner.
First Round scored for Sugar Ray Leonard!
10-9 Sugar Ray Leonard

Second Round: Hagler still fighting northpole and connects with a lead left hand. Trys to follow up but Leonard is too quick. Leonard goes to the body, connects with an overhand right. Richard Steele warns Leonard for holding. Hagler follows Leonard around the ring. Hagler connects with a right and Leonard flurries to steal round 2. Close round.
Second Round scored for Sugar Ray Leonard!
20-18 Sugar Ray Leonard

Third Round: Hagler comes out southpole, hits Leonard with two lefts. Leonard to the body, Hagler to the head. Hagler outpunches Leonard in the exchange, puts pressure on. Leonard pushes Hagler back, gets a warning for pushing. Leonard connects with some right hand leads, still showboats, flurries a little. Hagler with a solid left hand at the bell. Now personally it's really hard for me not to score this round for Hagler. In my opinion he should've won it. But maybe I'm being subjective. So as it was close I'll give it to Leonard.
Third Round scored for Sugar Ray Leonard!
30-27 Sugar Ray Leonard

Forth Round: Hagler staying southpole, hiting Leonard with a left hand lead. Continues to put pressure on Leonard but keeps missing. The crowd cheers for every move Leonard makes. Hard Low Blow by Leonard. Steele warns him for holding. Leonard connects to the body, connects with a showboatpunch and hits a flurry. Hagler smiles and follows him around. Another flurry by Leonard. No punch landed clean.
Forth Round scored for Sugar Ray Leonard!
40-36 Sugar Ray Leonard



WATS THIS NORTHPOLE SOUTHPOLE STUFF....
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Old 12-26-2005, 04:18 PM #9
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I had it 115-113 for Hagler. I usually score fights for the more effective fighter...for the fighter who throws the better punches (Toney as opposed to Jirov, Hopkins as opposed to Taylor, Hagler as opposed to Leonard) but Hagler did put himself in a position to lose by following Ray around the ring a lot. Hagler did what Sturm did against De La Hoya, what Hopkins did against Taylor...he didn't go out and take the fight decisively.

The decision pissed me off and made me hate Ray Leonard more, but a W is a W.
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Old 12-26-2005, 04:26 PM #10
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I watched it recently, and still had it for Leonard.

I thought he used the ring better, whilst Hagler just plodded forward, missing wildly.

Leonard threw better combinations, and was economic. He was more accurate then Hagler, and although Hagler landed punches, i thought Leonard's punches had more quality. (he put more into them)

Haglers defense was bad, and he was breathing very heavily early on.
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