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Old 06-16-2012, 12:07 PM #1
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Default If Ricardo Lopez moved up to flyweight?

What if Ricardo Lopez moved up to flyweight? How would he have done? Would he clean out the division? Would he have eventually lost? Who would he have faced?
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Old 06-16-2012, 12:09 PM #2
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Lopez vs Mark Johnson at 112 would have been one helluva fight.
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Old 06-16-2012, 12:30 PM #3
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Originally Posted by Boxing Bob View Post
Lopez vs Mark Johnson at 112 would have been one helluva fight.
Mark Johnson would have laid waste to Lopez.
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Old 06-16-2012, 12:31 PM #4
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If he had moved up to 108, the two top guys were Chiquita Gonzalez and Michael Carbajal. That would have been two very good match-ups, and I belive that Lopez would have won both. But he would never have fought Gonzalez as both were managed and trainde by Nacho Beristain.
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Old 06-16-2012, 01:42 PM #5
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Who was at flyweight at the time? He would never beat Mark Johnson and I don't think he could beat Arbachakov either. He had height for flyweight, but not necessary body frame, he would have to use some conditioning coach to move that high it probably.
I don't know well enough those 108-pounders of that era to tell how would Ricardo do against them, but I strongly believe that generally he's very overrated.
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Old 06-19-2012, 11:17 PM #6
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I believe he would have cleaned out the division and remained undefeated. He would have had some competitive and difficult fights but I don't think there was anyone out there who would have beaten him. He had the frame to move up, and considering that his dominance was based purely on skill and his professionalism in and out of the ring, I have no doubt that he would have been able to move up and still be a dominant force. He also had a really great trainer. People really wanted Lopez to move up to 108 to face Humberto Gonzalez and/or Michael Carbajal but those plans evaporated when Gonzalez lost to a guy that Lopez had already destroyed, and even if he hadn't lost that fight, I still don't think it would have happened because they were both trained by Nacho Beristain. And the Carbajal fight lost it's appeal after the last 2 Gonzalez fights. To be honest, the Flyweight division doesn't look like it was much better than the one he was competing in, but you did have two great champions in Mark Johnson and Yuri Arbachakov. I think both would have tested him, but beat him? I don't think so.

I don't understand why people think Mark Johnson would have beaten Lopez, at all. What is this based on? Mark Johnson didn't beat anyone that suggests he would have beaten Lopez so let's compare their attributes. What did "Too Sharp" do better? Did he have better speed? Maybe. Was he more powerful? No. Did he have better defence? No. Was he a smarter fighter? No. Was he more versatile? No. Was he a better combination puncher? No. Was he a better body puncher? No. That's not to say that he wasn't a great fighter but Lopez was a better one and would have beaten him if they fought. I think sometimes people look at great fighters with a few losses and they are willing to give them more credit than undefeated fighters because they get the feeling they were tested more. Lopez's resume is better than it's given credit for. He did beat 10 world champions and unify the belts, and even though his resume could have been better if he moved up, he is still one of the greatest boxers of all time regardless, whether people want to admit it or not. Of all the great boxers I have seen from the last 20 years there's only one that I can rate above him which is Floyd Mayweather.

Last edited by JK1700; 06-19-2012 at 11:21 PM.
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Old 06-20-2012, 01:09 AM #7
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I believe he would have done well at flyweight if he moved up earlier in his career. By the time he moved up to junior flyweight against Grigsby he was at the end of his career, but if he did it earlier he would have had success.
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Old 06-20-2012, 12:52 PM #8
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Originally Posted by JK1700 View Post
I believe he would have cleaned out the division and remained undefeated. He would have had some competitive and difficult fights but I don't think there was anyone out there who would have beaten him. He had the frame to move up, and considering that his dominance was based purely on skill and his professionalism in and out of the ring, I have no doubt that he would have been able to move up and still be a dominant force. He also had a really great trainer. People really wanted Lopez to move up to 108 to face Humberto Gonzalez and/or Michael Carbajal but those plans evaporated when Gonzalez lost to a guy that Lopez had already destroyed, and even if he hadn't lost that fight, I still don't think it would have happened because they were both trained by Nacho Beristain. And the Carbajal fight lost it's appeal after the last 2 Gonzalez fights. To be honest, the Flyweight division doesn't look like it was much better than the one he was competing in, but you did have two great champions in Mark Johnson and Yuri Arbachakov. I think both would have tested him, but beat him? I don't think so.

I don't understand why people think Mark Johnson would have beaten Lopez, at all. What is this based on? Mark Johnson didn't beat anyone that suggests he would have beaten Lopez so let's compare their attributes. What did "Too Sharp" do better? Did he have better speed? Maybe. Was he more powerful? No. Did he have better defence? No. Was he a smarter fighter? No. Was he more versatile? No. Was he a better combination puncher? No. Was he a better body puncher? No. That's not to say that he wasn't a great fighter but Lopez was a better one and would have beaten him if they fought. I think sometimes people look at great fighters with a few losses and they are willing to give them more credit than undefeated fighters because they get the feeling they were tested more. Lopez's resume is better than it's given credit for. He did beat 10 world champions and unify the belts, and even though his resume could have been better if he moved up, he is still one of the greatest boxers of all time regardless, whether people want to admit it or not. Of all the great boxers I have seen from the last 20 years there's only one that I can rate above him which is Floyd Mayweather.
Too sharp vs. Ricardo is basically the same kind of match-up as Marquez - Norwood, except Finito isn't as good as Juan Manuel and Marc Johnson may be even better than Norwood so the fight wouldn't be as close.
And I rather think that some people will believe that if someone is undefeated then he can't be defeated. Fact is, against only historically meaningfull fighter he faced finito looked significantly worse and more beatable, in reality he could've very well lost both fights to Rosendo Alvarez who of course was very good, but rather not ATG fighter.
Morales did better job on similar, but clearly superior fighter than Rosendo in Barrera. Marquez looked just as dominant against similar level opposition and far better against All Time Greats that Ricardo hasn't ever seen in the ring.
Ricardo was definitely in the league of great mexican trio of featherweights in last decade(even if I rate him below all 3), but saying that he's in class above them or one of best of all time is ridiculous.
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Old 06-20-2012, 01:27 PM #9
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Mark Johnson would have laid waste to Lopez.
You honestly believe that? 'Laid waste' to him?
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Old 06-20-2012, 02:49 PM #10
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Lopez beats anyone in history from flyweight on down, with the possible exception of Jimmy Wilde.

Absolutely no weaknesses in the man. The only times he looked even remotely beatable was against Rosendo Alvarez, who is most definitely an all-time great, and Finito was past his best at that point.

If you've watched as many strawweight bouts as I have, you'd have no doubt that Ricardo Lopez is the greatest Mexican fighter to ever lace up a pair of gloves. His competition was far tougher than he's given credit for.

Last edited by SBleeder; 06-20-2012 at 02:53 PM.
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