Are You People Mad In Britain Electing Corbyn?

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Spent about an hour trying to figure out what if anything May/Corbyn even disagree on. Had a hard time.

Is the consensus that they should have just flipped a coin and picked one to push Brexit through more quickly?

[Weebler I]

It's not really 326 though. Sinn Fein don't take their seats, last election they had 4 so the working majority required was ****650-40/2) = 323 - also the speaker doesn't get involved in voting.

Sinn Fein actually won 7 this time so the working majority is in fact 322.

People seem to forget about SF. Here's a source.

I'm well aware of Sinn Fein mate, but for some reason I'm thinking 326 - 7 = 319?

You're right about Liberals+SNP+labour being 309 - but what I meant was they could form a minority government potentially. It is possible that these guys could get together, canvas some tory support to make up the 322 required and vote down the Queens speech. Following that, Corbyn would be invited to form a government as leader of the largest party. That will be the said minority government i'm on about. In truth, that government won't be able to get much done and there will be a vote of no confidence and another election within a year. This is pretty much what happened in 1974. We have been there before.

I think the DUP deal is untenable. It's too undermining to the terms of the NI peace process. I think the Queen's speech scenario followed by a 2nd election is the most likely outcome.

DUP deal only undermines the peace process if it actually undermines the peace process, as opposed to hypothetically. The DUP are actually quite a pragmatic party, many of its main players are former UUP. The picture painted of them in the media at present is an inaccurate characterisation.

Tories going with Corbyn? I can't see it, not even Soubry.

[Kosta]

I'm well aware of Sinn Fein mate, but for some reason I'm thinking 326 - 7 = 319?



DUP deal only undermines the peace process if it actually undermines the peace process, as opposed to hypothetically. The DUP are actually quite a pragmatic party, many of its main players are former UUP. The picture painted of them in the media at present is an inaccurate characterisation.

Tories going with Corbyn? I can't see it, not even Soubry.

The right equation for a majority would be 650-7 / 2 = 322.5. Less the speaker you need 322

I agree on the DUP. Find it ironic they have been painted as terrorists when SF are the real terrorists. The DUP always fought for peace. However I feel just by getting involved in NI politics it's so controversial that I can't see it surviving 5 years

[Citizen Koba]

The right equation for a majority would be 650-7 / 2 = 322.5. Less the speaker you need 322

I agree on the DUP. Find it ironic they have been painted as terrorists when SF are the real terrorists. The DUP always fought for peace. However I feel just by getting involved in NI politics it's so controversial that I can't see it surviving 5 years

Both groups are terrorists, man. The DUP are the political arm of the Unionist militias just as much as SF are the political arm of the IRA... it's just that here in the mainland UK we saw little Unionist violence for obvious reasons. And yeah it is controversial as fuck since under the terms of the good Friday agreement both Westminster and the Irish government agreed to strict neutrality in the political affairs of Northern Ireland... whether or not they actually attempt to stay neutral it still obviously shifts the balance of political power to the Unionist camp way out of proportion to the voting patterns of the province.

[Citizen Koba]

Spent about an hour trying to figure out what if anything May/Corbyn even disagree on. Had a hard time.

Is the consensus that they should have just flipped a coin and picked one to push Brexit through more quickly?

The big ones are nationalisation of key services (and protection of the NHS), workers' rights and conditions, free tertiary education and taxation of the wealthy. Foreign policy and immigration policy will be a lot more similar than most people seem to think. The differences on Brexit are hard to find cos neither side really knows what to expect yet, but on domestic policy the sides are poles apart on many issues.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2017-39933116

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2017-39960311

[Citizen Koba]

He's like Bernie Sanders, but worse, because in Europe you guys are actually open to communism a lot more than America. This guy is horrible, please explain yourself.

He's basically a left centerist with a few socialistic policies. Any dumb fucks who actually think we're talking about a resurgence of European communism don't have the faintest clue what they're talking about. He's taken a platform which addresses the concerns of many of the UK population such as poverty, healthcare and education which I can't really see any feasible reason to object to (standards in all three areas seem to be failing) - you may of course believe that his methods are unrealistic and doomed to be unsuccessful, but from where I stand the guy deserves a chance to show if he can improve things for the British people. All we've seen for the last 20 -25 years is a steady rise in the costs of basic services and a slow decline in overall living standards and wages, along with a massive increase in poverty and growing inequality. You really think it's such a bad thing that people are starting to think it's time to try something a little different?

What would be your solution? 5 more years of 'belt tightening' and 'we're all in this together' when we clearly ain't. Some of us are getting kinda fed up with our taxes ending up in the pockets of private shareholders instead of being spent to improve the quality of life of us all. What would truly be mad - if you are one of the many who have been adversely affected under successive Tory and 'New' Labour governments - is voting for a party which is promising to do more of the same.

I don't know what it is man, it's like a Pavlovian response with some people (specially our cousins from the US)... you mention anything that seems to be of benefit to the poorer members of society and you immediately get described as a Communist. Bet there's people out there right now calling the minimum wage some kinda Trotskyite plot to overthrow the free world.

[siablo14]

Torries and DUP are struggling to pull off the deal.

[Chrismart]

What I don't get about the Tories is they never have any revenue streams. They just sell publically owned assets when they can.

Corbyn actually had a costed manifesto and said he'll nationalise the Rail and the Royal Mail when those contract expires. Tories barely had a manifesto it was a farce.

Hard Brexit? Nobody knew what it meant and they never explained it.

I don't understand what Tories actually do when they're in charge tbh. Nothing basically but drastically cut public spending. And they have no idea about the electorate or what they are feeling.

Corbyn should have won and will win shortly.

The working class of England voting for Tories has always seemed like turkey's voting for Christmas.

But I am surprised that Labour did so well. I guess if I had to put myself in a box I'm a socialist. Corbyn's labour are socialist party. It says something about the mood of the country.

Conservatives are in trouble. They might be out before Christmas imo.

And if the argument is conservatives are more hardline on terrorism, security etc. They're not. The prime minister herself oversaw a cut of 20,000 frontline police officers and thousands upon thousand of support staff.

Yanks comparing your political system to ours doesn't really work. The tories are a horrific party.

Good post :ANYWORD:

[Sparked_26]

Corbyn and Labour can't get a working majority without Tory backbenchers.

We need another general election pretty much now, lol. Unless Tories want to cling to power for the sake of it.

Tories are ridiculous they gave us a referendum on Brexit because they thought we'd say no and then they called a snap general election because they thought we'd give them a majority of 90-100 in parliament without telling us what they'd actually do with that majority.

I can't believe the even got in despite Corbyn and Labour coming back from the end of the world to tighten it up on election day, the snap election. I don't fully understand some people's motives for voting conservative aside from the fact that tight people don't like paying more income tax, or if they have a small business and they're concerned about corporate tax (legit concern) because that is all that was really disseminated from the Tories during their recent campaign.

The only thing the Tories stuck their head above the parapet for was trying to roundly fuck people who have dementia for their money tied up in their homes, and then mess with their pensions too. And they withdrew one of those policies straight away, lol.

The black and white is that Tories haven't lost the election but of course they have. To quote a Tory MP: 'they haven't shot themselves in the foot, they've shot themselves in the head!'

They're dead in the water.

They need a populist leader like Boris the Fop to get people onside with a cult of personality type deal. But he will get torn to shreds in any situation where he is put in front of an audience and people ask him questions.

[Weebler I]

Both groups are terrorists, man. The DUP are the political arm of the Unionist militias just as much as SF are the political arm of the IRA... it's just that here in the mainland UK we saw little Unionist violence for obvious reasons. And yeah it is controversial as fuck since under the terms of the good Friday agreement both Westminster and the Irish government agreed to strict neutrality in the political affairs of Northern Ireland... whether or not they actually attempt to stay neutral it still obviously shifts the balance of political power to the Unionist camp way out of proportion to the voting patterns of the province.

No they aren't, and frankly you really don't know what you are talking about on this.

The political arm of the loyalist paramilitaries is the Progressive Unionist Party (PUP).

The DUP have always publicly disavowed and condemned acts Loyalist terrorism, unlike Sinn Fein whose leaders who are actually terrorists, they have sent people to death, had them tortured buried and still refuse today to say where the bodies are buried. Condemn them? they are them. The DUP leadership are in the main middle class, educated people from good backgrounds.

Granted there have been isolated occasions where Loyalists have turned up at rallies or appeared in photos over the past 30-40 years, but that's a long way from any involvement with or directing terrorism.

The DUP's leader herself had bomb placed under her school bus when she was a young girl, her father was shot in a field by the IRA. Jeremy Corbyn supported the IRA at this time, and when they were placing bombs killing children in Manchester and he still supports them today.

The long-since terrorised British people of Northern Ireland would never vote for terrorist party, that's why the PUP never got a notable share of the vote from them.

It's an entirely false equivalence the anti-Brexit London media are trying to draw in order to keep Britain in the EU against the democratic wishes of the British people.