Forum Navigation
Go Back   Boxing Forum > Boxing Forums > Boxing History

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 05-11-2015, 01:49 PM #41
juggernaut666 juggernaut666 is offline
Undisputed Champion
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: NYC
Posts: 12,899
Quoted: 6817 Post(s)
Rep Power: 33
juggernaut666 has a reputation beyond reputejuggernaut666 has a reputation beyond reputejuggernaut666 has a reputation beyond reputejuggernaut666 has a reputation beyond reputejuggernaut666 has a reputation beyond reputejuggernaut666 has a reputation beyond reputejuggernaut666 has a reputation beyond reputejuggernaut666 has a reputation beyond reputejuggernaut666 has a reputation beyond reputejuggernaut666 has a reputation beyond reputejuggernaut666 has a reputation beyond repute
Points: 85,779.46
Bank: 1,622.21
Total Points: 87,401.67
Wlad is going to rip Fury and Fury's ego apart - Krusher P4P #1 For your tears :) - motivational Dunce - denium Dunce - denium Dunce - denium 
Bellend - denium Bellend - denium something to suck and bounce on - HughJass No Message - anthonydavid11 gAy J LOL - ^lll 
Autism - Marchegiano 
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by them_apples View Post
I agree with the first part, tyson was tired taking big heavy bag shots. However, bonavena was a big time hard puncher from argentina. He was like Marcos Maidana. I believe he dropped the iron chinned Chuvalo as well. Not that you care since you speak before thinking..but food for thought.

How is Ali so light hitting when he managed to stop George Foreman in his prime. When Foreman walked through Morrison and Holyfields punches like they were flies. I under stand Foreman was severely fatigued but still Ali had some pop when he wanted to. Before his first retirement he had a ko percentage in the 90 % range.

I don't understand how you give old fighters 0 credit. Yeah they lost at bad points during their career or near the end...but look how ****ty lennox lewis looked when a guy like Mccall koed him, or how sloppy and slow he looked against Vitali in his last fight. Even look at Wlad against that bum jennings, a man foreman or Frazier would stop in the first round.

im not going to say light hitting but being a hard hiiter in a lower weight class doesn't mean you have modern HW power,its like trying to convince someone Bonevena could hit like Norton or foreman....Ali did not k.o foreman with one punch,foreman punched himself out and was exsuausted,again anyone can check on record alis k.o percentages and quality of real Hw's he wasn't able to k.o and true HW range he would have less than a 40% k.o percentage...J.young was not a hard hitter at all yet dropped foreman as well without foreman being tired or as tired,foreman was punching back at him..
Fraizer wouldn't remotely be on jennins level he would be to athletic for Frazier,foreman maybe gets a k.o punch in but?Well Jennings isn't the overweight 224 Frazier,Jennings is much naturally bigger than joe and is very athletic at 220 plus...Frazier is a natural 205 pounder,there not even close to resembling HW's as joe looks like a light weight next to him.

you also completely ignored the fact a 250 plus Foreman had the best chin ever arguably in boxing history,not so much 220 foreman as it was proven at least 3 times.


See guys who are the pure nostalgic fans cant really dispute numbers/statistics and percentages as they go hand in hand it helps eliminate facts from opinions this why SPORTS bookies use them and always have used it to determine who is or what team is the odds on favorite or underdog.An exteme example of this would be Joe Louis vs Wlad klitchko...now the average or common fan would opick Louis....however the smart money would certainly be oon klitchko for obvious reasons and at the end of the night the Bookies would be very rich because of the many casual fans out there compared to the hardcore ones...as any bookie who knows this match in real time now if it were to take place would be laughing there heads off because I know for a fact Wlad is easily a 10 to 1 favorite here...personally I would have him at 20 to 1 and could do so easily....again this is why numbers are important despite what the deluded many on here tell you.Hows that for speaking without thinking?

Last edited by juggernaut666; 05-11-2015 at 02:26 PM.
juggernaut666 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-12-2015, 07:54 AM #42
Mugwump Mugwump is offline
Undisputed Champion
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: St. Helens, UK
Posts: 1,733
Quoted: 58 Post(s)
Rep Power: 16
Mugwump has a reputation beyond reputeMugwump has a reputation beyond reputeMugwump has a reputation beyond reputeMugwump has a reputation beyond reputeMugwump has a reputation beyond reputeMugwump has a reputation beyond reputeMugwump has a reputation beyond reputeMugwump has a reputation beyond reputeMugwump has a reputation beyond reputeMugwump has a reputation beyond reputeMugwump has a reputation beyond repute
Points: 8,981.55
Bank: 1,045.91
Total Points: 10,027.46
Default

I think a better way of phrasing the question is: which fighter had the higher mental and physical breaking point in the face of overwhelming pressure?

Frazier. By a loooooong way.

That said, Tyson was a tough character. He took a savage beating at the hands of Lewis and it's to his credit that he stayed up for so long.

But just watch that Frazier documentary (the one about Ali's awful race-baiting) and see the look in Frazier's eyes as he watches the penultimate round in Manilla. Look at that terrifying smile of grim contentment as he sees Ali practically unconscious on his stool at the end of the round. Then watch that smile drop like a steel shutter the second the towel is thrown in.

If I were to pick any fighter to partner during a war - Joe Frazier would be the man. No question.
Mugwump is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-13-2015, 06:56 AM #43
vilhelmcarlberg vilhelmcarlberg is offline
Amateur
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Posts: 13
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Rep Power: 0
vilhelmcarlberg is on a distinguished road
Points: 5,050.00
Bank: 1,000.00
Total Points: 6,050.00
Default Who was toughest Frazier or Tyson

Both are the good boxer in the world.
vilhelmcarlberg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-13-2015, 11:12 AM #44
Barn Barn is offline
TheTartanSoldier
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Scotland
Posts: 10,521
Quoted: 144 Post(s)
Rep Power: 67
Barn has a reputation beyond reputeBarn has a reputation beyond reputeBarn has a reputation beyond reputeBarn has a reputation beyond reputeBarn has a reputation beyond reputeBarn has a reputation beyond reputeBarn has a reputation beyond reputeBarn has a reputation beyond reputeBarn has a reputation beyond reputeBarn has a reputation beyond reputeBarn has a reputation beyond repute
Points: 40,218.73
Bank: 1,077.68
Total Points: 41,296.41
Top Bloke! - mickey malone For your knowledge of boxing - sigrab jr Hell of a poster, very generous - BigStereotype the champ is here - New England wisdom - House of Stone 
For generosity and top posts! - Sugarj medal for your videos - New England The Greatest Vid : Barney the Great - McGoorty Keep up the top notch vids - JAB5239 To another of a select group of real boxing fans who really know their boxing history! - Terry A 
4 the uploads! - chiguy91 For you epic break down of Oreo's, and the Mayan calendar. lmaooooooooo - Sweet Pea 50 For the massive amount of points given - MindBat You're going to need it to beat me. - D-MiZe victory is sweet , rigotard and proud!! - HUGH JASS 
Rigonation badge of honor! - dan_cov your first post in the weed thread barn! , i know you don't smoke , keep it that way young one!! - HUGH JASS Boxingscene Chat room :fing02: - jose830 For the help buddy - Badzi87 You a Scot,Me a English and this lucky clover from Ireland.Best of luck m8. - HughGlass 
Lou Gehrig's Disease (ALS) - NChristo Arthritis - Child Abuse - Colon Cancer - Colorectal Cancer - Dystonia - Education - Free Speech - Interstitial Cystitis - ME/CFIDS - Reye's Syndrome - Save the Music - Teens Against Smoking - Victim's Rights - Water Quality - NChristo Childhood Cancer - NChristo Adoptee - Bone Cancer - Child Exploitation and Abuse - Hope and Support - Peace - Retinoblastoma - Right to Life - Student Sexual Assault - NChristo Hepatitis C - NChristo 
Arthritis - Child Abuse - Colon Cancer - Colorectal Cancer - Dystonia - Education - Free Speech - Interstitial Cystitis - ME/CFIDS - Reye's Syndrome - Save the Music - Teens Against Smoking - Victim's Rights - Water Quality - NChristo Eating Disorders - Esophageal Cancer - Gastroesophageal Reflux Disease - Irritable Bowel Syndrome - Pulmonary Hypertension - NChristo Male Breast Cancer - Pregnancy Loss - Infant Loss - Sudden Infant Death - NChristo Autism - NChristo Emphysema - Lung Cancer - Lung Disease - Multiple Sclerosis - NChristo 
Cultural Diversity - Hunger - Leukemia - Lupus - Melanoma - Racial Tolerance - Reflex Sympathetic Dystrophy Syndrome - Self Injury - NChristo Myasthenia Gravis - Ovarian Cancer - Sexual Assault - Substance Abuse - NChristo Hodgkin's Disease - Testicular Cancer - NChristo Mourning - Anti-Gang - Melanoma - NChristo World Trade Center Victims and Heroes - Fireworks Safety - arraamis 
Mourning - Anti-Gang - Melanoma - chiguy91 Adoptee - Bone Cancer - Child Exploitation and Abuse - Hope and Support - Peace - Retinoblastoma - Right to Life - Student Sexual Assault - codey Bone Marrow Donation - Childhood Depression - Depression - Environment - Eye Injury Prevention - Glaucoma - Kidney Cancer - Kidney Disease - Kidney Transplantation - Leukemia - Lyme Disease - Mental Retardation - Missing Children - Organ Donation - T - codey Troop and Military Support - Amber Alert - Bladder Cancer - Endometriosis - Equality - Liver Cancer - Liver Disease - Missing Children - POW/MIA - Spina Bifida - Suicide - codey Mourning - Anti-Gang - Melanoma - Daniel Alpha 
Default

Tyson could take a better punch but I think Frazier had more guts.
Barn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-15-2015, 11:49 AM #45
fastjabs2015 fastjabs2015 is offline
Contender
 
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 153
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Rep Power: 6
fastjabs2015 is a glorious beacon of lightfastjabs2015 is a glorious beacon of lightfastjabs2015 is a glorious beacon of lightfastjabs2015 is a glorious beacon of lightfastjabs2015 is a glorious beacon of light
Points: 5,200.00
Bank: 1,000.00
Total Points: 6,200.00
Default

Physically tougher - Tyson.
Psychologically tougher - Frazier.

Mike would win a head to head quite easily. Frazier would not survive the early onslaught. I just think Mike was an upgraded version of all the 'swarmer types'.
fastjabs2015 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-15-2015, 05:06 PM #46
rightsideup rightsideup is offline
Undisputed Champion
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 2,350
Quoted: 162 Post(s)
Rep Power: 17
rightsideup has a reputation beyond reputerightsideup has a reputation beyond reputerightsideup has a reputation beyond reputerightsideup has a reputation beyond reputerightsideup has a reputation beyond reputerightsideup has a reputation beyond reputerightsideup has a reputation beyond reputerightsideup has a reputation beyond reputerightsideup has a reputation beyond reputerightsideup has a reputation beyond reputerightsideup has a reputation beyond repute
Points: 10,093.63
Bank: 1,245.39
Total Points: 11,339.02
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by fastjabs2015 View Post
Physically tougher - Tyson.
Psychologically tougher - Frazier.

Mike would win a head to head quite easily. Frazier would not survive the early onslaught. I just think Mike was an upgraded version of all the 'swarmer types'.
You may be right but it might be a great fight
rightsideup is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-15-2015, 07:39 PM #47
fastjabs2015 fastjabs2015 is offline
Contender
 
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 153
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Rep Power: 6
fastjabs2015 is a glorious beacon of lightfastjabs2015 is a glorious beacon of lightfastjabs2015 is a glorious beacon of lightfastjabs2015 is a glorious beacon of lightfastjabs2015 is a glorious beacon of light
Points: 5,200.00
Bank: 1,000.00
Total Points: 6,200.00
Default

It's an opinion. I can imagine a scenario where Frazier could decision Tyson over 12, but I can't see him withstanding Tyson's onslaughts in the first half of the fight.

Anyone who will better Tyson will have to get through those first 4-6 rounds and I cannot see too many folks doing that. If anyone does, it becomes a much more open fight.
fastjabs2015 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-15-2015, 08:34 PM #48
BKM-2010 BKM-2010 is offline
Undisputed Champion
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 4,523
Quoted: 188 Post(s)
Rep Power: 26
BKM-2010 has a reputation beyond reputeBKM-2010 has a reputation beyond reputeBKM-2010 has a reputation beyond reputeBKM-2010 has a reputation beyond reputeBKM-2010 has a reputation beyond reputeBKM-2010 has a reputation beyond reputeBKM-2010 has a reputation beyond reputeBKM-2010 has a reputation beyond reputeBKM-2010 has a reputation beyond reputeBKM-2010 has a reputation beyond reputeBKM-2010 has a reputation beyond repute
Points: 10,208.00
Bank: 1,000.00
Total Points: 11,208.00
enjoyed the gif :fing02: - jose830 My bad! - Dorian have a slice, u earned it - sugarsmosley . - RwK No Message - -jose- 
For Battling The Evil That Is Islam - Rocky... No Message - -Weltschmerz- 
Default

As far as the matchup goes H2H I gotta say if Tyson doesn't get Frazier out of there early he's in for a long night and likely gets beaten down late especially if it's a 15 round fight. But since Frazier was such a slow starter while Tyson such a strong starter, the huge contrast brings things into his favor. Ref would save Joe within 3 rounds me thinks.
BKM-2010 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2015, 07:33 PM #49
RED REP RED REP is offline
LEFT HOOK FROM HELL
 
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Great Britain
Posts: 1,397
Quoted: 165 Post(s)
Rep Power: 9
RED REP has a reputation beyond reputeRED REP has a reputation beyond reputeRED REP has a reputation beyond reputeRED REP has a reputation beyond reputeRED REP has a reputation beyond reputeRED REP has a reputation beyond reputeRED REP has a reputation beyond reputeRED REP has a reputation beyond reputeRED REP has a reputation beyond reputeRED REP has a reputation beyond reputeRED REP has a reputation beyond repute
Points: 6,874.00
Bank: 1,005.00
Total Points: 7,879.00
Classic Man - punchr top poster - Freedom. No Message - Scott-Weiland Cutie - Scott-Weiland A beer for an excellent poster. - denium 
Default

Smokin' Joe
RED REP is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-20-2020, 08:39 PM #50
HOUDINI563 HOUDINI563 is offline
Undisputed Champion
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Northeast USA
Posts: 3,245
Quoted: 1906 Post(s)
Rep Power: 13
HOUDINI563 has a reputation beyond reputeHOUDINI563 has a reputation beyond reputeHOUDINI563 has a reputation beyond reputeHOUDINI563 has a reputation beyond reputeHOUDINI563 has a reputation beyond reputeHOUDINI563 has a reputation beyond reputeHOUDINI563 has a reputation beyond reputeHOUDINI563 has a reputation beyond reputeHOUDINI563 has a reputation beyond reputeHOUDINI563 has a reputation beyond reputeHOUDINI563 has a reputation beyond repute
Points: 30,218.84
Bank: 1,315.63
Total Points: 31,534.47
Default

Frazier had an ATG will to win far exceeding Tyson who became a different more docile fighter when pressed hard. Frazier would never give up and turned up the accelerator in tough fights.

In terms of chin alone Tyson probably had the edge.
HOUDINI563 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Share This With Friends

Tags
frazier, toughest, tyson

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
Forum Jump

 

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:52 AM.