Roberto Duran vs. Henry Armstrong

[QueensburyRules]

you are comparing someone who was born and raised to be an amateur boxer not a pro boxer. Lomachenko was a great ammy, he's a good pro as well, but whats a great fighter like him gonna do with nobody to test himself?

rigo was off for a year and fought at 122, they dragged him in short notice and he quit with his middle finger in the air.

The Axeman wasn't even fighting when they called him to fight Loma.

Armstrong on the other hand has a whole world of experience to back his claim up in a 12 or 15 round fight. a little things Salido did are but a small "fiber" as to what Armstrong could do.

Loma has a smooth technical modern looking style, but he's actually using all oldschool moves which I find so funny because they call him hi tech. His training regimen looked pretty similar to Archie Moores.

I dont Doubt Loma looks good for about 5 or 6 rounds. past that, Armstrong starts to break him down. He's not going anywhere, he's not quitting, and he knows how to fight as a professional and takes chenko out late.

- -OK, we get you have an amateur Loma inferiority complex.

He came, he saw, he conquered the pro ranks as he exposed how rank pro boxing and officiating has become.

Cry thee softly to sleep...

[Rusty Tromboni]

you are comparing someone who was born and raised to be an amateur boxer not a pro boxer. Lomachenko was a great ammy, he's a good pro as well, but whats a great fighter like him gonna do with nobody to test himself?

rigo was off for a year and fought at 122, they dragged him in short notice and he quit with his middle finger in the air.

The Axeman wasn't even fighting when they called him to fight Loma.

Armstrong on the other hand has a whole world of experience to back his claim up in a 12 or 15 round fight. a little things Salido did are but a small "fiber" as to what Armstrong could do.

Loma has a smooth technical modern looking style, but he's actually using all oldschool moves which I find so funny because they call him hi tech. His training regimen looked pretty similar to Archie Moores.

I dont Doubt Loma looks good for about 5 or 6 rounds. past that, Armstrong starts to break him down. He's not going anywhere, he's not quitting, and he knows how to fight as a professional and takes chenko out late.

And what could Freddie Miller do that Rigo can't?

Again, everyone with a pulse was mysteriously off Armstrong's radar.

It's weird how comfortable you are picking a Lightweight who cherry-picked opponents at Featherweight, over a Featherweight who is running roughshod over the Lightweight division.

I've owned working dogs. I have owned wolves. My daughters are into horses, so I spend time at a local stable. There's a high-end cattle ranch nearby that stable, too. Point is, 6,000 years of man breeding beasts has proven what the Tech guys think they've discovered: garbage in, garbage out. It's all in the genetics. Armstrong(kimboslice on amphetamines) met Zivic, who was willing to meet scratch, and he all but quit. Lomachenko got sloppy against Linares, ate a massive right hand, and then got up and went into kill mode. You can't expect a cur, no matter how hard his mouth, to win against a dead-game dog.

Put Armstrong inthe ring with Lomachenko and you are watching the product evolution right before your eyes. Lomachenko is too game, too smart, too crafty, too precise.

[Rusty Tromboni]

- -OK, we get you have an amateur Loma inferiority complex.

He came, he saw, he conquered the pro ranks as he exposed how rank pro boxing and officiating has become.

Cry thee softly to sleep...

I am not going to name any of the "fighters" that Armstrong beat. They're not worth looking up. THe fact that they're forgetable says it all. But of all those bums, how many does anyone really think would even rank in the modern Ammys? With all their professional experience, how many could be transported into a moden amateur boxing match and win, and win regularly?

Really, i wonder how many of those guys could even throw a straight punch. Armstrong was a wonder on the local scene - California, which was a step down from Europe. He only broke threw when all his peers had gotten old.

I love Lou Ambers and admire his strength, movement and cagey-ness, but he'd look lost trying to compete in today's amateur ring.

Obviously, it's a two way street: how many modern amateurs could deal with 15 rounds of Armstrong punching them in the balls? But to dismiss the level of skill inthe modern amateurs is pretty ridiculous. And Loma has clearly proven his skills translate in the Pro's.

[them_apples]

I am not going to name any of the "fighters" that Armstrong beat. They're not worth looking up. THe fact that they're forgetable says it all. But of all those bums, how many does anyone really think would even rank in the modern Ammys? With all their professional experience, how many could be transported into a moden amateur boxing match and win, and win regularly?

Really, i wonder how many of those guys could even throw a straight punch. Armstrong was a wonder on the local scene - California, which was a step down from Europe. He only broke threw when all his peers had gotten old.

I love Lou Ambers and admire his strength, movement and cagey-ness, but he'd look lost trying to compete in today's amateur ring.

Obviously, it's a two way street: how many modern amateurs could deal with 15 rounds of Armstrong punching them in the balls? But to dismiss the level of skill inthe modern amateurs is pretty ridiculous. And Loma has clearly proven his skills translate in the Pro's.

well todays amatuer ring is different than even 20 years ago. They changed the amateur boxing rules in order to make it an olympic athletic performance gauging sport, not just a fight as to who is the better fighter.

Short rounds (it's a rush), headgear, fights are won on volume not punch effectiveness. Volume and speed, 2 measurable statistics. Complete disregard for ring craft or even fighting skills in general, you wuld be surprised how far boxing has slid in the pro ring. These guys arent shaking off 200 ammy fights under different rules and goals, and suddenly changing in the pros.

Khan was an ammy boxer nearly his entire pro career. Same with Cotto. They pick up a few tips and tricks along the way, but it's not the same game.

[QueensburyRules]

well todays amatuer ring is different than even 20 years ago. They changed the amateur boxing rules in order to make it an olympic athletic performance gauging sport, not just a fight as to who is the better fighter.

Short rounds (it's a rush), headgear, fights are won on volume not punch effectiveness. Volume and speed, 2 measurable statistics. Complete disregard for ring craft or even fighting skills in general, you wuld be surprised how far boxing has slid in the pro ring. These guys arent shaking off 200 ammy fights under different rules and goals, and suddenly changing in the pros.

Khan was an ammy boxer nearly his entire pro career. Same with Cotto. They pick up a few tips and tricks along the way, but it's not the same game.

- -Water wet, sky blue, and anything new U ever knew?

[Rusty Tromboni]

well todays amatuer ring is different than even 20 years ago. They changed the amateur boxing rules in order to make it an olympic athletic performance gauging sport, not just a fight as to who is the better fighter.

Short rounds (it's a rush), headgear, fights are won on volume not punch effectiveness. Volume and speed, 2 measurable statistics. Complete disregard for ring craft or even fighting skills in general, you wuld be surprised how far boxing has slid in the pro ring. These guys arent shaking off 200 ammy fights under different rules and goals, and suddenly changing in the pros.

Khan was an ammy boxer nearly his entire pro career. Same with Cotto. They pick up a few tips and tricks along the way, but it's not the same game.

That's definitely insightful. My post was clearly flawed.

But it doesn't change the fact that Armstrong's record pre-Zivic was comprised mostly of crude fighters. Lomachenko conversely, is immensely skilled. He's clearly everything but a Cotto or Khan. And he only fights the very best, a whole division north of where he properly belongs.

- -Water wet, sky blue, and anything new U ever knew?

It was a good insight re: where amateur Boxing is at. But yeah, it doesn;t change the fact that fighters today, if lesser physical ability and toughness, are more refined and polished than fighters of the past.

[them_apples]

That's definitely insightful. My post was clearly flawed.

But it doesn't change the fact that Armstrong's record pre-Zivic was comprised mostly of crude fighters. Lomachenko conversely, is immensely skilled. He's clearly everything but a Cotto or Khan. And he only fights the very best, a whole division north of where he properly belongs.



It was a good insight re: where amateur Boxing is at. But yeah, it doesn;t change the fact that fighters today, if lesser physical ability and toughness, are more refined and polished than fighters of the past.

You keep using Lomachenko, but he’s a one of a kind fighter. He’s not even using Amy moves. He’s using old school moves with a bit of new school flare. He’s the only guy in the game today throwing smooth shots over explosive shots (which you can see coming even though they look fast). He throws punches like Muhammad Ali or Jose Napoles (this is a completely lost art), you can’t see them. He hits guys at will. He’s a smaller guys so I’m not comparing him and Ali, but they both throw masterful smooth shots. Nobody today throws those besides him.

Lomachenko is exposing boxing, non existent pro career, a natural 126 lb fighter, beating 135 lenders and even stopping them. He has exposed boxing.