It takes a special kind of stupid to be Tyson Fury...

[McNulty]

Easy...Ali beat MULTIPLE ATG in their prime, even when he wasn't...name wins on Floyd's resume that is on Ali's Lyle or Williams win, let alone his best wins against guys like Liston, Foreman, Frazier.

I'm no Ali fan but there is a huge difference between the two in that while people say Floyd MAY beat ATG's...Ali actually did, repeatedly.

And for the record, I like Hagler due to his skills, style, and class. As with any fighter, you can critique his resume but dude was pretty much how boxers should be in my opinion.

Ok lets go son!

Floyd beat multiple ATG's too. Actually Floyds resume is better than Ali's. Floyd never lost a fight and got the win either like Ali as well as Clay did. Floyd has 2-3 close fights in his entire career of r50 wins and ZERO losses.

Clay lost to Doug Jones when Clay was 17-0. On the books he got the win, but you go and watch that fight and report back. Bet you've never seen it right? Floyd came nowhere close to losing at 17-0.

Liston took a dive 2x, everybody knows it. Even the FBI investigated it. Thats one of his best wins????

Everybody out there says Ali lost 3x to Norton.

Lyle you say? Lyle just lost right before he fought Ali to a 14-3 Jimmy Young. Oo so scary that Lyle was! Young started Lyle on a losing streak that went into the end of his career. Not long before that he got a draw with Gregorio Peralta, who the fùck is that? Not long before that he lost to Quarry lmao. Lost to Lynn Ball and then Cooney. Who the hell is Lynn Ball?

How the fùck is Lyle an ATG? Cuz he beat Bonovena, Mathis, and Ellis??? Those are the only names he beat. Lyle is comparable to Arturo Gatti which isn't that impressive.

Ali lost the Shavers, no argument. Shavers ruined Ali. Go watch it. Ali was tough as hell, too tough in fact.

I as well as a lot of other people though Foreman took a dive. * at best.

Lets talk technique, because that's my specialty. What you got? Technically, Floyd was better than Ali. If you want to interject, feel free and we'll get deeper.

Not a lot of people know Hagler was a secret crackhead who probably was no stranger to freebasing. Freebase was big back then. I know old timers from the South Shore that tuned me in on that frequency.

Look at this article:

"I want to reassure the public I have no problem with drugs or alcohol."

Source: http://articles.latimes.com/1987-08-...arvin-hagler/2

Then his wife had enough and ratted him out:

The estranged wife of Marvin Hagler has demanded the former middleweight champion seek treatment for cocaine and alcohol abuse before he is allowed to return home, a Boston television station reported Thursday.

Hagler's alleged 'widespread abuse' of drugs and alcohol escalated after he lost his title on April 6 to Sugar Ray Leonard, the report said.

Hagler has yet to announce if he plans to continue fighting.

Source: https://www.upi.com/Archives/1987/07...6175552283200/

Pretty cool right, being a basehead? He was basing when he was pro.

He wasn't cool, dude quit once the sea level started rising. He knew if he kept up he would get starched.

Tech wise, Hagler was ok but nothing to write home about. He was aggressive and went for the ko but that doesnt take away he was the type of fighter that had to take 2-3 on the chin to land one. Those scary mw's (Sypion, Roldan, Sibson, Hamsho, Antuofermo, Minter, etc) the pundits claimed them to be we're small mw's that were honestly club fighters. I've seen better at Golden Glove tournaments. That ain't Boxing, that's brawling.

The whole story of the title shot being kept from him was a lie spread by him and his people that trickled down to Joe Public. The title was changing hands a lot. Check my posts and threads for a more detailed observation.

[madsweeney]

[QUOTE=McNulty;18837092]Ok lets go son!

Floyd beat multiple ATG's too. Actually Floyds resume is better than Ali's. Floyd never lost a fight and got the win either like Ali as well as Clay did. Floyd has 2-3 close fights in his entire career of r50 wins and ZERO losses.

There's one ATG on Floyd's resume, Pac...a very faded Pac (far more faded than Floyd) well beyond his natural weight-class. Ali has 3 undeniable ATG's who are frequently rated among top echelon of most people's ATG rankings and then theres guys like Norton, Lyle, Williams, Patterson, Moore who are frequently mentioned in those rankings...Floyd has Pac and JMM. To compare the level of opposition between the two is a joke and you know it. Most of Floyd's best wins were against guys that failed once they got to the elite level.

Clay lost to Doug Jones when Clay was 17-0. On the books he got the win, but you go and watch that fight and report back. Bet you've never seen it right? Floyd came nowhere close to losing at 17-0.

Liston took a dive 2x, everybody knows it. Even the FBI investigated it. Thats one of his best wins????

Everybody out there says Ali lost 3x to Norton.

Same argument for Castillo, DLH (hellova strech I know but some argue) and maidana...not to mention he should have been DQ'ed against Zab when his corner-man choked his opponent (both should have been DQ'ed IMO).

Lyle you say? Lyle just lost right before he fought Ali to a 14-3 Jimmy Young. Oo so scary that Lyle was! Young started Lyle on a losing streak that went into the end of his career. Not long before that he got a draw with Gregorio Peralta, who the fùck is that? Not long before that he lost to Quarry lmao. Lost to Lynn Ball and then Cooney. Who the hell is Lynn Ball?

How the fùck is Lyle an ATG? Cuz he beat Bonovena, Mathis, and Ellis??? Those are the only names he beat. Lyle is comparable to Arturo Gatti which isn't that impressive.

Lyle isn't an ATG in my book, but he's borderline. Comparable to say JMM but that was my point, showing how Ali's "good" wins (not best) are at the level of Floyd's best.

Ali lost the Shavers, no argument. Shavers ruined Ali. Go watch it. Ali was tough as hell, too tough in fact.

I as well as a lot of other people though Foreman took a dive. * at best.

Again, your opinion and Floyd has a few of his own matches that are questionable.

Lets talk technique, because that's my specialty. What you got? Technically, Floyd was better than Ali. If you want to interject, feel free and we'll get deeper.

I too would give Floyd the nod in skills and technique, doesn't make him greater due to the fact those skills wasn't tested against the same level of competition. Here's an idea, people look better and more skilled against club/good for era fighters than all time great/HOF level fighters. Face the facts, Ali fought, and beat, the best during HW's golden era. Floyd stayed safe during a weak era and retired when WW was heating up and has been accused of cherry-picking/waiting out fights until opponents were past it for a long ass time.

Not a lot of people know Hagler was a secret crackhead who probably was no stranger to freebasing. Freebase was big back then. I know old timers from the South Shore that tuned me in on that frequency.

Look at this article:

"I want to reassure the public I have no problem with drugs or alcohol."

Source: http://articles.latimes.com/1987-08-...arvin-hagler/2

Then his wife had enough and ratted him out:

The estranged wife of Marvin Hagler has demanded the former middleweight champion seek treatment for cocaine and alcohol abuse before he is allowed to return home, a Boston television station reported Thursday.

Hagler's alleged 'widespread abuse' of drugs and alcohol escalated after he lost his title on April 6 to Sugar Ray Leonard, the report said.

Hagler has yet to announce if he plans to continue fighting.

Source: https://www.upi.com/Archives/1987/07...6175552283200/

Pretty cool right, being a basehead? He was basing when he was pro.

He wasn't cool, dude quit once the sea level started rising. He knew if he kept up he would get starched.

Tech wise, Hagler was ok but nothing to write home about. He was aggressive and went for the ko but that doesnt take away he was the type of fighter that had to take 2-3 on the chin to land one. Those scary mw's (Sypion, Roldan, Sibson, Hamsho, Antuofermo, Minter, etc) the pundits claimed them to be we're small mw's that were honestly club fighters. I've seen better at Golden Glove tournaments. That ain't Boxing, that's brawling.

The whole story of the title shot being kept from him was a lie spread by him and his people that trickled down to Joe Public. The title was changing hands a lot. Check my posts and threads for a more detailed observation.

Heresay and even if true who ****ing cares, practically everybody was doing coke late 70's/early 80's, you'd be hard pressed to find a wealthy person alive that stayed sober during that time, you know, like Floyd's daddy, mom, uncle... Quit when sea level rose?!? 13 years of 15 round fights, same day weigh ins, that is a long ****ing career and went out after a HIGHLY controversial loss to a guy ranked as a higher ATG than Floyd...GTFOH, get your boy's dick out your mouth, you're embarrassing yourself.

[QUOTE] Bolded to answer your rambling and conjecture.

[McNulty]

There's one ATG on Floyd's resume, Pac...a very faded Pac (far more faded than Floyd) well beyond his natural weight-class. Ali has 3 undeniable ATG's who are frequently rated among top echelon of most people's ATG rankings and then theres guys like Norton, Lyle, Williams, Patterson, Moore who are frequently mentioned in those rankings...Floyd has Pac and JMM. To compare the level of opposition between the two is a joke and you know it. Most of Floyd's best wins were against guys that failed once they got to the elite level.

Floyd was well beyond his natural weight class too, point?

Upper echelon of who, some old áss writers? They don't get to tell me who's an ATG or not. I've got enough history in the sport where I literally have more Boxing wisdom than any of those writers do. Fùcking terrible source!

Norton beat Ali 3x, scratch that off. Lyle was b-level, Patterson was a super small HW dude, 188 compared to Ali's 220 and two years before he fought Ali for the first time Liston sparked him 2x in the first round. You don't see any *'s floating around there?

You're really bring up Archie Moore as a legitimate win? Bro, you got to get on my level, bringing up Moore is like 7 levels below. Why would anybody do that?

Moore had 217 fights by that time and his next fight he retired so Ali gets that credit? Thats like giving Leon Spinks credit for beating a broke Ali, or Stan Harrington credit for beating a shot Robinson. It doesn't make good sense and isn't reasonable. Moore was 46 and had been pro 27 years!!!

You people really make it hard to have a civil conversation when you bring up garbage like this.

So JMM is more of an ATG than DLH, SSM, Cotto?

Same argument for Castillo, DLH (hellova strech I know but some argue) and maidana...not to mention he should have been DQ'ed against Zab when his corner-man choked his opponent (both should have been DQ'ed IMO).

Floyd clearly won the first (and 2nd) Castillo fight and won it close. I have my scorecard if you want to go over any rounds. Dude, why you bringing up DLH? Again, this is insulting now. Oscar won maybe 3 rounds. I don't give a fùck who says what, Oscar lost that fight CLEARLY.

Maidana clearly lost both fights. Look man, when you're a supernova like Floyd and someone gives you a good fight, haters will say you lost. Same thing for RJJ. Tarver 1. 116-112 solid and people be saying Jones lost. Get the fùck out of here.

Zab, really? You're really stretching to Zab now? Those sort of rules get bent all the time. Thats like saying Floyd should be 0-50 for clinching.

Lyle isn't an ATG in my book, but he's borderline. Comparable to say JMM but that was my point, showing how Ali's "good" wins (not best) are at the level of Floyd's best.

Well that's funny cuz a post or so back you were calling Lyle an ATG, now he's not after I exposed that shít??? Seriously, are you high or something? Proof below. JMM would shít on Lyle if they were the same weight. Lyle lost to bums dude, wake up!

Ali beat MULTIPLE ATG in their prime, even when he wasn't...name wins on Floyd's resume that is on Ali's Lyle or Williams win

SMH.

Again, your opinion and Floyd has a few of his own matches that are questionable.

No, it's a fact and an opinion is devoid of fact. Watch the fight guy, Shavers tapped that áss EASY. Just watch it. I know you haven't because you wouldn't give him credit for getting his shít pushed in.

Floyd has 2-3 close fights out of 50 that in itself is absolutely amazing, all clear wins if you know how to score. Just because it's close doesn't mean it's questionable.

There is a right way to score and a wrong way to score. I score like Jerry Roth who was the best in Boxing history. Learn about scoring and score instead od reading hate mail.

I too would give Floyd the nod in skills and technique, doesn't make him greater due to the fact those skills wasn't tested against the same level of competition.

Here's an idea, people look better and more skilled against club/good for era fighters than all time great/HOF level fighters. Face the facts, Ali fought, and beat, the best during HW's golden era. Floyd stayed safe during a weak era and retired when WW was heating up and has been accused of cherry-picking/waiting out fights until opponents were past it for a long ass time.

Then why the fück are you argueing with me? My original comment was below:

Mayweather was better than Ali, easily.

I understand fighters fighting bums look good doing it, but we both know this isn't the case. Was Hatton a bum when he got sparked by a perfect check hook? Was Cotto a bum? How about Castillo or Corrales? Hernandez, De La Hoya, Mosely, JMM, Canelo, Maidana, and Pacquiao all bums or club fighters? You literally believe that shít?

I actually think the 80's was the golden era of Heavyweights. Ali won bunches of fights he should have lost as stated ^ and didn't the media pin the Bum of the Month club on him?

Haters are going to hate, but the truth is Floyd chased everybody early. He was chasing Mosley was before it happened. Oscar too, but Arum wouldn't let him do it. If you knew jack shít about anything you would know Floyd wasn't in control of his career until he left Top Rank in 2006.

Top Rank literally blocked the Oscar fight cuz Oscar left Top Rank and Arum said the fight wouldn't make any money, verbatim. Do the research!

Since he left Top Rank look at who he fought in the following order:

Baldomir
DLH
Hatton
JMM
SSM
Ortiz
Cotto
Guerro
Canelo
Maidana
Pacquiao
Berto
Mc******

That's pretty dam impressive and I don't see many cherries in there at all. Nobody fights the best every single fight and thats super impressive when he HAD CONTROL of his career.

Heresay and even if true who ****ing cares, practically everybody was doing coke late 70's/early 80's, you'd be hard pressed to find a wealthy person alive that stayed sober during that time, you know, like Floyd's daddy, mom, uncle... Quit when sea level rose?!? 13 years of 15 round fights, same day weigh ins, that is a long ****ing career and went out after a HIGHLY controversial loss to a guy ranked as a higher ATG than Floyd...GTFOH, get your boy's dick out your mouth, you're embarrassing yourself.

Not heresay, it's true. Coke isn't crack sonny and not everybody was smoking crack or basing. Who gives a fùck about Floyd's family, you said Hagler was a cool guy when he was really a piece of shít in real life. I know, I met him, dude is a príck. Look at how jealous he is today crying about fighters getting overpaid for not fighting anybody. He should talk, he fought mostly BUMS and got payed very well for doing it.

Oo all of a sudden years are mattering to you? 14 years (not 13 like you posted) compared to Moores 29 years eh? Marvin was 33, we got REAL TALENT kicking áss far past that.

I don't give a fùck who says what, I know more than them. Hagler was a B-Level fighter that fought small guys coming up. No different than Winky.

You can't even format a fùcking post and make zero sense and I'm rambling?

You're a fùcking scrub parakeet that DKSAB. You just repeat shít and don't know anything REAL about Boxing. I've wasted enough time on this. You should actually be billed for this session. We won't be speaking again.

[extracurRICular]

Not exactly the best way to promote oneself.

[jpowell100]

He surely couldn’t be 27?!

[LacedUp]

Americans don't understand British humour. Nothing new.

[extracurRICular]

Americans don't understand British humour. Nothing new.

I KNOW RIGHT!!!!!!!!

Chip chip cheerio and all that rot.............