Artem Lobov making a good point about record padding in boxing

[Phenom]

mma is to appease fans in general. is that bad?

Yes it's bad when they bring in WWE stars and famous youtube fighters to appease fans

It's about the spectacle not the sport

[LacedUp]

Yes it's bad when they bring in WWE stars and famous youtube fighters to appease fans

It's about the spectacle not the sport

are you acting like these type of shenanigans haven't happened in boxing?

Please.

Why do boxing fans always get so uptight when an mma fighter brings up something that's obvious? It's pathetic dude.

Boxers do pad their records. that is a fact. they usually fight 20 no hopers AT LEAST.

Such a strange female thing to do, start bringing up what's bad with mma when someone points something out about boxing.

Rather just discuss how we can avoid the 20 no hopers situation.

[Phenom]

are you acting like these type of shenanigans haven't happened in boxing?

Please.

Why do boxing fans always get so uptight when an mma fighter brings up something that's obvious? It's pathetic dude.

Boxers do pad their records. that is a fact. they usually fight 20 no hopers AT LEAST.

Such a strange female thing to do, start bringing up what's bad with mma when someone points something out about boxing.

Rather just discuss how we can avoid the 20 no hopers situation.

You earn your stripes in boxing you can call it padded record if you want and no that type of shenanigans doesn’t happen in boxing outside of Floyd fighting Conor

I could argue fighting a journey men is way tougher than fighting a guy in mma with little to no experience

[Curtis Harper]

mma is to appease fans in general. is that bad?

there's no doubt most boxers pad their records to a disgusting extent before stepping up.

Profits are made in both boxing and mma, whether by promoters/managers/organisations..there's no difference really.

There are but so many guys at the top to step to. For every quality guy, there are 1000's of mediocre guys. And top guys facing each other is a matter of availability and the negotiation process.

[elfag]

Lomachenko, Usyk are examples to the contrary. There's also a good number of lighter Japenese fighters that have won world titles before their 10th fights.

They both turned pro after a long amateur career.

[Nicamex]

People forget how unforgivable boxing can be on your health. Mma is safer. You can go against the #1 mma fighter and get embarrassed. You can go against the #1 boxer and never be the same again

[Boxing Logic]

Boxing fans seem less forgiving to losses than MMA fans for example, which is why an MMA star who loses doesn't signal the end of their career.

I can respect a hard fought loss against a tough opponent than a win against a can.

That's just not true. Complete myth. What it is is in MMA, there are smaller gloves, so more of a luck factor where a worse guy can KO a better guy, plus, way more ways of winning, so style differences and improvements are all major factors where someone who gets dominated at the top level at one point, like Holloway vs Mcgregor, can become dominant himself later.

In boxing, its not a loss that's a problem, it's the fact that if someone loses wide to one elite guy, chances are they are going to lose to every other elite guy they face, and every fight at that level is just going to be a repeat. If you have bad handspeed and no power, you cant still become elite by going and learning amazing jujitsu, know what I mean? You're pretty much screwed. So the moment David Price's chin gets found out the first time he steps up, it signifies to fans that he will get chinned every other time he steps up, so you can't really put him in top level fights anymore because the outcome is almost predetermined.

But, a chin you cant change. Other things boxers COULD improve but boxing also seems to lack the same culture as MMA has that is so focused on identifying weaknesses and improving them. If boxers would improve after a loss and be able to perform better next time, fans would love that story, and those fights. But with 90% of boxers who lose, I notice they never improve or fix their weaknesses, so after awhile it gets boring watching the same exact Adrien Broner fight over and over where he loses, you know what I mean? Whereas in MMA, you rarely see that with guys who lose.

But the few who do... like Ronda Rousey's boyfriend, what's his name... he kept getting knocked out the same way like 4 times in a row, and UFC cut him. Fans got bored watching it. So it's really no different. The few times UFC fighters fail to improve after a loss, their fans lose interest as well. It's just most UFC fighters find ways to avoid that. If they lose their first title shot because of bad takedown defense, then their next few fights they will go back to the drawing board and make it a "takedown defense" camp more than even an MMA camp. And so on. Boxers dont seem to do that and that's the real issue. The loss thing is a myth. Most the top earning boxers right now have losses. Canelo, Loma, GGG, Klitschko before he retired, Ward before he retired if you count the Kovalev and Boone IMO losses, Danny Garcia, Mikey Garcia, Amir Khan, Kell Brook. Jermell Charlo I bet will still get big paydays even though he lost because unlike many boxers who lose due to lack of speed or power, he has the athleticism to win top level fights in the future regardless of the fact he lost, so it really dont matter that he did. That's the key.

See that myth about boxers who lose and it ruins their career... what that really is is, boxers who get found out to not be that good, it ruins their career. Sometimes. And most the time it only takes one loss because fighters are so protected now with matchmaking that if you lose at all to one of those C-level cherry picks, it probably means you ain't that good. Now if you lose to someone legit, but you're still really good, and you go on to keep proving that, then the loss is meaningless. So fighters like Jermell who might not be great but are quite good, a loss dont mean ****. Just like Shane Mosley, all those guys had losses. Cotto. It dont matter. They made big money. Sergio Martinez. If you're good, your record doesn't matter. It's just a common excuse to give if someone isn't at the world class level, "oh that loss made fans lose interest, it's unfair," when really it's that he just wasn't world class at that moment, and either didn't become world class after, or never got another opportunity because of a PROMOTER failing to notice their improvements so the fans never got a chance to see.

But trust me, whether you lost or not, whether you were world class when you lost or not, if you improve, if you become world class, and if you get an opportunity to definitively prove it to fans, even just one fight beating a prime top opponent, the fans will watch your next fight, guaranteed. And if they see it wasn't a fluke, and that you really are that good now, you will become a pretty big star. The loss has very little bearing on that.

[HanzGruber]

There isn’t a single ufc champion under the age of 27. Obviously it takes time to progress. If a boxer turns pro at 18 they have to grow. There’s a reason 18 year olds don’t fight in the ufc. Cause they’re not good enough

[LacedUp]

There are but so many guys at the top to step to. For every quality guy, there are 1000's of mediocre guys. And top guys facing each other is a matter of availability and the negotiation process.

I follow mma quite a lot, not jus UFC. Generally, whichever level the fighter is on, they will face a guy similar in ranking. You'll never see a deontay wilder vs eric molina type cherrypick title defense in any of the big three organisations. ever.

There's absolutely no question that mma fights are more competitive in general.

boxing should aspire to be the same, not the opposite which is why it's so pathetic to hear boxing fans criticize mma fighers' records.

embarrassing.

[LacedUp]

You earn your stripes in boxing you can call it padded record if you want and no that type of shenanigans doesn’t happen in boxing outside of Floyd fighting Conor

I could argue fighting a journey men is way tougher than fighting a guy in mma with little to no experience

yeah you could argue that, but your argument would have zero validity. before most fighters even get to a big organisation in mma, they have likely had one of the following:

1. superstar career in muay thai, kickboxing, boxing, jiu jitsu or similar
2. long amateur career that incl an olympic medal
3. been mma champion in one or more organisations

people in mma earn their stripes too, they just don't fight 20 no-hopers to "earn" them because the money isn't the same.

Absolutely cringe to hear boxing fans criticize mma when the level is so much more consistent to the fighter from day 1.