If Holyfied and Tyson did fight in 1991 who comes out on top?

[Anthony342]

I go back and fourth on this one. The one thing that is overlooked that might be important is the trainer for the fight. I always forget the guy who Holy had in his corner for Tyson fights, but he is one of the best Don.... ? I think Holy needs his blueprint and strategy to beat Tyson. But essentially Holy does it the same way earlier: Push Mike back, club him with the head if necessary, and then fire away secure in the knowledge Mike is off balance and cannot fight going back when being pushed back.

I do think Holy got away with a lot in tactics with the head, but the strategy itself was a winner, its the same that is used in Ju Jutsu to throw, you put someone on a "third" leg between their two legs, producing triangulation.

You mean Don Turner?

[Anthony342]

--- Seeing as Foreman had Mr Field hanging for dear life in the championship rds and Short notice Cooper had him out on his feet , this time frame you propose doesn't favor MrField.

Yeah and leading up to his first fight with Tyson, Holyfield didn't look too good against Riddick Bowe and Bobby Czyz either, so a lot of people were saying the same thing going into that fight. It didn't work out that way though, did it?

[Anthony342]

Tyson probably doesn't get stopped at that point but still gets schooled and spanked by Evander. Holyfield always knew the right strategy to beat Tyson and in 91 he was more than up for it physically.

I used to think Tyson could have beaten him in the early 90s because Evander liked to trade with punchers, untill more recent interviews where Evander talked more about his past with Tyson in the amateurs.



I think Tyson's rib injury happened when Desiree Washington kicked him a couple of times as she tried to resist.

Yeah, I agree with the bold. I think Holyfield always finds a way to beat Tyson. At this point, it's more likely a UD. If it happens 2 or 3 years sooner, it's a closer UD or SD, but Holyfield pulls it out. Either way though, it would be a war with some great rounds that would blow away Evander's first fight with Bowe.

[BKM-]

Like Bowe vs Lewis, Tyson vs Holyfield circa 91/92 remains a certain classic which fans were denied.

Picking a winner is tough. It really is a 50/50 fight at this point. Tyson wasn't what he had been a few years before 'technically' but he clearly still had his motivation, speed, power and distance stamina as evidenced by the Ruddock fights.

Holyfield might not have been quite as strong or resilient as he became in 1996/97, but he was incredibly fast and his fighting heart was always huge.

Quite honestly, I see a close decision fight with Holyfield narrowing a Tyson points lead down the stretch. It would be hard for Holyfield to avoid being knocked down once or twice enroute at this point. A draw would be a tempting bet...

I always believed that mid to late Holyfield was best suited to beat Tyson, moreso than his lighter, faster self in the early 90s which is what most people consider his prime. He was more durable, bigger and stronger later on. Better able to implement the clinch-heavy walk-forward strategy he actually beat Tyson with in 96.

The young Holyfield could and imo would still do the same to any version of Tyson, just not as dominantly and he'd take more damage and show the effects of it more.

I think the best fantasy matchup is 1988-Tyson vs 1996-Holyfield in terms of best versions facing against eachother.

[billeau2]

You mean Don Turner?

Yes!! One of my favorite trainers around.

I have to apologize. I have problems with names. Unfortunately... and I don't say this with any humor. I suffered a few concussions at least, when I was coming up in a fighting club, also in a situation when I was 13 and a big 18 year old tried to basically kill me. Long story but I wound up waking up while walking a bit later, not knowing what had happened, and he wound up with scissors in his left chest muscle sticking out... Never told anyone about that because I was always getting into trouble as a kid and did not want to get in any trouble at home... Had headaches and sickness for a few weeks after. I could have easily dies lol.

But I will say this it taught me a valuable lesson. With my two sons I always support them and let them know that if they open certain doors, they will have to bare the consequences, but I refuse to shame them for not behaving in school. My first born is home now, and has his college degree and a high level position in the military, so he came out ok!!! the second born is heading in the same direction, often gets into trouble and I never will shame him because god forbid if they had something happen like what happened to me? I want to know about it.

If I had dropped dead from the concussion no one would have been the wiser, and the kid who did it was a bad bully.
Apparently I hurt him with those scissors...my friend at the camp told me what happened later! This was a camp, I went down to the desk of the secretary and grabbed the scissors and plucked them into the other kid, don't remember a thing!!! lol.

[just the facts]

Like almost everyone here, I'd favor Holyfield but wouldn't be a bit surprised to be wrong.

[Sugarj]

I always believed that mid to late Holyfield was best suited to beat Tyson, moreso than his lighter, faster self in the early 90s which is what most people consider his prime. He was more durable, bigger and stronger later on. Better able to implement the clinch-heavy walk-forward strategy he actually beat Tyson with in 96.

The young Holyfield could and imo would still do the same to any version of Tyson, just not as dominantly and he'd take more damage and show the effects of it more.

I think the best fantasy matchup is 1988-Tyson vs 1996-Holyfield in terms of best versions facing against eachother.

Agreed.

I'd have to consider each fight/era of each in turn. But I'm sure too that 96 Holyfield would always prove the most troublesome for Tyson.

That said 96 Tyson did win rounds (from memory I gave him the 1st, 4th and 5th and possibly a share of another). I'd have to figure that 91 Tyson would be better still, as he was less rusty and had better distance stamina. As for 88 Tyson vs 1996 Holyfield.....I think I'd edge Tyson in that match up. But a really tough fight!!

[QueensburyRules]

Agreed.

I'd have to consider each fight/era of each in turn. But I'm sure too that 96 Holyfield would always prove the most troublesome for Tyson.

That said 96 Tyson did win rounds (from memory I gave him the 1st, 4th and 5th and possibly a share of another). I'd have to figure that 91 Tyson would be better still, as he was less rusty and had better distance stamina. As for 88 Tyson vs 1996 Holyfield.....I think I'd edge Tyson in that match up. But a really tough fight!!

--- A sensible case.

However, neither Field nor his handlers had enough faith to throw him into the big boys like Mike was. Tyson was a record setting heavy with the most formidable HOF boxing minds guiding his clean up of the fetid mess that DKing and tubby Lar made of the division.

He coulda retired after Spinks with a $150 million retirement trust as the greatest ever heavy.

Interesting how the n'er do wells confuse the psychiatric drug addled Tyson stumbling in and out of jail and scrapes after King and Givens extracted all they could take short of killing him with a prime Tyson.

[clemenza]

Evander had Don Turner as his head trainer and for years he had Tommy Brooks as his second corner man and also had a great cut man the Late Joe Souza who was arguably one of the greats of all time.
Souza got low balled by Evander one time and didn’t work as his cutman and he swelled up like a balloon and lost his title over about 20 grand. Evander was cheep as all hell, and thought Souza was squeezing him. Evander always had good corner men.
With that said I think Evander wins a 12 round Decision

[travestyny]

--- A sensible case.

However, neither Field nor his handlers had enough faith to throw him into the big boys like Mike was. Tyson was a record setting heavy with the most formidable HOF boxing minds guiding his clean up of the fetid mess that DKing and tubby Lar made of the division.

He coulda retired after Spinks with a $150 million retirement trust as the greatest ever heavy.

Interesting how the n'er do wells confuse the psychiatric drug addled Tyson stumbling in and out of jail and scrapes after King and Givens extracted all they could take short of killing him with a prime Tyson.

Retired after Spinks and be considered the greatest ever heavy?


I hope you're joking.