I trained jiu jitsu at Marc Laimans gym today!!!

[shawn_]

No, you are wrong. There is a reason why boxers have a prime. Once their physical abilities deteriorate all the strategy in the world wont save you. It is a highely tactical game. Akin to a highspeed chess match. It is a different strategy than Jiu-Jitsu. Boxing strategy is mental manipulation, Jiu-Jitsu strategy is more strategy in a purely physical where to put what sense.

[BrooklynBomber]

No, you are wrong. There is a reason why boxers have a prime. Once their physical abilities deteriorate all the strategy in the world wont save you. It is a highely tactical game. Akin to a highspeed chess match. It is a different strategy than Jiu-Jitsu. Boxing strategy is mental manipulation, Jiu-Jitsu strategy is more strategy in a purely physical where to put what sense.

As I stated, physical ability is only a base for your strategising, thats why fighters like Toney or Duran have been able to stay good for so long although their physical shape was miserable compared to their younger opponents.
It was their ability to assess whatever they had left in tank and then based on that come up with the best possible way to beat their opponents.
As for what you are referring as prime or getting out of prime, is just another variation of inability to make a correct strategy and then execute it, boxing is also a much more brutal sport then jiu-jitsu and a fighter wethers down faster but a lot of it has to do with punishment taken.

[shawn_]

No, Toney has gotten by on pure skill, not strategy. Strategy is something that can be learned. You cant learn to do what James Toney does, he has extrodinary gifts.

[BrooklynBomber]

No, Toney has gotten by on pure skill, not strategy. Strategy is something that can be learned. You cant learn to do what James Toney does, he has extrodinary gifts.

Sir, we will have to go step by step with you then. Toney has great skills and experience, but he would be nothing without strategy, simply speaking, do you think he would go far if he would try and constantly trade with Sam Peter(1st fight) instead or rolling and counterpunching? This is a general strategy of his fight and his skills(defense, counterpunching) were just tooles to accomplish it. When a fighter is on defensive the first half of the fight and then takes his opponent into deep waters, this is not skill, this is strategy. When a fighter fights sparcingly from outsite instead of having an all out war against his harder hitting opponent, this is strategy, when a fighter constantly closes in range and attacks his bigger opponent from all angles not letting him use his size and height advantage, this is not skills, this is strategy.

[shawn_]

That is not strategy. Strategy is intentionaly dropping your your right hand when you feint a left hook in order to draw your opponent into counter punching. Strategy is finding out what makes your opponent uncomfortable and doing it over and over (see Emanuel Augustus for an example). Boxing is a really simple equation that is much more complicated than any of its variables would lead you to think.

BJJ is 90% pure physical strategy. Boxing is 90% pure mental strategy. The physical gifts a boxer has are what allow him to execute his mental mind games. Think what you want about James Toney. He may be fat and out of shape, but at the end of the day, he is still so coordinated its rediculous.

Same with Roy Jones, Muhammad Ali, Ray Leonard, Ray Robinson, Floyd Mayweather, Pernell Whitaker. All could play the mind games that they could because of their pure athletic ability.

Athletic ability isnt your stamina or your pure strength, athletic ability is your hand eye coordination. Of course, you need to have some level of strength and a large amount of endurance to do boxing, but without the Hand eye coordination, no amount of strategy in the world will do you any good.

With BJJ you dont need to be the most coordinated person, or the strongest (although it doesnt hurt), or have the best endurance. BJJ is simply knowing positions and planing out a strategy in which to get to those positions. It is slow paced. You have time to think inbetween moves, and it doesnt require a great deal of athletic ability from my experiance in the sport.

[BrooklynBomber]

That is not strategy. Strategy is intentionaly dropping your your right hand when you feint a left hook in order to draw your opponent into counter punching. Strategy is finding out what makes your opponent uncomfortable and doing it over and over (see Emanuel Augustus for an example). Boxing is a really simple equation that is much more complicated than any of its variables would lead you to think.

BJJ is 90% pure physical strategy. Boxing is 90% pure mental strategy. The physical gifts a boxer has are what allow him to execute his mental mind games. Think what you want about James Toney. He may be fat and out of shape, but at the end of the day, he is still so coordinated its rediculous.

Same with Roy Jones, Muhammad Ali, Ray Leonard, Ray Robinson, Floyd Mayweather, Pernell Whitaker. All could play the mind games that they could because of their pure athletic ability.

Athletic ability isnt your stamina or your pure strength, athletic ability is your hand eye coordination. Of course, you need to have some level of strength and a large amount of endurance to do boxing, but without the Hand eye coordination, no amount of strategy in the world will do you any good.

With BJJ you dont need to be the most coordinated person, or the strongest (although it doesnt hurt), or have the best endurance. BJJ is simply knowing positions and planing out a strategy in which to get to those positions. It is slow paced. You have time to think inbetween moves, and it doesnt require a great deal of athletic ability from my experiance in the sport.

Sir, I have not read the whole post of yours because I simply had to stop, after first paragraph, we are talking different waves now, what I said about strategy, any other boxer will support me, What you said about boxing strategy is simply not it, these are just some of the tricks of the trade. Strategy, on the other hand, is a general plan of a fight and a pointer on how to beat your opponent. I stop arguing with you now though, we simply got different definitions of strategy and there is no point of a further discussion.
With all respect, good bye.

[capflow]

hahahahaha

[Animal Squabbs]

I train BJJ and I've also saw your video so I know your a big ass dude. BJJ or wrestling is not too hard when your a big guy rolling with smaller guys regardless of experience. Unless you were rolling with a guy as big as you, you going 1-1 is not impressive. So don't brag. I've rolled with dozens of brand new 200 plus pounders and I weigh 155 and they do exactly what you said you kept doing, a side choke. It works because you can use your weight advantage. I like BJJ but it's not that hard. Add some striking in your rolling sessions and it's totally different.

I have strong arms so the chokes are what I normally go for like in streetfights so thats all I know. I dont know how to set up an armbar or knee lock and ****. A choke is obvious, wrap your arm around his neck. that why I used the chokes. If knew how to do that **** I would have tried it.

And considering it was sparring between a beginner boxer vs beginner jiu jitsu guys in jiu jitsu and I more than held my own I think its somewhat impressive. If a jiu jitsu guy went into one of the best boxing gyms and sparred two guys 100% and dropped one I think it would be somewhat impressive. Im not sayin that Id ****in tap out Monotauro Nogueira or anything. Say what you want but I held my own in one of the best jiu jitsu gyms and I dont do jiu jitsu I box.


The guy I tapped was like trying to explain it to himself I guess. I had on wrestling shoes I use for boxing and he was like "Oh your a wrestler" I told him no I box, I just use these for boxing and he had a weird confused look on his face.

also I told Laimon, and like three other guys that I box and all of them had this look of confusion mixed with hatred and dissapointment. Almost like I wasnt wanted there. hahaha this Boxing vs MMA **** really is deep rooted.