Forum Navigation
Go Back   Boxing Forum > Boxing Forums > Boxing History

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 03-25-2018, 05:47 PM #51
billeau2 billeau2 is offline
Undisputed Champion
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 13,774
Quoted: 5308 Post(s)
Rep Power: 49
billeau2 has a reputation beyond reputebilleau2 has a reputation beyond reputebilleau2 has a reputation beyond reputebilleau2 has a reputation beyond reputebilleau2 has a reputation beyond reputebilleau2 has a reputation beyond reputebilleau2 has a reputation beyond reputebilleau2 has a reputation beyond reputebilleau2 has a reputation beyond reputebilleau2 has a reputation beyond reputebilleau2 has a reputation beyond repute
Points: 249,987.35
Bank: 2,199.06
Total Points: 252,186.41
Grade A explanation of punching technique. - - Ram Raid - Knowledgeable - -Weltschmerz- Happy holidays and best wishes for 2016 - -Weltschmerz- Lmao - -Scott-Weiland- Thanks for the kinds words - Chollo Vista 
I believe that's a Pabst - CauliflowerEars 
Breast Cancer - Birth Parents - lparm 
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by New England View Post
he does? like tommy hearns, for example. but he's not smaller than ray leonard, is he? or even marvin hagler, who never fought above MW for a reason

wilder and louis have the same size calf
Image View Removed. Please Click Here.


yeah, louis had a larger thigh, but did it matter? who hits harder? who fights bigger guys regularly? who carries more body fat while weighing 15-20 lbs less?


the point that wilder, who has 10 inches of reach, is 4-5 inches taller, and who typically outweighs louis in spite of being leaner, is a much, much bigger guy, and would absolutely dwarf louis if they stood next to each other [ or boxed.]


and yes, louis still knocks him out. wilder can hardly box. but that doesn't mean these guys are the same size, because they are not!!!

does the man hit hard or not? and has he taken all of the punishment he's needed thus far to stay upright? they're not carrying bundles of roofing, after all.
Well it does kind of matter that his thigh is considerably bigger because that mass is useful when hitting. I don't think he would dwarf Louis, I could be mistaken. I will say that reach is a type of size... a guy who is tall and rangy can have considerable muscle mass, considering the relative weight of muscle as compared to fat.

I agree with you on Wilder's talents. It matters as to how you categorize. As a boxer Wilder is not very talented. His talent is his punch and that is what he will live and die by. I would agree that if I am in his corner that is what we would work on. I would want him to thow a lead, something that resembles a jab but is thrown, at times, like Liston threw his jab (as more of a lead designed to take the person out).

Wilder imo is like Haye...a talented athlete, with very few attributes as a boxer, but an ambush puncher...Both Haye and Wilder can get you from across the ring with their punch. Haye has fleet of foot, Wilder has a wild approach where it is hard to guage where the punch is coming from. Try to put on some gloves some time with a friend and have him throw a fast straight punch, once you get a hang for it you can block it.

next have the same guy throw a punch with the arm slightly crooked coming from the back leg with full force. It is very hard to get your distance, timing and positioning right to deal with this punch, even though it should be easy to avoid. Now when Wilder starts running towards you and throws that punch, there is no way to see where he is going with it...if you watch him slo mo he throws at times from the hip, from the shoulder, from above (the most anatomically correct way to generate power on a strike).

So Wilder has his methods and they are a puncher's ways. Now one would assume that a fighter who has developed and learned skills as such would be able to deal with Wilder's punch by avoiding it. That is why it is relevant to look at a guy like Joshua and understand that he should have the talent to avoid this big strike.

One other thing: traditionally punchers are not always the biggest guys, They are often rangy...think Bob Foster, Foreman, even Liston really considering his reach.

Last edited by billeau2; 03-25-2018 at 05:50 PM.
billeau2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-25-2018, 09:20 PM #52
OctoberRed OctoberRed is online now
Moderator
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: London
Posts: 11,919
Quoted: 4400 Post(s)
Rep Power: 85
OctoberRed has a reputation beyond reputeOctoberRed has a reputation beyond reputeOctoberRed has a reputation beyond reputeOctoberRed has a reputation beyond reputeOctoberRed has a reputation beyond reputeOctoberRed has a reputation beyond reputeOctoberRed has a reputation beyond reputeOctoberRed has a reputation beyond reputeOctoberRed has a reputation beyond reputeOctoberRed has a reputation beyond reputeOctoberRed has a reputation beyond repute
Points: 103,457.83
Bank: 1,765.76
Total Points: 105,223.59
Long Overdue. For your contribution to NSB. - 1hourRun I concur - jazluvr 
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by billeau2 View Post
Wilder imo is like Haye...a talented athlete, with very few attributes as a boxer, but an ambush puncher...Both Haye and Wilder can get you from across the ring with their punch. Haye has fleet of foot, Wilder has a wild approach where it is hard to guage where the punch is coming from. Try to put on some gloves some time with a friend and have him throw a fast straight punch, once you get a hang for it you can block it.
Haye IMO is a much better overall fighter and boxer in comparison to Wilder.
OctoberRed is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-02-2018, 06:32 PM #53
crold1 crold1 is offline
Undisputed Champion
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 6,237
Quoted: 189 Post(s)
Rep Power: 30
crold1 has a reputation beyond reputecrold1 has a reputation beyond reputecrold1 has a reputation beyond reputecrold1 has a reputation beyond reputecrold1 has a reputation beyond reputecrold1 has a reputation beyond reputecrold1 has a reputation beyond reputecrold1 has a reputation beyond reputecrold1 has a reputation beyond reputecrold1 has a reputation beyond reputecrold1 has a reputation beyond repute
Points: 16,088.05
Bank: 1,424.92
Total Points: 17,512.97
I totally agree with your p4p rankings, Pac is definitely above Floyd. - Neutral to one of the greats - jas 
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by OctoberRed View Post
Haye IMO is a much better overall fighter and boxer in comparison to Wilder.
I think technically both are flawed guys by after Ortiz Wilder might be a guy who just makes his style work. It’s not ‘proper’ but works for him and he never stops believing in his right
crold1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-02-2018, 09:55 PM #54
Mr.MojoRisin' Mr.MojoRisin' is offline
Crawling King Snake
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: The Jungle
Posts: 2,494
Quoted: 1531 Post(s)
Rep Power: 11
Mr.MojoRisin' has a reputation beyond reputeMr.MojoRisin' has a reputation beyond reputeMr.MojoRisin' has a reputation beyond reputeMr.MojoRisin' has a reputation beyond reputeMr.MojoRisin' has a reputation beyond reputeMr.MojoRisin' has a reputation beyond reputeMr.MojoRisin' has a reputation beyond reputeMr.MojoRisin' has a reputation beyond reputeMr.MojoRisin' has a reputation beyond reputeMr.MojoRisin' has a reputation beyond reputeMr.MojoRisin' has a reputation beyond repute
Points: 9,441.07
Bank: 1,051.14
Total Points: 10,492.21
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by New England View Post
marvin hagler, who never fought above MW for a reason
Obvious distaste for Marvelous
Mr.MojoRisin' is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-03-2018, 02:19 PM #55
New England New England is offline
Strong champion.
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Boston.
Posts: 41,910
Quoted: 6992 Post(s)
Rep Power: 156
New England has a reputation beyond reputeNew England has a reputation beyond reputeNew England has a reputation beyond reputeNew England has a reputation beyond reputeNew England has a reputation beyond reputeNew England has a reputation beyond reputeNew England has a reputation beyond reputeNew England has a reputation beyond reputeNew England has a reputation beyond reputeNew England has a reputation beyond reputeNew England has a reputation beyond repute
Points: 92,786.58
Bank: 2,092.07
Total Points: 94,878.65
great poster award - jazluvr Merry Christmas bro. Kick back and enjoy. Surround yourself with your loved ones and have a cold one. - deanrw Happy Holidays  New England - !! AI-Holmes!! Ma nigguh, you should come to Ol' England. - D-MiZe for entering the weed thread! - HUGH JASS 
BoxingScene's Educator-in-chief - Dr Rumack i didn't know you live in that area affected, my heart goes out to you...stay strong homie - jose830 #freeNewEnglang - thuggery Coming home on parole brew. - Sweet Pea 50 top poster and cool story in my thread of how you first joined boxingscene. - HUGH JASS 
happy independence day you zulu warrior!!! - HUGH JASS For the fitness and nutrition advice, thanks. - jas A top poster - jas For being a roided up freakazoid - Cuauhtémoc1520 44 posts late.Happy 29,000 post - HughJass 
LOL caught me good KO2. - Hi Rudyo! LOL caught me good KO2. - Hi Rudyo! Suck on this Cry Baby - Rocky... couldn't green you on that big pun post, good stuff - -jose- b-scene ATG - Mike D 
Childhood Cancer - khepesh Arthritis - Child Abuse - Colon Cancer - Colorectal Cancer - Dystonia - Education - Free Speech - Interstitial Cystitis - ME/CFIDS - Reye's Syndrome - Save the Music - Teens Against Smoking - Victim's Rights - Water Quality - jazluvr World Trade Center Victims and Heroes - Fireworks Safety - jose830 Mourning - Anti-Gang - Melanoma - jose830 World Trade Center Victims and Heroes - Fireworks Safety - -jose- 
Troop and Military Support - Amber Alert - Bladder Cancer - Endometriosis - Equality - Liver Cancer - Liver Disease - Missing Children - POW/MIA - Spina Bifida - Suicide - -jose- Childhood Cancer - sugarsmosley World Trade Center Victims and Heroes - Fireworks Safety - HughJass AIDS/HIV - DARE - DUI Awareness - Epidermolysis Bullosa - Heart Disease - Lymphoma - MADD - Substance Abuse - jas World Trade Center Victims and Heroes - Fireworks Safety - sugarsmosley 
Breast Cancer - Birth Parents - jas Troop and Military Support - Amber Alert - Bladder Cancer - Endometriosis - Equality - Liver Cancer - Liver Disease - Missing Children - POW/MIA - Spina Bifida - Suicide - -jose- World Trade Center Victims and Heroes - Fireworks Safety - -jose- 
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr.MojoRisin' View Post
Obvious distaste for Marvelous

yeah, i hate a hard working, talented fighter who trained and fought out of a city i grew up doing business in
Image View Removed. Please Click Here.



i have an agenda because i know damn well 5'9" marvin hagler had no business fighting the very big, hard punching LHW of the 1980's. sheesh
Image View Removed. Please Click Here.


why don't you ask the petronelli brothers why hagler didn't fight in the LHW division? had nothign to do with the fact that all the money was coming up from lower weight classes, or that the guy was 5'9" and had no trouble making 160 lbs on the same day of the fight.
New England is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-03-2018, 04:29 PM #56
Mr.MojoRisin' Mr.MojoRisin' is offline
Crawling King Snake
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: The Jungle
Posts: 2,494
Quoted: 1531 Post(s)
Rep Power: 11
Mr.MojoRisin' has a reputation beyond reputeMr.MojoRisin' has a reputation beyond reputeMr.MojoRisin' has a reputation beyond reputeMr.MojoRisin' has a reputation beyond reputeMr.MojoRisin' has a reputation beyond reputeMr.MojoRisin' has a reputation beyond reputeMr.MojoRisin' has a reputation beyond reputeMr.MojoRisin' has a reputation beyond reputeMr.MojoRisin' has a reputation beyond reputeMr.MojoRisin' has a reputation beyond reputeMr.MojoRisin' has a reputation beyond repute
Points: 9,441.07
Bank: 1,051.14
Total Points: 10,492.21
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by New England View Post
yeah, i hate a hard working, talented fighter who trained and fought out of a city i grew up doing business in
Image View Removed. Please Click Here.



i have an agenda because i know damn well 5'9" marvin hagler had no business fighting the very big, hard punching LHW of the 1980's. sheesh
Image View Removed. Please Click Here.


why don't you ask the petronelli brothers why hagler didn't fight in the LHW division? had nothign to do with the fact that all the money was coming up from lower weight classes, or that the guy was 5'9" and had no trouble making 160 lbs on the same day of the fight.
It's just funny that you added "who never fought above MW for a reason".

No need to get your panties in a bunch.
Mr.MojoRisin' is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-04-2018, 01:24 AM #57
OctoberRed OctoberRed is online now
Moderator
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: London
Posts: 11,919
Quoted: 4400 Post(s)
Rep Power: 85
OctoberRed has a reputation beyond reputeOctoberRed has a reputation beyond reputeOctoberRed has a reputation beyond reputeOctoberRed has a reputation beyond reputeOctoberRed has a reputation beyond reputeOctoberRed has a reputation beyond reputeOctoberRed has a reputation beyond reputeOctoberRed has a reputation beyond reputeOctoberRed has a reputation beyond reputeOctoberRed has a reputation beyond reputeOctoberRed has a reputation beyond repute
Points: 103,457.83
Bank: 1,765.76
Total Points: 105,223.59
Long Overdue. For your contribution to NSB. - 1hourRun I concur - jazluvr 
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr.MojoRisin' View Post
It's just funny that you added "who never fought above MW for a reason".

No need to get your panties in a bunch.
New England usually goes commando, so no panties needed.
Image View Removed. Please Click Here.
OctoberRed is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-07-2018, 09:06 PM #58
HOUDINI563 HOUDINI563 is offline
Undisputed Champion
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Northeast USA
Posts: 2,271
Quoted: 1332 Post(s)
Rep Power: 10
HOUDINI563 has a reputation beyond reputeHOUDINI563 has a reputation beyond reputeHOUDINI563 has a reputation beyond reputeHOUDINI563 has a reputation beyond reputeHOUDINI563 has a reputation beyond reputeHOUDINI563 has a reputation beyond reputeHOUDINI563 has a reputation beyond reputeHOUDINI563 has a reputation beyond reputeHOUDINI563 has a reputation beyond reputeHOUDINI563 has a reputation beyond reputeHOUDINI563 has a reputation beyond repute
Points: 20,424.90
Bank: 1,138.46
Total Points: 21,563.36
Default

Haye never had the heart, desire, will to win that marks a truely great fighter. Wilder has shown these attributes in spurts. Time will tell if Wilder will eventually become a great hwt.
HOUDINI563 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-11-2018, 12:13 AM #59
OctoberRed OctoberRed is online now
Moderator
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: London
Posts: 11,919
Quoted: 4400 Post(s)
Rep Power: 85
OctoberRed has a reputation beyond reputeOctoberRed has a reputation beyond reputeOctoberRed has a reputation beyond reputeOctoberRed has a reputation beyond reputeOctoberRed has a reputation beyond reputeOctoberRed has a reputation beyond reputeOctoberRed has a reputation beyond reputeOctoberRed has a reputation beyond reputeOctoberRed has a reputation beyond reputeOctoberRed has a reputation beyond reputeOctoberRed has a reputation beyond repute
Points: 103,457.83
Bank: 1,765.76
Total Points: 105,223.59
Long Overdue. For your contribution to NSB. - 1hourRun I concur - jazluvr 
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by HOUDINI563 View Post
Haye never had the heart, desire, will to win that marks a truely great fighter. Wilder has shown these attributes in spurts. Time will tell if Wilder will eventually become a great hwt.
You don't think Haye did in the Bellew fight?
OctoberRed is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-11-2018, 04:00 PM #60
uncle ben uncle ben is offline
Contender
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Posts: 400
Quoted: 205 Post(s)
Rep Power: 3
uncle ben has a reputation beyond reputeuncle ben has a reputation beyond reputeuncle ben has a reputation beyond reputeuncle ben has a reputation beyond reputeuncle ben has a reputation beyond reputeuncle ben has a reputation beyond reputeuncle ben has a reputation beyond reputeuncle ben has a reputation beyond reputeuncle ben has a reputation beyond reputeuncle ben has a reputation beyond reputeuncle ben has a reputation beyond repute
Points: 13,945.64
Bank: 1,155.62
Total Points: 15,101.26
Default

Yeah, in fact, Louis was about the same size as an early 90's Holyfield. Louis could indeed compete with SHW's.
uncle ben is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Share This With Friends

Tags
louis, prime, weighed, wilder

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
Forum Jump

 

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 12:53 AM.