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Old 05-24-2020, 04:18 PM #11
billeau2 billeau2 is offline
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Originally Posted by BKM- View Post
Louis close to Holyfield in styles? How so, I find them to be nothing alike. Evander is a beast in the clinch and can fight very well off the backfoot, he had great movement when he decided to use it. He could also brawl with the best of them. None of this sounds like Louis.
I agree with Ghost. Holy often resorted to brawling because he liked to do so. When he was most succesful be was a boxer puncher (like the time he beat Bowe) with power to spare. Both men threw combos nicely and could scrap from all distances. Louis counter punches a lot better and has the best punching form, but Holyfield, when boxing punching, threw nice combos with power approximating Louis' level.
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Old 05-24-2020, 04:20 PM #12
billeau2 billeau2 is offline
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Originally Posted by ShoulderRoll View Post
The trainers that were around in the 1930's and 1940's were more knowledgeable than the trainers now. There really aren't many boxing teachers today with the quality of a Ray Arcel, Eddie Futch, Cus D'Amato, Angelo Dundee, George Benton and so on.

The styles then were more diverse and plentiful too. It was common to see a shoulder roll defensive posture, for example. These days? Floyd dominated the modern era of the sport with it for 20 years (and James Toney didn't do too bad with his version either) but everyone that tries to copy it can't seem to do it right.

It has become an almost lost art.

Does that sound like boxing developed? Or like boxing started to devolve?
Can't give you green K on this wish I could. Exactly how I feel about it. Its in the film when people watch and know what to look for, very obvious.
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Old 05-25-2020, 12:02 AM #13
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Originally Posted by GhostofDempsey View Post
The longer the fight goes on, the greater Louis’ chances are of pulling a win out of his ass. Louis is closer in style to Holyfield and could find a way to outbox Mike, but he has to survive those first six rounds. Louis’ closest opponent similar to Tyson was Rocky. He was washed up when he lost to Marciano but boxed him well for the first several rounds. Against opponents like Baer or Walcott he took their best punches during exchanges and won those exchanges on volume and accuracy.
I think that Tyson would have been there for Louis to hit and Louis was very accurate. I think Louis would have to get off the canvas, but he'd been scoring bullseye combo's on a 91 Tyson.
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Old 05-27-2020, 06:16 PM #14
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Originally Posted by ShoulderRoll View Post
Does that sound like boxing developed?
Time, and with it, athletes have developed.
I still think, all these 1991 The Ring top 10 fighters, had been too much for a 1930s-40s Joe Louis to handle.
1. Evander Holyfield
2, Mike Tyson
3. Riddick Bowe
4. Razor Ruddock
5. Ray Mercer
6. George Foreman
7. Tim Witherspoon
8. Tony Tucker
9. Lennox Lewis
10. Michael Moorer
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Old 05-27-2020, 07:16 PM #15
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Originally Posted by Ben Bolt View Post
Time, and with it, athletes have developed.
I still think, all these 1991 The Ring top 10 fighters, had been too much for a 1930s-40s Joe Louis to handle.
1. Evander Holyfield
2, Mike Tyson
3. Riddick Bowe
4. Razor Ruddock
5. Ray Mercer
6. George Foreman
7. Tim Witherspoon
8. Tony Tucker
9. Lennox Lewis
10. Michael Moorer
Get out of here.
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Old 05-27-2020, 10:16 PM #16
ShoulderRoll ShoulderRoll is online now
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Originally Posted by Ben Bolt View Post
Time, and with it, athletes have developed.
I still think, all these 1991 The Ring top 10 fighters, had been too much for a 1930s-40s Joe Louis to handle.
1. Evander Holyfield
2, Mike Tyson
3. Riddick Bowe
4. Razor Ruddock
5. Ray Mercer
6. George Foreman
7. Tim Witherspoon
8. Tony Tucker
9. Lennox Lewis
10. Michael Moorer
There is a good probability that Joe could more than hold his own against all of them in a 15 round fight, in my opinion.
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Old 05-27-2020, 11:21 PM #17
AlexKid AlexKid is offline
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Tyson and its not even close, strikes me as a thread designed to get ppl like me agitated.

Joe Louis is brilliant for his time and perhaps more dominant relatively speaking.

But the head movement a style hes never seen before thats way more advanced , and a much bigger man in Tyson thats used to taking out huge men, its overkill in Tysons favor obviously.
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Old 05-28-2020, 03:56 AM #18
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Get out of here.
Good point!

Earlier, I found myself spending way too much time in front of a screen, and on social media.
I’ve managed to reduce that time a lot, and returned to the (less stressful and richer) life I had before internet addiction.

Unfortunately, a few people around me – former friends and working colleagues – are lost cases, as they are totally controlled by their smartphones.

I believe it was Andy Warhol who said “life was going on while I watched TV”.
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Old 05-30-2020, 11:52 AM #19
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Originally Posted by GhostofDempsey View Post
The longer the fight goes on, the greater Louis’ chances are of pulling a win out of his ass. Louis is closer in style to Holyfield and could find a way to outbox Mike, but he has to survive those first six rounds. Louis’ closest opponent similar to Tyson was Rocky. He was washed up when he lost to Marciano but boxed him well for the first several rounds. Against opponents like Baer or Walcott he took their best punches during exchanges and won those exchanges on volume and accuracy.
PRetty much how I see it. Louis vulnerable early (normally flash KDs, but also lost rounds), and Tyson great early, but Louis got better as the fight wore on, where Mike became more predictable.

As Louis' timing starts to get going, he would be taking Tysons head off. Tyson had a great chin, but HWs are HWs.

There is a great vid on YT looking at the strengths and weaknesses of Tyson, one clip he overlays a bit of commentary that SRLeonard did on a Tyson fight. He says about how Tyson always did the same few steps as he closed the distance and then dipped down, and the vid showed a load of clips of him doing it. No way Louis doesn't see that and start to time him with the right uppercut.
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Old 06-07-2020, 09:07 PM #20
Rusty Tromboni Rusty Tromboni is offline
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Tyson shouldn't have too much trouble getting him out of there early. He might get stunned doing it. But it's his fight to lose.

Theoretically, I could see Louis packing on 30ish pounds with modern training, diet and medicine. Holyfield did. And THAT version of Louis might be too much for Mike.

But if you send Tyson back in time to meet Louis at his best, Tyson does what Galento and Buddy almost did.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ShoulderRoll View Post
The trainers that were around in the 1930's and 1940's were more knowledgeable than the trainers now. There really aren't many boxing teachers today with the quality of a Ray Arcel, Eddie Futch, Cus D'Amato, Angelo Dundee, George Benton and so on.

The styles then were more diverse and plentiful too. It was common to see a shoulder roll defensive posture, for example. These days? Floyd dominated the modern era of the sport with it for 20 years (and James Toney didn't do too bad with his version either) but everyone that tries to copy it can't seem to do it right.

It has become an almost lost art.

Does that sound like boxing developed? Or like boxing started to devolve?
Wait until you see this kid named Lomachenko. He'll blow your mind.
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