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Old 11-20-2016, 08:59 AM #21
King_ King_ is offline
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Originally Posted by -PBP- View Post
Main Events was the lead promoter and has the right to object to the officials. No excuses.
Object? Come on bro, what are they gonna do, bring in some AIBA judges? Lol it was gonna be the same thing either way man.

I wouldn't have made excuses about anything if Ward one the fight. My only excuse is: well, I thought Kovalev legitimately won.


Oh well, I guess
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At least everybody saw how good Kovalev was, neutralizing Ward completely and being first and showing his elite sense of timing/measurement of distance and accuray, combined with some real boxing skill and power to combine. Kovalev is going to be a problem the next time they fight, and as a Kovalev fan, I'm hoping he makes it a point of emphasis to be as brutal as possible and get Ward out of there.
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Old 11-20-2016, 09:02 AM #22
King_ King_ is offline
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Originally Posted by sunny31 View Post
Watched it twice now, I think it 114-113 either way is probably about right. It was honestly just one of those fights with a plethora of close rounds. Only 3 or 4 rounds won decisively by either guy.

I gave Ward rounds 3, 5, 7, 8, 9, 11, 12.

Kovalev rounds 1, 2, 4, 6, 10.

Rounds 3, 4, 5, 6, 8, and 12 were particularly close.


When you have that many close rounds - how can you say for sure either way. You can have an opinion, but there is no right or wrong answer here because scoring is so subjective.
I had Kovalev winning most of the close rounds, its just that, from what I saw, Kovalev not only outlanded Ward most rounds, but he was the one that dictated the pace of the fight, was more aggressive, threw more combos and controlled the action, IMO.

But I have to rewatch again and jot some notes on every round, because I can't remember which rounds were which
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Old 11-20-2016, 09:04 AM #23
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Originally Posted by King_ View Post
Object? Come on bro, what are they gonna do, bring in some AIBA judges? Lol it was gonna be the same thing either way man.

I wouldn't have made excuses about anything if Ward one the fight. My only excuse is: well, I thought Kovalev legitimately won.


Oh well, I guess
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At least everybody saw how good Kovalev was, neutralizing Ward completely and being first and showing his elite sense of timing/measurement of distance and accuray, combined with some real boxing skill and power to combine. Kovalev is going to be a problem the next time they fight, and as a Kovalev fan, I'm hoping he makes it a point of emphasis to be as brutal as possible and get Ward out of there.
A lot of fans will understandably think "Ward figured him out, the rematch will be clearer for him," but I'm not so sure about that. Kovalev is seriously dangerous early in fights, and Ward didn't really figure out a way to overcome his superiority at range. Ward just stayed stronger as Kovalev faded and figured out enough things to make the late run. And John David Jackson showed again that he is terrific at gameplanning, so he'll have some new wrinkles to throw at Ward in a rematch.

Maybe Ward wins clearer, but it's just as likely that Kovalev again dominates early and Ward has to try and climb back out of a hole.
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Old 11-20-2016, 09:05 AM #24
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Your fighter got beat, move on. Close decisions in close fights happen.
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Old 11-20-2016, 09:07 AM #25
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Originally Posted by King_ View Post
This one's gonna be tough for me to get over, but I guess Kovalev has to make it a priority to try and get him out of there next time. As a Kovalev fan, I just wish he looked for it more last night, to avoid judges, but like I said, I don't think Ward did enough and Kovalev should of won. But what can I do now? It's over
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But it shouldn't have to be like that, obviously. I think every boxer should get a fair shake on a decision.
Part of the problem is lederman. He is older than the guys scoring. Just like they may need younger judges, hbo may need a younger scorer.

You have every right to be upset. You know I had Ward, you know I don't particularly like Kov and I'm glad to see guys like Freedom whine and cry. I still had kov winning a close close fight.

I'd like to see the rematch on the east coast.
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Old 11-20-2016, 09:09 AM #26
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Honest to goodness, I'm not even being biased. I legitimately thought Kovalev was winning comfortable, although competitive, but comfortably. I was giving Ward props for coming back and showing heart, etc, and then I heard "114-113," and I knew it was coming.

How can they say Ward was winning? You've seen Andre Ward before bro, and that was not the same type of rhythm he carries with him in his other fights, he was fighting Kovalevs fight bro and he broke through "survival mode" to land some nice body shots in the later round, but Kovalev landed maybe the same amount of body shots, and then some.

It's like Ward got gifted "sympathy rounds" just for hanging in there and showing guts, but that's not how boxing should be judged
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I can appreciate what you are saying and some of it is completely valid. But the momentum of the fight completely changed after Round 5- Ward was able to adjust to where he could implement his game plan and find the right distance to be able to land his shots while getting out of the way of Kovalev's attack more often than not. To say that Andre Ward did not carry the same rhythm as in other fights is only half right. It took him longer than normal to adjust the game plan to try and find his rhythm, which he eventually did. That is a testament to just prove that Kovalev is a world class fighter, but it doesn't mean Ward didn't deserve the win. It was an awesome fight- the kind of fight boxing needs more of. But I'm not upset with the decision-I think the judges did a great job last night. Kovalev is an elite fighter without question-but I think he rested on the fact that the knockdown would be the difference in the fight and it cost him.
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Old 11-20-2016, 09:10 AM #27
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Originally Posted by bojangles1987 View Post
A lot of fans will understandably think "Ward figured him out, the rematch will be clearer for him," but I'm not so sure about that. Kovalev is seriously dangerous early in fights, and Ward didn't really figure out a way to overcome his superiority at range. Ward just stayed stronger as Kovalev faded and figured out enough things to make the late run. And John David Jackson showed again that he is terrific at gameplanning, so he'll have some new wrinkles to throw at Ward in a rematch.

Maybe Ward wins clearer, but it's just as likely that Kovalev again dominates early and Ward has to try and climb back out of a hole.
I'm not so sure Ward figured him out. These rounds were decided by a punch or 2. I get that he won the second half of the fight but round 10 could've easily gone the other way. He had his back against the wall down 5-1/4-2 and had no room for error. He's very fortunate to get those swing rounds in his favor.
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Old 11-20-2016, 09:12 AM #28
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It's a funny one. Although Ward 'won' the fight, he lost his aura IMO.

People used to see him as somehow untouchable, but kovalev has clearly outboxed him in parts of the fight and even put him down.
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Old 11-20-2016, 09:14 AM #29
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Originally Posted by bojangles1987 View Post
A lot of fans will understandably think "Ward figured him out, the rematch will be clearer for him," but I'm not so sure about that. Kovalev is seriously dangerous early in fights, and Ward didn't really figure out a way to overcome his superiority at range. Ward just stayed stronger as Kovalev faded and figured out enough things to make the late run. And John David Jackson showed again that he is terrific at gameplanning, so he'll have some new wrinkles to throw at Ward in a rematch.

Maybe Ward wins clearer, but it's just as likely that Kovalev again dominates early and Ward has to try and climb back out of a hole.

Yeah, I just made another post where I said I thought the opposite: Kovlaev had Ward figured out. I think he outboxed him in the later rounds, but from the opening bell, I think Kovalev was the one with more answers for Ward.

Ward was kinda hanging on, hanging on, landed some body shots, which did slow Kovalev down a bit, but then him "being there" so late in the fight skewed people's perception because I think he was getting "sympathy points" for just managing to survive against this murderous puncher, and hey he actually landed a few shots.

You know what I'm saying? But it wasn't one-way traffic in the later rounds, every time Ward landed a body shot, Kovalev came back with one and followed with a jab to the head.

I'm choosing Kovalev in a rematch, without breaking too much down: Kovalev is gonna need a knockout plain and simple, or multiple knock downs. But like you said, JDJ is fantastic at game plans and having Kovalev stick to them, and I think the next fight, that gameplan will be far more urgent. I think it's going to be more difficult for Ward to adjust in the second fight because Kovalev knows what he has to do... but what does Ward have to do? Hell, what can he do? I'm not sure what he can do differently.

He never really got into a rhythm in this fight, and I don't think he thinks he can hurt Kovalev. So, it'll be far more difficult for Ward to come with an answer for Kovalev the next time around, IMO. Kovalev already knows what he has to do.

Last edited by King_; 11-20-2016 at 09:23 AM.
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Old 11-20-2016, 09:15 AM #30
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Originally Posted by King_ View Post
Object? Come on bro, what are they gonna do, bring in some AIBA judges? Lol it was gonna be the same thing either way man.

I wouldn't have made excuses about anything if Ward one the fight. My only excuse is: well, I thought Kovalev legitimately won.


Oh well, I guess
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At least everybody saw how good Kovalev was, neutralizing Ward completely and being first and showing his elite sense of timing/measurement of distance and accuray, combined with some real boxing skill and power to combine. Kovalev is going to be a problem the next time they fight, and as a Kovalev fan, I'm hoping he makes it a point of emphasis to be as brutal as possible and get Ward out of there.
The point is they had no issue until after the fact. Regardless if I was a Kovalev fan I'd be upset too. I felt the same way after Lara vs Canelo. I saw it the way I saw it and nobody could tell me otherwise.

But hey, somebody has to lose these nail biters. At least we get a rematch.
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