Fury Confirms He Is the Man To Beat, Schools AJ On Lineal Champion History!!!

[denium]

Fury got a good offer from Joshua recently, i didn't see him accept it.

Joshua is pricing himself out of honest negotiations. Fury, Wilder, Whyte, Miller have all said the same thing.

Now obviously a nobody like Miller is just happy to take his change, but why should champions like Fury and Wilder take a low ball offer?

[LacedUp]

Mate, it's right there under 'lineal championship' on Wiki.

In combat sports where champions are decided by a challenge, the lineal championship of a weight class is a world championship title held initially by an undisputed champion and subsequently by a fighter who defeats the reigning champion in a match at that weight class.


Wlad was NEVER undisputed and therefore never lineal. Did he ever get marketed as lineal champion?

Was he considered 'the man'? Yes, but only because Vitali retired. But the man and lineal are, or should be considered separate things IMO.

The true lineal champion will be decided between a fight between AJ and Wilder with all the recognised gold on the line. That's when a new lineage will start just like Marciano to Patterson.

I don't care what wikipedia says .

The ring magazine have had the same rules since 1920, no matter what some guy on wikipedia has written.

The lineage is established by #1 and #2 in case of vacancy. However, there could be an argument that Vitali Klitschko was the true lineal heavyweight champ as established vs sanders (who beat Wlad). Vitali retired himself though, like Fury. So taking Fury's argument, perhaps Vitali's lineage was given up on his permanent retirement.

If you follow this logic, then there is a case to be said that lineage was vacant still after Fury beat Wlad, since Fury was #5.

However, then AJ would establish lineage vs Wlad, as Fury had given up his belts and his license and announced his retirement, hence AJ/Wlad were #1 and #2.

All in all, the consensus lineage is established anew when the two best fighters fight, not whatever championship belts are on the line,. that's just not true.

This goes back to when Patterson fought Moore for the 'lineal title' after Marciano retired.

The easiest answer and the one most people believe, is that Wlad established lineage vs Chagaev.

[DaNeutral.]

This Lineal status and Tyson Fury thing seems to be picking up quite alot of friction. Why dont the bosses at the Lineal offices come out and make a statement declaring Tyson Fury as Lineal champion so the debate is put to bed. Maybe they could explain to us the route it took to get to Tyson Fury and how being banned, retiring, failing drugs tests, not defending any belts and being stripped does not affect his lineage at all.

Or are we going to be told there is no LINEAGE CHIEF, there is no offices, there is no decisions made by particular person that decides who becomes Lineal and its all about opinion. In which case we are just going round in circles.

Lineal to me is like P4P its a great thing to be considered P4P or Lineal but thats it. Its not a tool, its not a real belt, you dont negotiate about fighting over Lineage or P4P it doesnt demand a bigger percentage of a split. To be honest i dont know why we even debate it.

[denium]

At the end of the day, experts like Mike Coppinger & Dan Rafael refer to Fury as the lineal champion. I'll take their opinions over some Joshua nuthuggers on NSB.

[MDPopescu]

... it rather looks like "coitus interruptus" and, then, restarted...

[SinderellaMan]

Why do they always leave out that he was banned for 2 years for taking steroids.

Robbie?
We actually agree????
Excellent point my dude

[SkiPete]

You dont need to hold all four belts for lineal. When consensus no1 fights no2 a lineage is created. then whoever beats the lineal champ has it.

[R_Walken]

The moment Fury swerved a 50/50 immediate rematch with Wilder to go to ESpn and probably
fight 2nd tiers for a couple years and probably from fighting the # 1,2,4,5. HWs .You lose the ability from being able to call yourself the man to beat and be taken serious

Fury along with AJ and Wilder are still the 3 HWs at top and until they fight each other or one of
Them loses their all essentially the same with none of them being able to call themselves the Man at HW with prior achievements backing that claim up

[R_Walken]

I don't care what wikipedia says .

The ring magazine have had the same rules since 1920, no matter what some guy on wikipedia has written.

The lineage is established by #1 and #2 in case of vacancy. However, there could be an argument that Vitali Klitschko was the true lineal heavyweight champ as established vs sanders (who beat Wlad). Vitali retired himself though, like Fury. So taking Fury's argument, perhaps Vitali's lineage was given up on his permanent retirement.

If you follow this logic, then there is a case to be said that lineage was vacant still after Fury beat Wlad, since Fury was #5.

However, then AJ would establish lineage vs Wlad, as Fury had given up his belts and his license and announced his retirement, hence AJ/Wlad were #1 and #2.

All in all, the consensus lineage is established anew when the two best fighters fight, not whatever championship belts are on the line,. that's just not true.

This goes back to when Patterson fought Moore for the 'lineal title' after Marciano retired.

The easiest answer and the one most people believe, is that Wlad established lineage vs Chagaev.

Just wondering how you could state that Klit would or should be ranked at 2 when he fought AJ


I could be wrong and there may be some evidence that supports your claim and he genuinely deserved the #2 spot but I just think him not having won a fight in 2 years his inactivity and his last fight being a loss is enough not to just go off his past achievements would make him being deserving of the #2 spot

[deathofaclown]

Belts, whilst nice to have and nothing to be sniffed at, they don't mean a lot in this day and age. Look at AJ, he picked up a belt from literally the worst champ ever in Charles Martin.

Put all the belts and lineal titles aside. Fury is the man who ended Wlad's reign. Fury is the man that beat (got robbed) against a guy considered top 2 at the time. AJ can't say he's done any of that. He's picked up belts, beat some decent opponents and an inactive Wlad coming off a loss but he's never beat a dominant champ.

Fury is the man to beat, Lineal or not and even if he has no belts. Like it or not, he's the most proven and has the best wins.