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Old 01-28-2019, 04:47 PM #651
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Originally Posted by MulaKO View Post
I hear you , just find too many people shooting him down after a single fight
Like I said two years is a long time , especially in hand to hand combat
Only time will tell
Now , let me get your opinion on something
Im not a big fan of Dan Birmingham , his advice on Saturday between rounds was very questionable
I think Thurman can benefit by switching trainer
Whats your take
I haven't heard what the coach was telling him, I didn't watch it live, watched it the next day on youtube and skipped the breaks, so I can't answer you. But Thurman is what he is, even if he improves, he won't improve by an amazing margin at his age.

Althought it looks to me like he became more fluid than ever, prehaps I've never seen him being this fluid before, even despite the lay off. His hands and feet were perfectly synchronized and he did a great jab of fighting on the move, sticking and moving till the mid-rounds. It was so nice. Also he landed a bunch of great counters and had really good head movement in those rounds.

But he's been making the same technical mistakes for years: Repetitive paterns of attacking the same way, not feinting, using his fast feet as the only line of defence, not setting up punches at all, not bringing his hands back after punching, telegraphing his punches, slipping punches without looking at Lopez, but looking at canvas instead.

Look, I'm not trying to look like a boxing hypster or a wannabe Ray Arcel, because I know even the greatest technicians make mistakes, but my hobby is closely analyzing the fights and I like to pay attention to details, more than the average boxing fan and I can't help myself but speak about them, I'm just speaking out on what I see, the films don't lie. Now despite all of that, I still think Thurman is a very good fighter, especially for the current WW division, but I just don't want to pretend like he's amazing when I see the basic mistakes he's been making, and I think the whole current WW division is overrated anyway. I think that exactly these small, subtle technical movements (or the lack of them) are a big reason today's welterweights are seen inferior to the welterweights from only 8-10 years ago, never mind Duran, Leonard, Benitez and Hearns.

To me, Thurman is a good example of the american boxing today, where average to bad coaches open the gym, than get lucky when an athletically gifted kid comes to their gym, so they teach them "the slick" style and how to use their athletic abilities and footspeed, but rarely turn them into fundamentaly sound fighters or teach them the little tricks. They can do good in amateurs, but they fight only in America, never on the biggest amateur stages, and even when they did, they do terrible (exactly because of their lack of strong basics). Thurman is probably even better and more skilled than most of the current american beltholders, but his fundamentals are far from the top level. Imagine if he was fighting 32 years old Floyd, or if one day a WW version of Finito Lopez emerges and he has to fight that type of guy. He would get schooled badly.
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Old 01-28-2019, 09:10 PM #652
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Originally Posted by Offic.Scorecard View Post
I haven't heard what the coach was telling him, I didn't watch it live, watched it the next day on youtube and skipped the breaks, so I can't answer you. But Thurman is what he is, even if he improves, he won't improve by an amazing margin at his age.

Althought it looks to me like he became more fluid than ever, prehaps I've never seen him being this fluid before, even despite the lay off. His hands and feet were perfectly synchronized and he did a great jab of fighting on the move, sticking and moving till the mid-rounds. It was so nice. Also he landed a bunch of great counters and had really good head movement in those rounds.

But he's been making the same technical mistakes for years: Repetitive paterns of attacking the same way, not feinting, using his fast feet as the only line of defence, not setting up punches at all, not bringing his hands back after punching, telegraphing his punches, slipping punches without looking at Lopez, but looking at canvas instead.

Look, I'm not trying to look like a boxing hypster or a wannabe Ray Arcel, because I know even the greatest technicians make mistakes, but my hobby is closely analyzing the fights and I like to pay attention to details, more than the average boxing fan and I can't help myself but speak about them, I'm just speaking out on what I see, the films don't lie. Now despite all of that, I still think Thurman is a very good fighter, especially for the current WW division, but I just don't want to pretend like he's amazing when I see the basic mistakes he's been making, and I think the whole current WW division is overrated anyway. I think that exactly these small, subtle technical movements (or the lack of them) are a big reason today's welterweights are seen inferior to the welterweights from only 8-10 years ago, never mind Duran, Leonard, Benitez and Hearns.

To me, Thurman is a good example of the american boxing today, where average to bad coaches open the gym, than get lucky when an athletically gifted kid comes to their gym, so they teach them "the slick" style and how to use their athletic abilities and footspeed, but rarely turn them into fundamentaly sound fighters or teach them the little tricks. They can do good in amateurs, but they fight only in America, never on the biggest amateur stages, and even when they did, they do terrible (exactly because of their lack of strong basics). Thurman is probably even better and more skilled than most of the current american beltholders, but his fundamentals are far from the top level. Imagine if he was fighting 32 years old Floyd, or if one day a WW version of Finito Lopez emerges and he has to fight that type of guy. He would get schooled badly.
I dig where your coming from and I mostly agree

My point exactly , Birmingham to my knowledge is more an aggressive coach meaning attack to get that ko
In my opinion Keith can really benefit from getting a trainer whos more into fundamentals ( defense ) and upgrade to the next level
I know theirs a special bond between them but I think Birmingham has shown him all hes got
And like you said if he is on the decline , well this would only help his situation

Yeah that was nice for the first four rounds ( give or take ) the stick and move
But then gassed out lol
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Old 01-29-2019, 12:05 AM #653
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Originally Posted by doom_specialist View Post
I don't know his lifestyle, but he may be content to earn $1M-$2M a fight retiring gatekeepers. I want him to fight Spence, but he really didn't look ready to me. He's gonna need some cardio.
As fighter-friendly as Haymon has shown himself to be, unless you're coming off of a defeat or you owe a mandatory, he doesn't have the reputation for simply letting guys knock over cans for the fat cheques.

Thurman isn't fighting Spence anytime soon, but he's going to be pushed to fight a live guy next, whomever that ends up being.

Thinking about it, he may be able to get away with Thurman-Berto in Florida (two Florida welters who are world-rated, with history between them, fighting in Florida in a feature spot), but that's about it.
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Old 01-29-2019, 12:23 AM #654
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#DubNation

We out-chea dealing with heavy hate bruh, Dubs just keep winning. 5 All-Stars starting and a former all-star/FMVP coming off the bench like true savages.

LMAO. Warriors glitched the NBA. LeQuit might as well just retire he will never play in a finals again.
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Old 01-29-2019, 05:50 PM #655
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Idk what it is....but Robert knows how to bring the best out of fighters
It's called SNAC.
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Old 01-29-2019, 05:59 PM #656
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Originally Posted by AdonisCreed View Post
Thurman needs to learn how to hold when he's in trouble!! He's lucky that was Lopez and not a top guy! Thurman struggles with C level guys like Lopez and Collazo and does good against top guys SMH lol
Thurman has said in interviews that he doesn't like to hold...
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Old 01-30-2019, 03:40 AM #657
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Wow! That was a great fight! Lopez did superb, respect to him and Thurman. Excellent win for Thurman!
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