Comments Thread For: Ward: Kovalev Not Same Fighter, But He'll Be Hard To Deal With

[Granath]

Kessler headbutts
Barrera lowblows
Rodriguez fight - deducted 2 points in round 4

The whole Dawson situation was dirty - he refused to negotiate with Dawson on weight at all even when getting to 168 was killing him - 'Dawson was fighting at 168 pounds for the first time in over six years and seemed to be badly weight drained. The day of the weigh in Dawson had to shed 9lbs.'

From the Bika fight - 'Both Fighters used rough tactics and both fought evenly through out the 12 rounds, Bika had a significantly higher work rate'

I like some dirty fighting but the issue with Ward is he really does nothing else exceptional besides fight dirty. If the rules were fairly applied to him he would have a worse resume, and he certainly shouldn't win 95% of close rounds, as he has been able to do in his career.

His only legit top tier win with no controversy is over Froch. Sad but true.

Revisionist history alert (and a pretty poor attempt at that)! None of those are controversial. Let's set the record straight:

Barrera - got a point deducted for a low blow on a very quick trigger (https://bleacherreport.com/articles/...d-and-reaction). Even with that bonus point Barrera lost handily on the cards and Compubox numbers. No controversy.

Rodriguez - both fighters deducted points for fighting dirty in 4th round. Ref tells Rodriguez that he instigated most of it (https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1aed03). Inconsequential. Ward wins going away. No controversy.

Dawson - he took the fight at that weight so STFU. No complaining and he destroyed Dawson. No controversy.

Bika - Ward was by far the more accurate puncher. Bika's high work rate doesn't count for much when he's outlanded by 50 punches despite Bika's head butting (https://www.proboxing-fans.com/ward-...ika-head-butt/). The cards could have been a bit closer but no one thought Bika won. No controversy.

If you're going to make stuff up you're going to get called on it. Stick to the facts.

[Boxing_1013]

Stopped reading when you showed your ignorance in the first paragraph. Everyone, even the noobiest of noobs, saw Kovalev reacting to the body work. That's what caused him to fade in later rounds and lose the fight. Whatever you think Kovalev was doing, it's wishful thinking because Ward only grew stronger in the first fight.

You really don't know shyt about boxing and you're making one desperate reach after another. You're getting emotional because everyone can see you're full of shyt. Get help kid.

See that's the thing - I actually watch the fights, and I react to what I see. I don't go with some preconceived narrative that may suit my agenda or worldview just because it helps the fighter I may like better.

Kov gave just about as good as he got on the inside with Ward. Ward did some good work to the body there, and he probably did his best work overall on the inside. But Kov landed some really heavy head punches on Ward in the clinch and also when they were infighting. Anyone saying Ward dominated the inside fighting or that Kov can't fight on the inside didn't actually watch the fights, or is trying to overlook Kov's work there because it doesn't suit their agenda. That's not a person to listen to as far as boxing analysis goes.

Btw - everyone can see how you praised Kov right after the fight and talked about how great he looked and how he was back. And then a few days later you try and say he will never be what he was, because you think that now a great looking Kov diminishes Ward. At first you analyzed what you saw and responded accordingly - then you changed your argument because it doesn't suit your agenda. You should have stuck to your first point. When presented with new information a wise man should change his mind.

[Boxing_1013]

Revisionist history alert (and a pretty poor attempt at that)! None of those are controversial. Let's set the record straight:

Barrera - got a point deducted for a low blow on a very quick trigger s point Barrera lost handily on the cards and Compubox numbers. No controversy.

Rodriguez - both fighters deducted points for fighting dirty in 4th round. Ref tells Rodriguez that he instigated most of it

Dawson - he took the fight at that weight so STFU. No complaining and he destroyed Dawson. No controversy.

Bika - Ward was by far the more accurate puncher. Bika's high work rate doesn't count for much when he's outlanded by 50 punches despite Bika's head butting. [/B]

If you're going to make stuff up you're going to get called on it. Stick to the facts.

Who are you? lol. I was responding to someone else who asked what fights Ward has had where he fought dirty.

Btw - you are incorrect with your analysis there but that is no surprise considering you can't really spell or form complete sentences. Why should anyone value what you have to say?

Did you actually watch all of Ward's fights? I have watched most of them.

He received a deduction against Barrera because of REPEATED low blows. He was warned and re-offended. That's how it works. Also - I watched that fight. Anyone who says Ward dominated that fight either has no clue how boxing works or didn't actually watch the fight. I assume you are latter but could be both.

The point about the Rodriguez fight was that Ward fights dirty - he got deducted 2 points. That proves it bub. So you embarrass yourself again here.

Lol Dawson thought he could make 168 and he couldn't. He was getting KOd in sparring and was begging to change the weight but Ward wouldn't budge. He is not an honorable guy but no surprise there. He had to shave 9 pounds on the weigh in day and was getting KOd in sparring and it took Ward 10 rounds to KO him. Overall - yes that was a dirty tactic and controversial as well.

I can guarantee you that you and 90% of Ward fans on here have not watched the Bika fight lol. Anyone who says Ward clearly deserved to win that fight are crazy. Bika was landing a lot more than those numbers give him credit for.

Wth are you talking about lol? Who are you again? You butt into someone else's convo and make some baseless accusations? Lol. Almost all of the things I just wrote are FACTS and almost all of the things I wrote previously are FACTS. Some are my opinion which are largely based on fact.

But saying Ward has a history of dirty fighting is not an opinion. Saying his deduction against Barrera was for REPEATED LOW BLOWS is a FACT. That is not an opinion. Perhaps you don't know what that word means.

In any event I don't really care if a guy does some dirty fighting. The problem with Ward is that even when he got away with all of his dirty tactics, when he was in with good opposition, he hardly had any special moments and at best would fight guys to a standstill. People hyping him up as a great boxer are OUT OF THEIR MINDS.

[Boxing_1013]

If ur gonna pretend that the Kovalev who fought Alvarez a few nights ago is “Better than ever” then u should donate your eyes to Stevie Wonder, cause clearly u have no use for them.

Continually attempting to marginalize Ward is making u look buffoonish. So my question to u is, is it worth losing what little credibility u may have left just to try to drive home what’s obviously a false narrative ?

Btw dude - can't believe you are still using that username after I embarrassed you in that other thread.

You accuse me of 'attempting to marginalize' Ward, yet all I do is assess his career in the ring I have found his legend to be lacking.

Meanwhile YOU HYPED UP WARD'S RESUME BY SAYING HE STOPPED THE GREAT UP AND COMING AMATEUR ALEXANDER BRAND AND FORCED HIM TO RETIRE.

Not realizing of course that Brand is 42 years old now and was 39 when he faced Ward. Lol. You are clearly not informed on anything relating to boxing. And only back fighters that you can identify with, which is fine. The problem is you are hellbent on hyping them up even when you are presented with evidence that they are not all that.

I should add that quote to my profile lol. 'Andre Ward stopped the great Alexander Brand, an up and coming amateur, and forced him to retire.' - SugarRoyRobinson Complete and utter fanboy stuff, not a serious person.

[Granath]

Who are you? lol. I was responding to someone else who asked what fights Ward has had where he fought dirty.

Btw - you are incorrect with your analysis there but that is no surprise considering you can't really spell or form complete sentences. Why should anyone value what you have to say?

Did you actually watch all of Ward's fights? I have watched most of them.

He received a deduction against Barrera because of REPEATED low blows. He was warned and re-offended. That's how it works. Also - I watched that fight. Anyone who says Ward dominated that fight either has no clue how boxing works or didn't actually watch the fight. I assume you are latter but could be both.

The point about the Rodriguez fight was that Ward fights dirty - he got deducted 2 points. That proves it bub. So you embarrass yourself again here.

Lol Dawson thought he could make 168 and he couldn't. He was getting KOd in sparring and was begging to change the weight but Ward wouldn't budge. He is not an honorable guy but no surprise there. He had to shave 9 pounds on the weigh in day and was getting KOd in sparring and it took Ward 10 rounds to KO him. Overall - yes that was a dirty tactic and controversial as well.

I can guarantee you that you and 90% of Ward fans on here have not watched the Bika fight lol. Anyone who says Ward clearly deserved to win that fight are crazy. Bika was landing a lot more than those numbers give him credit for.

Wth are you talking about lol? Who are you again? You butt into someone else's convo and make some baseless accusations? Lol. Almost all of the things I just wrote are FACTS and almost all of the things I wrote previously are FACTS. Some are my opinion which are largely based on fact.

But saying Ward has a history of dirty fighting is not an opinion. Saying his deduction against Barrera was for REPEATED LOW BLOWS is a FACT. That is not an opinion. Perhaps you don't know what that word means.

In any event I don't really care if a guy does some dirty fighting. The problem with Ward is that even when he got away with all of his dirty tactics, when he was in with good opposition, he hardly had any special moments and at best would fight guys to a standstill. People hyping him up as a great boxer are OUT OF THEIR MINDS.

We don't disagree on the facts. The difference between you and I is that I cited all of my opinions. For instance you keep talking about the Rodriguez fight. The very one that Rodriguez was also deducted two points and was the clear instigator yet you want to try to use that as proof. Sorry, reacting to someone who is fighting dirty isn't a too big of a sin in my book and it proves nothing. Did you watch the video? Did you get the memo?

Bika lost by 8, 8 and 12 points on the cards. If there's a controversy it's only in your mind because now you've blown it up into a conspiracy. So now, not only were all 3 judges corrupt but now you indicated that CompuBox is in on it because "Bika landed a lot more". And heck, an entirely different set of judges must have been bought off for the Barrera fight since Ward won by 9, 9, 10 points on the cards. Were aliens and the CIA involved too? How deep does the Rabbit Hole go? Inquiring minds want to know!

Again, who gives a rat's butt about Dawson's weight? What does that have to do with Ward? Dawson took the fight and got KTFO. Case closed.

You used the term controversial so don't walk back from it now. There was nothing controversial about any of those fights and its on you to show it. Just repeating it doesn't make it any more true. That it was controversial is an opinion and one, that in my book, isn't supportable. Nor does having points deducted in a couple of fights make someone a dirty fighter. Oh heavens forbid!

And for all your bluster one thing remains: Ward won all of those fights handily. It doesn't matter if he had "special moments" (your words, not mine). Flash is nice but isn't necessarily a mark of genius. It was in RJJ. It wasn't with Usman Ahmed (look it up). Ward didn't need "special moments" to uncover his opponents weaknesses, exploit them and break them into little pieces. He did it against every guy you mentioned. He did it against Kovalev in the first fight, losing the early rounds but winning all of the last six rounds on two scorecards, and five of six on a third. He figured it out, made adjustments and started winning (and then KO'd him the 2nd fight). Like it or not, that's the historical record.

Ward may not be flashy but his boxing IQ is pretty much off the charts. That's why he was a great boxer. He didn't need to be flashy, he just needed to figure out how to win and he did that every...single...time. That you need "special moments" is your problem, not his. It just shows that you have something new to consider about this sport.

PS - when you get off the mat, fight someone in your own weight class. You've moved up to one you can't compete in.

[SugarRaRobinson]

But how can you say he isn't what he was - he just proved against Alvarez he looks as good as ever?

Got his knees buckled a few times that fight. When has that happened prior to Ward ? In addition to that if u rewatch the fight, Kov is clearly has the look of uncertainty when he gets hit with big shots now.

Let’s compare that to his first fight with Pascal, and how staunch and resolute Kov was when Pascal unloaded and drilled him with bombs.

It’s like night and day.

[Boxing_1013]

We don't disagree on the facts. The difference between you and I is that I cited all of my opinions. For instance you keep talking about the Rodriguez fight. The very one that Rodriguez was also deducted two points and was the clear instigator yet you want to try to use that as proof. Sorry, reacting to someone who is fighting dirty isn't a too big of a sin in my book and it proves nothing. Did you watch the video? Did you get the memo?

Bika lost by 8, 8 and 12 points on the cards. If there's a controversy it's only in your mind because now you've blown it up into a conspiracy. So now, not only were all 3 judges corrupt but now you indicated that CompuBox is in on it because "Bika landed a lot more". And heck, an entirely different set of judges must have been bought off for the Barrera fight since Ward won by 9, 9, 10 points on the cards. Were aliens and the CIA involved too? How deep does the Rabbit Hole go? Inquiring minds want to know!

Again, who gives a rat's butt about Dawson's weight? What does that have to do with Ward? Dawson took the fight and got KTFO. Case closed.

You used the term controversial so don't walk back from it now. There was nothing controversial about any of those fights and its on you to show it. Just repeating it doesn't make it any more true. That it was controversial is an opinion and one, that in my book, isn't supportable. Nor does having points deducted in a couple of fights make someone a dirty fighter. Oh heavens forbid!

And for all your bluster one thing remains: Ward won all of those fights handily. It doesn't matter if he had "special moments" (your words, not mine). Flash is nice but isn't necessarily a mark of genius. It was in RJJ. It wasn't with Usman Ahmed (look it up). Ward didn't need "special moments" to uncover his opponents weaknesses, exploit them and break them into little pieces. He did it against every guy you mentioned. He did it against Kovalev in the first fight, losing the early rounds but winning all of the last six rounds on two scorecards, and five of six on a third. He figured it out, made adjustments and started winning (and then KO'd him the 2nd fight). Like it or not, that's the historical record.

Ward may not be flashy but his boxing IQ is pretty much off the charts. That's why he was a great boxer. He didn't need to be flashy, he just needed to figure out how to win and he did that every...single...time. That you need "special moments" is your problem, not his. It just shows that you have something new to consider about this sport.

PS - when you get off the mat, fight someone in your own weight class. You've moved up to one you can't compete in.

Dude you can't even spell or use grammar correctly; you thinking you have any type of intellectual or analytical superiority over me is insane.

Anyway as I have said I have actually watched most of Ward's fights and I would disagree with the notions that he won the Barrera and Bika fights handily. You seem to indicate, as I suspected, that you haven't actually watched those fights. Anyone thinking Ward was 'so special' in those fights and had any type of separation from Bika or Barrera is just not a credible analyst in my opinion and is unable to discern a hyped up American, fighting at home, from a similarly talented nobody from Cuba or Cameroon with no promotional angle, who will never get the benefit of doubt in any fight against a hyped up American on US soil. I say that as an American, I am just smart enough to understand what goes on.

You quote judges' scorecards in the Bika and Barrera fights as if they are facts and again you indicate that you haven't actually watched those fights. That's fine, most people haven't. But to cite the cards without watching the fights and then try to argue from a position of intellectual or analytical superiority displays your arrogance ignorance and lack of intelligence.

To quote the cards from the first Kovalev fight as though Ward deserved to win 17/18 rounds on the judges' cards over the last 6 rounds just shows your opinion on boxing is irrelevant. If the whole fight went the way of those last 6 rounds, the fight should have been a 7-5 fight either way. You are saying Ward should have won 12-0 twice and 11-1 or 10-2 on the other card. You are just not a serious person and anyone touting the cards in the Kov fight is not anyone I take seriously.

And I certainly don't take seriously the boxing analysis of someone who touts scorecards without having watched a fight himself. If you follow boxing for 5 minutes you should know that what a judge says is often not what actually happens in a fight, and when a heavily promoted fighter is fighting at home they often get rounds they should not.

Honestly I don't care at all about your opinion on boxing, you have already shown many times (in your other posts as well) that you talk out of both sides of your mouth and you don't really know what you're talking about. Anyone who knows boxing and has watched the Bika and Barrera fights with Ward and tries to hype Ward up as some type of wunderkid is clearly biased and has an interest in hyping Ward up to be something that he is not. I believe what I see with my own eyes and unfortunately the proof is not in the pudding with Andre. He is a tough smart fighter but has been very protected in his career, and for good reason. If he ever fought in a neutral site with fair judges he would struggle against good opposition and probably lose to great fighters. I can give him credit for the Froch win but career wise that was about it unfortunately.

[SugarRaRobinson]

Btw dude - can't believe you are still using that username after I embarrassed you in that other thread.

You accuse me of 'attempting to marginalize' Ward, yet all I do is assess his career in the ring I have found his legend to be lacking.

Meanwhile YOU HYPED UP WARD'S RESUME BY SAYING HE STOPPED THE GREAT UP AND COMING AMATEUR ALEXANDER BRAND AND FORCED HIM TO RETIRE.

Not realizing of course that Brand is 42 years old now and was 39 when he faced Ward. Lol. You are clearly not informed on anything relating to boxing. And only back fighters that you can identify with, which is fine. The problem is you are hellbent on hyping them up even when you are presented with evidence that they are not all that.

I should add that quote to my profile lol. 'Andre Ward stopped the great Alexander Brand, an up and coming amateur, and forced him to retire.' - SugarRoyRobinson Complete and utter fanboy stuff, not a serious person.

U should add that quote to your profile, since your the one who created it, lol. Just make sure u assign your own sig to it.

Speaking of which, isn’t that sig cooked to a crisp after I took a flamethrower to it about 3 or 4 different times ?
Life is just full of dilemmas.

Here’s what we’ll do. Say something blatantly racist, I’ll then report you to get u deactivated. After that, sign back up, but let’s make sure this time u use a sig specifically customized to succinctly describe your personal strengths and self-worth.

I’ve chosen “SMEGMA” for you.
It means d.ck cheese in case u were wondering. It arises when someone doesn’t wash their ***** for long periods of time and a bacterial cheese like substance starts to accumulate. Good luck, I think you’ll do well with this one !

[Boxing_1013]

We don't disagree on the facts. The difference between you and I is that I cited all of my opinions. For instance you keep talking about the Rodriguez fight. The very one that Rodriguez was also deducted two points and was the clear instigator yet you want to try to use that as proof. Sorry, reacting to someone who is fighting dirty isn't a too big of a sin in my book and it proves nothing. Did you watch the video? Did you get the memo?

Bika lost by 8, 8 and 12 points on the cards. If there's a controversy it's only in your mind because now you've blown it up into a conspiracy. So now, not only were all 3 judges corrupt but now you indicated that CompuBox is in on it because "Bika landed a lot more". And heck, an entirely different set of judges must have been bought off for the Barrera fight since Ward won by 9, 9, 10 points on the cards. Were aliens and the CIA involved too? How deep does the Rabbit Hole go? Inquiring minds want to know!

Again, who gives a rat's butt about Dawson's weight? What does that have to do with Ward? Dawson took the fight and got KTFO. Case closed.

You used the term controversial so don't walk back from it now. There was nothing controversial about any of those fights and its on you to show it. Just repeating it doesn't make it any more true. That it was controversial is an opinion and one, that in my book, isn't supportable. Nor does having points deducted in a couple of fights make someone a dirty fighter. Oh heavens forbid!

And for all your bluster one thing remains: Ward won all of those fights handily. It doesn't matter if he had "special moments" (your words, not mine). Flash is nice but isn't necessarily a mark of genius. It was in RJJ. It wasn't with Usman Ahmed (look it up). Ward didn't need "special moments" to uncover his opponents weaknesses, exploit them and break them into little pieces. He did it against every guy you mentioned. He did it against Kovalev in the first fight, losing the early rounds but winning all of the last six rounds on two scorecards, and five of six on a third. He figured it out, made adjustments and started winning (and then KO'd him the 2nd fight). Like it or not, that's the historical record.

Ward may not be flashy but his boxing IQ is pretty much off the charts. That's why he was a great boxer. He didn't need to be flashy, he just needed to figure out how to win and he did that every...single...time. That you need "special moments" is your problem, not his. It just shows that you have something new to consider about this sport.

PS - when you get off the mat, fight someone in your own weight class. You've moved up to one you can't compete in.

watch the fight. What do you think about Round 1?

Pretty clear round for Bika. But I'm sure you'll find a way to give to your hero. Btw - turn the sound off when you watch, helps to score accurately.

[Boxing_1013]

U should add that quote to your profile, since your the one who created it, lol. Just make sure u assign your own sig to it.

Speaking of which, isn’t that sig cooked to a crisp after I took a flamethrower to it about 3 or 4 different times ?
Life is just full of dilemmas.

Here’s what we’ll do. Say something blatantly racist, I’ll then report you to get u deactivated. After that, sign back up, but let’s make sure this time u use a sig specifically customized to succinctly describe your personal strengths and self-worth.

I’ve chosen “SMEGMA” for you.
It means d.ck cheese in case u were wondering. It arises when someone doesn’t wash their ***** for long periods of time and a bacterial cheese like substance starts to accumulate. Good luck, I think you’ll do well with this one !

Oh wow. Among other ridiculous comments, you hyped up the ATG Alexander Brand and noted how Ward retired this up and coming superstar. You are a true intellect and student of the game. Keep it up young blood.

And yeah man you're really winning...you just admitted you have to call your Mom for help lol.