Your thoughts about: Joe Louis v.s Max Baer 1935 fight

[Underboss]

exactly. he wasn't a smart boxer. that's why he lost many fights.

he had a vicious right hand and good speed/strength but no mind.

[SABBATH]

For that chin of Louis is something on the order of a timber wolf's head. Ever try to slap a timber wolf in the face ? There is an animal reaction to Louis that reminds one of the wild, before too much civilization has begun to work on normal reflexes.

Great article MG with some good insight into Baer's mindset before he actually had to step into the ring and face Louis.

The above quote is another example of the racial overtones many of the writers of that era who would often use by making references to Louis and wild animals. Another reminder of the times Louis emerged from.

[BrooklynBomber]

Very good stuff, thanks.
Never knew that maxie had his right arm injured going into fight with Louis.

[Maxie's Gal]

Baer no dummy

yea i know. but you have to understand that joe louis was pretty strong. max baer wasn't smart enough. everybody says it. he had a great chin and a great right hand. but no brain.

I'm not trying to take anything away from Joe's awesome talent, he's amazing, but stating "everybody says it" that Max was a dummy holds no water, its dead wrong and unfair.

Max was aware of his failures, he states them right in the Grantland Rice article I posted. Max killed a man in the ring, did Joe ? If Joe had, don't you think it would have ****ed with his head a bit, too ? Should Max have trained harder, taken it all more seriously, etc. etc.? Of course, but its a fact that prior to the Campbell bout, he trained seriously and boxed successfully, and after Frankie's death, he clowned. That death effected every aspect of his later fights. Schmeling and Nova both said when Baer had them down and could've finished them, he backed off in fear of harming them permanently.

Was Max a dummy in the Schmeling bout ? Against, Risko, Heeney, Loughran, Levinsky, Foord, Comiskey ? When Louis was training for Schmeling II he was asked which Max he'd rather fight as challenger to his title and he replied, "I'd rather fight Schmeling twice than Baer once. Baer's got a dangerous punch in both hands, Schmeling only has the one."

Baer's record was 72-12-0, 53 of those fights were knockouts. Not bad for a dummy.

Cat
www.maxbaer.org

[Maxie's Gal]

Baer's hands

Very good stuff, thanks.
Never knew that maxie had his right arm injured going into fight with Louis.

My pleasure John.

Max actually injured his hands 3 weeks before the Braddock fight, then never let them heal properly before going up against Louis.

Check out my 'FAQs' page about his hand problems before Braddock, and under a question about Joe Louis, the reference to his hand problems again, which Max blows off. http://www.maxbaer.org/faqs.html

Regards,
Cat
www.maxbaer.org

[Maxie's Gal]

Louis and the Maxes

Great article MG with some good insight into Baer's mindset before he actually had to step into the ring and face Louis.

The above quote is another example of the racial overtones many of the writers of that era who would often use by making references to Louis and wild animals. Another reminder of the times Louis emerged from.

Thanks Sabbath.

I thought it was pretty rare that Max opened up so much and allowed himself to be quoted so liberally in that article, it was unusual for the era. However, I recently finished reading Granny Rice's "The Tumult and The Shouting" and that Rice was just so damn easy going and pleasant and concerned about others, I think he was like a pseudo-father figure to alot of young men and women of all sports of the times, they just couldn't help but unload on him !

Agreed on the ****ty times that Louis emerged from. Whenever I hear how he was advised by his handlers to be above reproach in every way or else the public would turn on him (ala Jack Johnson), and how quiet he was, I wonder, how many outbursts or verbal explosions he *wanted* to make but couldn't.

Alternately, during Louis-Schmeling II, while that situation was helpful in the public's eventual love of Louis, (my father still gets misty eyed recalling listening to it) they certainly treated Schmeling horribly thinking all Germans were Nazis. In Schmeling's autobio he writes how he thought back to bout I, when everyone cheered him as he departed the blimp or the boat, and how as he arrived for bout II, the public all but spit on him.

Ugly ugly times.....Cat

[Kid Achilles]

I've read contradicting reports about the public's reaction to Schmeling. I have his autobio as well and read it years ago but the recent David Margolick book (I recommend it) paints a somewhat less attractive portrait of Schmeling than what I'm used to. Not that I buy everything Margolick writes in the book, I do think it's slanted against Schmeling a bit, but if even half the things he writes about Schmeling are true, Schmeling is well, more human and less saint than I've imagined him in my teenage years.

About that first fight, I've also read that some Americans were reportedly cheering the perceived (by the general public) nazi on to "kill the ******" towards the end of the first fight when the great american hero was on the verge of being knocked out.

Ugly times indeed.

[phallus]

I've read contradicting reports about the public's reaction to Schmeling. I have his autobio as well and read it years ago but the recent David Margolick book (I recommend it) paints a somewhat less attractive portrait of Schmeling than what I'm used to. Not that I buy everything Margolick writes in the book, I do think it's slanted against Schmeling a bit, but if even half the things he writes about Schmeling are true, Schmeling is well, more human and less saint than I've imagined him in my teenage years.

About that first fight, I've also read that some Americans were reportedly cheering the perceived (by the general public) nazi on to "kill the ******" towards the end of the first fight when the great american hero was on the verge of being knocked out.

Ugly times indeed.

i bet anyhting this is true. kid, u grew up in the 80's and 90's - now we have political correctness, even though some people still think thse things it's no longer ok to say them. even in the 1960's, the world was a very different place than what it is now. for example jimi hendrix was referred to by many "non rascist' whites as " the electric ****** " and saying something like that was accepted by repsectable society. but the racial overtones of the louis - schmeling fight made the rematch so cool, when joe destroyed schmeling in 1 round, all of black america was out literally dancing and partying in the street. only when u know what that fight meant to black america do u understand why joe louis was so loved

[SABBATH]

About that first fight, I've also read that some Americans were reportedly cheering the perceived (by the general public) nazi on to "kill the ******" towards the end of the first fight when the great american hero was on the verge of being knocked out.

Keep in mind that World War 2 didn't begin until Germany invaded Poland in 1939. At the time of the first Schmeling-Louis fight in 1936, I'm going to guess that few American fight fans could spell Nazi much less knew what the political party stood for or represented. The atrocities of their actions wouldn't become known until years later after the war began.

It's shameful that fans would call for Schmeling to "kill the ******" , but cheering for Schmeling over Louis sounds worse in hindsight than it would have at the time.

[SABBATH]

sabbath who's that guy in your avataar?

That would be me.