Why Does Jack Johnson Get a Pass on Opposition while Marciano Does Not?

[travestyny]

Again...you are trying to argue a topic that is well known and understood by pulling snippets of a long history to bolster a false argument. It's been understood for 80 years that Dempsey did not duck Wills. He tried like hell to make the bout occur himself. Fighters fight. Managers and promoters make fights. Dempsey AS HWT CHAMPION tried to make a bout with Wills occur. Unheard of otherwise in hwt boxing history.

If you are talking to me, can you quote me so that I know it.

Anyway, I'm not trying to do anything. I gave you the entire link. I've also stated previously, I think even on this page of this thread or the previous page, that I'm willing to accept that it didn't come off because of financial reasons, though I remain suspicious as to whether Dempsey really wanted it or not. It was blamed on Rickard, yet in 1923 he staged a match against Gibbons and left Rickard out of it. We know that people were calling for Wills clearly by 1922. Wills was able to keep $50,000 because he was promised Dempsey, and Dempsey's side backed out of it then. Apparently in 1925, it was signed in the event that Wills gets through 3 fights or something like that. This was seen as a stalling tactic that obviously worked. Was Dempsey calling for the fight right then and there? How about Dempsey pulling what he did with Gibbons and not using Tex Rickard? How about him trying to find another way to make the fight instead of accepting what his management and Rickard said.

In any event, I never focused on Wills here. It's you that came in accusing me of focusing on Wills. The focus was Joe Jeannette and what happened in NYC. There is also the Lanford incident that was brought up. There was also the repeated drawing of the color line that was brought up.

[Tony Trick-Pony]

Again...you are trying to argue a topic that is well known and understood by pulling snippets of a long history to bolster a false argument. It's been understood for 80 years that Dempsey did not duck Wills. He tried like hell to make the bout occur himself. Fighters fight. Managers and promoters make fights. Dempsey AS HWT CHAMPION tried to make a bout with Wills occur. Unheard of otherwise in hwt boxing history.

Pretty sure? Then why did the quotation that I gave say "experts" believed Wills would have won.


It's just an opinion. You're saying Dempsey is to Tito as Wills is to Granados? Really? Come on man.

There is a reason Wills, not Goddfrey, was considered "the most egregious victim of the color-line."

I think my dude above summed it up.

Just take the L and move on, bruh.

It happens.

[HOUDINI563]

Jack Sharkey was interviewed in the mid 1950's. He was asked who hit harder Dempsey or Louis. He stated Dempsey hit harder punch for punch. He added "I never thought anyone could hit that hard". Continuing..."when Dempsey hit you on the shoulder he broke your shoulder. When he hit you to the body it felt as if his fist came out your back. When he hit you on the hip he dislocated your hip."

[travestyny]

When asked who would win between Dempsey and Wills the great Sam Langford stated. "My money would be on the champion. Dempsey is the greatest fighter I have ever seen."

Here's a question for you.

How many times did Langford fight Wills?

How many times did Langford win?


Also...how many times did Langford fight Dempsey.

[HOUDINI563]

You need to study the history. Pulling snippets and trying to form a false argument is very dishonest. Again it's been known for 80 years the events regarding Wills not getting a title shot. Dempsey was exonerated long before any of us were born.

[travestyny]

I think my dude above summed it up.

Just take the L and move on, bruh.

It happens.

What "L." I saw no "L" there. Do you care to elaborate?


All I saw was you trying to say if Dempsey is Tito, Harry Wills is Granados. That's laughable.

[GhostofDempsey]

Dempsey demanded and was offered one million dollars to fight Wills. How anyone would think he would turn down a milion dollars back then (about $25M in today's currency) to fight a guy who was big and slow is beyond reason. Dempsey insisted on a $300K advance to sign the contract. Wills was getting $50K for the fight. The $300K was never paid to Demosey. They tried appeasing him with a $25K check that actually bounced. Fight was called off.

[HOUDINI563]

Very true Ghost.

[travestyny]

You need to study the history. Pulling snippets and trying to form a false argument is very dishonest. Again it's been known for 80 years the events regarding Wills not getting a title shot. Dempsey was exonerated long before any of us were born.

This is the same thing you did in the other thread with your "no white bicycle tape," bs, and then you ran away when you were proven wrong and never returned.

Again, my posts were not even about Wills. You turn around and pull out Wills saying it wasn't Dempsey's fault, and I said fine. So what is the big deal? Does that somehow explain Jeannette, Langford, and drawing the color line, or do you have no excuse for those?

[travestyny]

Jack Sharkey was interviewed in the mid 1950's. He was asked who hit harder Dempsey or Louis. He stated Dempsey hit harder punch for punch. He added "I never thought anyone could hit that hard". Continuing..."when Dempsey hit you on the shoulder he broke your shoulder. When he hit you to the body it felt as if his fist came out your back. When he hit you on the hip he dislocated your hip."

One opponent, “Fireman” Jim Flynn, said of Langford’s punching power: “I fought most of the heavyweights, including [Jack] Dempsey and [Jack] Johnson, but Sam could strength a guy colder than any of them. When Langford hit me it felt like someone slugged me with a baseball bat.”

I guess Langford must have been Hercules then. Keep trying to take quotations from here and there to talk up your dude. The fact is he didn't fight the fights. Don't know why that has you so triggered. Well actually I do. You revealed your hand during the hand-wrap thread. How did that turn out for you