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Old 06-10-2018, 08:21 PM #1
uncle ben uncle ben is offline
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Default Replace Ali with Charles 64-67

If a prime Ezzard Charles took Ali's place and fought all of Ali's opponents from 64 to 67, could he make it through undefeated?

For those of you who need it, here were the opponents:
Sonny Liston
Karl Mildenberger
Henry Cooper
Floyd Patterson
George Chuvalo
Cleveland Willams
Zora Folley
Ernie Terrell
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Old 06-10-2018, 09:26 PM #2
The Old LefHook The Old LefHook is offline
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Charles was a light heavy. He could pull it off in the heavier era. He would not win all those fights, however, just give a good account of himself. He would probably beat four of them and lose to four of them, or at least have life & death struggles. There is no way, for instance, that he is beating Liston on a decent day for Sonny. I think Chuvalo is likely to whip Ez.
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Old 06-11-2018, 02:30 PM #3
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--- 64-67 was a weak title reign.

Up until he was finally ko by Walcott, Ez record is unparalleled in boxing history.

Technically Liston gives him the biggest talent obstacle, but he had succumbed to a big $ lifestyle and vulnerable to a clever, sharp hitting boxer. Terrell poses size questions, but tended to fold in big fights.
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Old 06-11-2018, 04:38 PM #4
The Old LefHook The Old LefHook is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by QueensburyRules View Post
--- 64-67 was a weak title reign.

Up until he was finally ko by Walcott, Ez record is unparalleled in boxing history.

Technically Liston gives him the biggest talent obstacle, but he had succumbed to a big $ lifestyle and vulnerable to a clever, sharp hitting boxer. Terrell poses size questions, but tended to fold in big fights.
Your half wittedness is a marvel, Queensbree.
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Old 06-11-2018, 05:10 PM #5
The Old LefHook The Old LefHook is offline
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Charles was a good combination puncher and counter puncher, but for force he was only going to sting a real heavyweight.

Start pre-sobbing, creeps, because here it comes. Great as he was, among historical heavyweight champions on a WBW basis, Charles is perhaps in the top half of the crowd. That is about all that can be conceded to Charles the heavyweight IMO. Charles, for instance, would go life & death with Jerry Quarry. Can you imagine what the lefhook of Tommy Gunn would do to him? Can you see him even stinging the likes of Ray Mercer or the atomic bull? Can you imagine how full his hands would be with the black rhino, let alone the white buffalo?

Here is a fact, I believe, not a factoid. Old time heavyweights who were actually light heavyweights could no longer spend a full career or even a major part of it at heavyweight. This is purely a function of size. A constant diet of galoots will wear down the body of a light heavyweight, even one who might start out beating those galoots for a while. The Marciano fights were extremely hard on Charles, and Rocky was hardly oversized, and it was those fights that marked the downward turn in his effectiveness. A few fights with the likes of Mercer and McCall et al and I can almost guarantee that Charles would be looking for the light heavyweight line. I also have no doubt he would make a wonderful cruiserweight, especially when he looked up and saw Michael Grant (6' 7") and big Tye Fields (6' 9") waiting for him next.
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Old 06-11-2018, 07:39 PM #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Old LefHook View Post
Your half wittedness is a marvel, Queensbree.
--- Don't take much to marvel a toothless ol'lefhook.

Props fer moving the goalposts into the modern giant era where Ali would turn pro as a LH before. moving up to cruiser and the grab a belt off a fat oaf like Stiverne to retire in a rain of hallelujahs to ascend on a golden cloud into the Great Hall of Valhalla.
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Old 06-11-2018, 07:51 PM #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Old LefHook View Post
Charles was a good combination puncher and counter puncher, but for force he was only going to sting a real heavyweight.
Charles was a killer in his prime. At any weight he fought at.
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Old 06-11-2018, 07:53 PM #8
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Liston would be a tall order but Charles went toe to toe with the Rock for an entire 15 round fight so its very interesting. Charles' keys to success are his speed and quick reflexes against Listons slow plodding but effective style. Not sure if I'd put any money down on that fight but Charles beats up the rest.
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Old 06-11-2018, 09:39 PM #9
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Ali would beat the daylight out of the large hwts of today. They would appear in slow motion in comparison. In Ali we are talking the greatest of all hwt champions. Many notches above anyone we have seen since Lewis.

Charles at his best was a great fighter and KO puncher. He lacked the great mobility of an Ali which was his downfall. Charles loses to Liston and Terrell. Pickum vs Patterson. He beats the rest.
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Old 06-11-2018, 10:50 PM #10
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--- Hoo dat magically skeetering around the ring in wasted monkey motion instead of fighting?

Ali was his name, and doggerel poetry his game. In the days of Ez and Rocky, he have his purse withheld for stinkin' up the joint.

I know it pains your prepubescent memories greatly, but the best historical heavy champs would dispose most of Ali challengers easier than he did.
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