Roy Jones jr: Triumph and Downfall, Physical gifts or Skills?

[1maddd2mackxxx]

Roy Jones Jr downfall when he didn't hone his quickness and skills

HE MUST OF FORGOTTEN !!!WHAT'S GOOD FOR THE GOOSE IS GOOD FOR THE GANDER!!!
WHAT GOES AROUND COMES AROUND!!!.
What I actually mean is that he didn't think father time would come knocking at his door and when it came it exsposed all of his weaknesses. which was lost quickness & then he started getting what he gave , in this case he started getting knocked out!!!

[1maddd2mackxxx]

Roy Jones Jr downfall when he didn't hone his quickness and skills

Just didn't know when to take his winnings & leave ..

That's also true!!

[////]

Nothing wrong with his skills or his chin. His style just doesn't age well. Luring guys in with your hands down is a legitimate tactic and it takes skill to beat them to the counter punch.

As he got older he stopped beating them to that punch and just started to look like a fool getting gtfo while striking poses.

Dirty, boring defensive fighters have the most longevity.

[therealpugilist]

only an uneducated person would think Jones was all physical gifts


Jones created a style of his own utilizing his God given gifts and the basics.

He knew how to do it all and when to do it. Listen to him commentate and its obvious he has the know how and skill....its ingrained in him.

Jones was usually a step ahead of his opponents because of the quickness of his mind. His sense of anticipation was uncanny and he knew how and when to throw a punch, parry, or roll the punch, slip it, or lean back etc.


Once he lost his confidence to punch with his opponents he became a sitting duck after he got kayoed by Tarver


Obviously his chin was not shot at that point, he got hit by a shot he didnt see coming



The fight that really did the damage was the Johnson fight, he was afraid to pull the trigger and was waiting to land the perfect shot without exposing himself. He spent round after round on the ropes and the shot he got hit with dropped him but hitting the back of his head that hard did the real damage.


After that fight if Jones gets hit on the temple or with a shot he doesnt see coming, his body short circuits. His punch resistence is gone.
1) the lack of confidence in his reaction time

2) Being a millisecond slower, is like seeing the opening but cant pull the trigger or knowing you should slip the shot but your body wont react fast enough or you cant react fast enough.....going up in weight, wear and tear caught up to him.

All people watch are highlights but if you watch all of his fights leading to Tarver 2, Jones was only dropped once and took good shots without blinking from Hopkins, Tarver in fight 1, Toney, McCallum, Merqui Sosa, etc all good punchers

[therealpugilist]

Those who had the privilege to watch Roy Jones Jr. during his prime will tell you what a fighting specimen he was. In between Sugar Ray Leonard and Floyd Mayweather Jr. there was Roy Jones, holding the mantle as the most complete fighter during his prime.

He had the intimidation factor, speed, quickness, and tremendous power with both hands. His only weakness may have been his defense and fundamentals, and only because we never knew how good they were.

He was never easy to hit, but too often relied on his quickness, and his opponents’ hesitancy to pull the trigger in fear of being countered, as his main defensive strategies.

But as with many other athletes with superior physical gifts, they often find themselves relying on them, instead of honing their skills. As a result, when his speed and skills eroded, so did his success. While his rival Bernard Hopkins, who relies on guile and ring smart, continues to be considered one of the top pound-for-pound boxers today.

What Roy Jones Jr. failed to realize is that physical gifts often fade away, but ring smarts and guile stays forever.

Now that he’s lost a step or two, Roy Jones Jr. learned the hard way that bad habits, such as keeping his hands down and relying on quickness to avoid punches, no longer work, as he’s been the victim of brutal knockouts in recent years.

Sadly, he’s becoming more known for his loses than his past accomplishments. Some people have even put Hopkins higher than Jones in their list of the greatest boxers in history. I don’t, because Roy Jones accomplished more and was significantly the greater fighter when both were at their prime.

I compare Jones to a baseball player who might have only played 10 years, but was a member of the 3000 hits club, a multiple MVP award winner, and was considered the best player during his prime. While Hopkins is a hitter who also had 3000 hits, it took him 20 years to get there.

Yet, the main reason for Roy’s downfall may have been his greatest triumph as well. When Roy defeated John Ruiz for the WBA Heavyweight title on March 1, 2003, he became the first former Middleweight title holder in 106 years to become a heavyweight champion.

But the historical win did not come without a price, as he had to gain about 20 pounds of muscles to move up and fight John Ruiz. What further compounded the issue was his decision to lose the excess weight and come back to the light heavyweight division.

He lost the weight but never regained his incredible quickness and reflexes; thus began his journey from the best pound for pound boxer to irrelevancy.


So what do you think was responsible for Roy Jones jr. downfall?

what do you think about physical gifts vs skills leading do greater success?

Jones was what he was and he had every tool in the book...its just knowing when to use them.

Watch Jones in his prime....is their really a skill he didnt utilize? Once his confidence was gone and his head hit the canvas like that vs Johnson, his punch resistance was gone forever. Also he handcuffed his self for fear of being caught after the Tarver 2, he didnt trust his reflexes anymore.


Its hard to just change everything you did over 20+ years in a sport, dont matter how many skills you have.

Hopkins isnt the athete Jones but he fights the same as he did in his prime, he just is older and doesnt throw as many punches, isnt as aggressive and depends more on ring generalship. His skills are still the same. Had he suffered a knockout he'd be fighting with doubts like everyone else.

[LetOutTheCage]

I somewhat agree that his unorthodox style was his strength and his weakness. That said, if Roy Jones never learned the "basics" he would've been KO'ed years before. Physical gifts or not, put Usain Bolt or Lebron James in a ring and they'd get KTFO pretty quick. Jones flew where others walked but he had to learn to walk first. Being around the sport since he was four, he had the basics entrenched in him. And he was also taught a very unique style.

Jones' problem wasn't not knowing the basics, it was just getting old. And having absolutely no punch resistance following those back to back fights with Tarver. Take away Ali's footwork and what do you have? The old Ali, who sat on the ropes and got pummeled. And that's what Jones was in his later years - even before Tarver.

I disagree, Ali after losing his footwork had to adapt and changed his style, yes he got hit more but he wasn't simply leaning on the ropes getting pummeled. His most memorable fights where after his footwork was gone and he won most of them. The same way Haggler adapted his fighting style later on in his career and was still successful. I just dont think Jones has or ever had the ring intelligence to adapt like those fighters. Hopkins could and that's the reason he has been successful for so long, it's his boxing intelligence. With Roy it was mostly reflexes and athleticism

[therealpugilist]

I disagree, Ali after losing his footwork had to adapt and changed his style, yes he got hit more but he wasn't simply leaning on the ropes getting pummeled. His most memorable fights where after his footwork was gone and he won most of them. The same way Haggler adapted his fighting style later on in his career and was still successful. I just dont think Jones has or ever had the ring intelligence to adapt like those fighters. Hopkins could and that's the reason he has been successful for so long, it's his boxing intelligence. With Roy it was mostly reflexes and athleticism

Ali fought the same way he always did.....the difference is he had a great chin and recuperative power.

If you think Jones was all athleticism, you really dont know much about boxing. Thats ok we are all here to learn

Jones had to adapt in fights and you are not going to beat highly skilled fighters like Toney and McCallum without adapting. they are very cerebral and make few mistakes. Also the reason he kayoed Hill was he was smart enough Hill was anticipating the right over his jab, so that time he shot it under because the left side would be exposed. Thats adapting to your opponent


Ali was so gifted in the 60s that we never would have knew how tough he was.


Hagler didnt adapt his fighting style, he got old and didnt have the legs he had in 70s....thats it...didnt help he had some controversial fights earlier in his career so when he became champion he started to fight more aggressively. in the 70s Hagler was a well balanced boxer puncher. Once his speed and legs went, he had no choice but to break you down.



When a fighter losers their confidence, which he did after Tarver 2, he was good as done. It was evident he lost his confidence when he lost Johnson, he wouldnt let his hands go and was worried about getting hit. Then goes on to have decent performances with flashes of the past versus Lacy, Sheika and Trinidad because he was confident he could punch with them and anticpate whats coming and how to avoid it.

[IMDAZED]

I disagree, Ali after losing his footwork had to adapt and changed his style, yes he got hit more but he wasn't simply leaning on the ropes getting pummeled. His most memorable fights where after his footwork was gone and he won most of them. The same way Haggler adapted his fighting style later on in his career and was still successful. I just dont think Jones has or ever had the ring intelligence to adapt like those fighters. Hopkins could and that's the reason he has been successful for so long, it's his boxing intelligence. With Roy it was mostly reflexes and athleticism

Nah Jones adapted too. He was much more stationary from ages 31-34 at LHW and also fought off the ropes much more as well.

[Dr Rumack]

Nothing wrong with his skills or his chin. His style just doesn't age well. Luring guys in with your hands down is a legitimate tactic and it takes skill to beat them to the counter punch.

As he got older he stopped beating them to that punch and just started to look like a fool getting gtfo while striking poses.

Dirty, boring defensive fighters have the most longevity.

Good summation.

[MRBOOMER]

Ive never really bought into the 15+ lbs weight loss excuse, since when does weight loss make a man lose his reflexes, legs and chin? Tarver lost more than him as well 45 lbs and hasnt suffered the same fate.

Not he didn't go to sleep but he looked like **** pretty much for the remainder of his lhw career. I think it's a mix of the weight loss and the punches he was taking that night although it wasn't extreme punishment it was much more then he was used to taking. He definitely wasn't the same when he fought tarver the first time.