Golovkin doesnt want 3rd Canelo fight??

[g27region]

Well his promotional team built him as some monster and he...believed it. That's why Gennady rushed out of the ring at the end. That's why Abel Sanchez said they lost the fight...because GGG lost the 12th.

Guys can bounce back from losses when their aura isnt cracked. The myth of boogeyman was cracked. That's why GGG and his team dont want Canelo again...

The question, why Canelo and boxing fans want that fight if he defeated him twice already? What's the point in it? Golovkin is already beaten, it's like chasing the fight with one of Charlo brothers, the one who gave up recently too (the other one who won is still a real deal and might be interesting option) or beaten Jacobs, these matchups are not relevant at this moment

[Shape up]

In a fight with no KD and similar punches landed...you have to try and be objective.

GGG has never looked remotely that bad before - assumed to be from punches received

Canelo was cut from a punch (has only happened once or twice before)

Both guys stood and traded with neither guy really backing up (contrast to Canelos style the 1st fight)

Heres the BIG OBJECTIVE POINT - GGG's entire career up to that point featured Gennady walking his opponents down - even in the 1st Canelo fight it was cat/mouse. In the 2nd fight GGG was walking nobody down. Hell Canelo even backed GGG up a few times. While that *shouldnt* matter in any individual fight...it would be naive to think judges and fans weren't influenced by Gennady looking physically beat and being stood up to.

Those are pretty objective narratives of what happened. No fight from decades ago...just drawing conclusions from what we observed.

And, friend, it is you in the minority that think Gennady won. There was outcry following the first fight mostly due to the one erroneous card, but no outcry in the 2nd fight. Journalists will be journalists and tried to sensationalize the scorecards, but virtually all people (boxer and trainer) that do this for a living had Canelo winning the 2nd fight. If you want to argue Gennady won the 1st fight you'll have a lot more ground to stand on as Gennady, literally, outworked Canelo even if Canelo landed the better punches..they were just too far and between all the punches of Gennady (even if most were missed, parried, or blocked...output was so much more than Canelo).

I'm very objective, I'm in the industry and have been for many years, can you honestly say that Canelo does not get preferential treatment, if a round is even remotely close then Canelo is awarded the round, your system of scoring is visual damage which is wrong, plenty of punches in that fight were worn on the gloves and parried by Golovkin but fans with limited knowledge don't know otherwise, he'll, even between rounds they show replays of the round in slow mo saying that this and that punch was good, great etc and even blind Harry could see they missed but fans like yourself still think they land, you really should get another sport to watch, I see you didn't even comment on Chavez v Taylor, deflection doesn't work with me

[Bjl12]

The question, why Canelo and boxing fans want that fight if he defeated him twice already? What's the point in it? Golovkin is already beaten, it's like chasing the fight with one of Charlo brothers, the one who gave up recently too (the other one who won is still a real deal and might be interesting option) or beaten Jacobs, these matchups are not relevant at this moment

Its PRIZEfighting...GGG brings the biggest PRIZE

I also want Jacobs, but I understand the business side of things. GGG had a promotional force behind him for years. Danny needs to do something similar to distinguish among Andrade, BJS, Jermall, Hurd, etc.

[Bjl12]

I'm very objective, I'm in the industry and have been for many years, can you honestly say that Canelo does not get preferential treatment, if a round is even remotely close then Canelo is awarded the round

Canelo CLEARLY gets preferential treatment...hes no ATG - hes not. All of his best wins are not without some controversy.

Easy case to make for Lara beating Canelo

Easy case for GGG beating Canelo 1st fight

A case can be made (not so easily) for Cotto and Trout also

His entire career would be different if those fights flip-flopped. And of course we cant forget the Floyd card and the bizarre Canelo card in GGG1.

This tends to happen when you have an enormous promotional backing (Pacman in JMM 3, Floyd in JLC1, Danny Garcia in Herrera, Paul Williams against Lara, etc.). I'm not saying it's right, but it happens when promotional companies are protecting their asset.

your system of scoring is visual damage which is wrong, plenty of punches in that fight were worn on the gloves and parried by Golovkin but fans with limited knowledge don't know otherwise, he'll, even between rounds they show replays of the round in slow mo saying that this and that punch was good, great etc and even blind Harry could see they missed but fans like yourself still think they land, you really should get another sport to watch, I see you didn't even comment on Chavez v Taylor, deflection doesn't work with me

When all things are approximately equal, as was the case in Canelo-GGG2, you look for things to indicate who got the better of exchanges.

Canelo caused significant bruising through the fight and quite frequently had GGG huffing and puffing like a big bad wolf. Those are objective signs of damage being inflicted.

GGG cutting Canelo from a punch are objective signs that GGG was getting to Canelo. That's a good scoring punch.

Why do I measure damage? Because all punches are not equal. Some people punch 10 times (i.e., Malignaggi) and do less damage than another guy punching once (i.e., Wilder, GGG, Lemieux, etc.).

Canelo went 24 rounds with a supposed boogeyman, but KOing cab drivers and elite fighters is what separates the Gennady's and Bute's from the Hearns and Klitschkos...

Damage of a punch does influence judging and that's not just my standard. Even ask WonderWhiteBreadman..judges see that stuff and it leaves an impression. Judges also notice that - coincidentally or not - GGG was NOT backing up an opponent for the 1st time in his career while he was being tagged worse than ever...and it wasnt a coincidence. The two are directly related

[HeadBodyBodyBody]

GGG is a diva

hahahaha good one

[Shape up]

Canelo CLEARLY gets preferential treatment...hes no ATG - hes not. All of his best wins are not without some controversy.

Easy case to make for Lara beating Canelo

Easy case for GGG beating Canelo 1st fight

A case can be made (not so easily) for Cotto and Trout also

His entire career would be different if those fights flip-flopped. And of course we cant forget the Floyd card and the bizarre Canelo card in GGG1.

This tends to happen when you have an enormous promotional backing (Pacman in JMM 3, Floyd in JLC1, Danny Garcia in Herrera, Paul Williams against Lara, etc.). I'm not saying it's right, but it happens when promotional companies are protecting their asset.



When all things are approximately equal, as was the case in Canelo-GGG2, you look for things to indicate who got the better of exchanges.

Canelo caused significant bruising through the fight and quite frequently had GGG huffing and puffing like a big bad wolf. Those are objective signs of damage being inflicted.

GGG cutting Canelo from a punch are objective signs that GGG was getting to Canelo. That's a good scoring punch.

Why do I measure damage? Because all punches are not equal. Some people punch 10 times (i.e., Malignaggi) and do less damage than another guy punching once (i.e., Wilder, GGG, Lemieux, etc.).

Canelo went 24 rounds with a supposed boogeyman, but KOing cab drivers and elite fighters is what separates the Gennady's and Bute's from the Hearns and Klitschkos...

Damage of a punch does influence judging and that's not just my standard. Even ask WonderWhiteBreadman..judges see that stuff and it leaves an impression. Judges also notice that - coincidentally or not - GGG was NOT backing up an opponent for the 1st time in his career while he was being tagged worse than ever...and it wasnt a coincidence. The two are directly related

So in the 2nd fight there was many close rounds so who would have been scored the winner of all of those, Canelo of course, when your fighting the judges and your opponent the only way to win is by Ko, Canelo starts the fight with about 3 rounds in the bank, GGG in the first fight clearly won fighting his style but was only given a draw, why would he fight the same way in the 2nd fight when he was robbed in the 1st, he boxed, lateral movement, that's why Canelo stood his ground, I personally had the second fight a draw but because of preferential treatment obviously Canelo got the decision which was always going to happen, there should be a system put in place where promotors don't know who the judges in WT fights will be until the time of the fight, a pool of judges being picked out of a hat

[Bjl12]

So in the 2nd fight there was many close rounds so who would have been scored the winner of all of those, Canelo of course, when your fighting the judges and your opponent the only way to win is by Ko, Canelo starts the fight with about 3 rounds in the bank,

5/6 judges saw all 24 rounds exactly the same. No free rounds....just difficult to score rounds. And Abel/GGG literally picked the judges for the 2nd fight.......

GGG in the first fight clearly won fighting his style but was only given a draw, why would he fight the same way in the 2nd fight when he was robbed in the 1st, he boxed, lateral movement, that's why Canelo stood his ground,

GGG looked like he did literally nothing different in the rematch. Abel said so leading up to fight...

• "All those same things were said prior to the first fight [about going for a knockout] and it ended up being a track meet. I think that on [Sept. 15] when [Golden Boy promoter] Oscar [De La Hoya] and Canelo are having breakfast, Oscar needs to remind him he needs to bring his courage to the venue that night because he's going to need it. If he intends to knock out Golovkin, he's going to have to fight him. And if he fights him, he's going to get knocked out. I said that before; he would have gotten knocked out the first time, but he decided to make it a track meet that night.
  
  "But if he comes to fight and if he comes to knock out Golovkin as he said he's going to -- if he doesn't defraud the fans again -- then he's going to get knocked out. I've said it and I'll say it again."
  
  Sanchez has continued on and on about Alvarez's style, though he has always been a counterpuncher at heart and not the straight brawler some make him out to be. But it hasn't stopped Sanchez.
  
  "I hope Canelo was able to see a transmission specialist for the rematch, because in the first fight he was stuck in reverse."
  Abel Sanchez on Canelo Alvarez's fighting style in his 2017 meeting with Gennady Golovkin
  "I hope he's more aggressive," Sanchez said. "The fans deserve it so they can see a better fight.
  
  It's impossible to knock somebody out when they run. Don't run."

http://www.espn.com/boxing/story/_/i...ulling-punches

Rather than teach GGG to cut off the ring Abel and GGG begged Canelo to stand and trade. Canelo did just that and for majority of fight it was Gennady being stopped in his tracks. That's not an improved gameplan...that's just hoping your opponent doesnt improve.

I personally had the second fight a draw but because of preferential treatment obviously Canelo got the decision which was always going to happen, there should be a system put in place where promotors don't know who the judges in WT fights will be until the time of the fight, a pool of judges being picked out of a hat

A draw is a fair score. 2 judges had 115-113 and the other judge had it 114-114. Nothing biased about having it a draw.

The current judging system clearly doesnt work. I don't know the solution, but this particular fight (2nd fight) was not controversial. Case can be made on 1st fight or other similar fights, but these two are just evenly matched thoroughbreds...its competitive no matter when they fight. Neither guy is ATG good, but both aren't far from it.

[AKAcronym]

Canelo fans try so hard to convince themselves that Saul dominated. If all you have to go by is facial damage, then you don't have much of an argument. Golovkin didn't look beat up until the 13th round elbow made things look worse.

https://www.instagram.com/p/BraDiIuA...d=hbsthiqt0dhd

That's GGG after Rosado, despite only 7 rounds and not taking the amount of punches he did against Alvarez, yet he ended up looking like that. I guess that fight was close and not the actual one-sided beatdown it was, which apparently was Golovkin/Alvarez 2.

[Shape up]

5/6 judges saw all 24 rounds exactly the same. No free rounds....just difficult to score rounds. And Abel/GGG literally picked the judges for the 2nd fight.......



GGG looked like he did literally nothing different in the rematch. Abel said so leading up to fight...

• "All those same things were said prior to the first fight [about going for a knockout] and it ended up being a track meet. I think that on [Sept. 15] when [Golden Boy promoter] Oscar [De La Hoya] and Canelo are having breakfast, Oscar needs to remind him he needs to bring his courage to the venue that night because he's going to need it. If he intends to knock out Golovkin, he's going to have to fight him. And if he fights him, he's going to get knocked out. I said that before; he would have gotten knocked out the first time, but he decided to make it a track meet that night.
  
  "But if he comes to fight and if he comes to knock out Golovkin as he said he's going to -- if he doesn't defraud the fans again -- then he's going to get knocked out. I've said it and I'll say it again."
  
  Sanchez has continued on and on about Alvarez's style, though he has always been a counterpuncher at heart and not the straight brawler some make him out to be. But it hasn't stopped Sanchez.
  
  "I hope Canelo was able to see a transmission specialist for the rematch, because in the first fight he was stuck in reverse."
  Abel Sanchez on Canelo Alvarez's fighting style in his 2017 meeting with Gennady Golovkin
  "I hope he's more aggressive," Sanchez said. "The fans deserve it so they can see a better fight.
  
  It's impossible to knock somebody out when they run. Don't run."

http://www.espn.com/boxing/story/_/i...ulling-punches

Rather than teach GGG to cut off the ring Abel and GGG begged Canelo to stand and trade. Canelo did just that and for majority of fight it was Gennady being stopped in his tracks. That's not an improved gameplan...that's just hoping your opponent doesnt improve.




A draw is a fair score. 2 judges had 115-113 and the other judge had it 114-114. Nothing biased about having it a draw.

The current judging system clearly doesnt work. I don't know the solution, but this particular fight (2nd fight) was not controversial. Case can be made on 1st fight or other similar fights, but these two are just evenly matched thoroughbreds...its competitive no matter when they fight. Neither guy is ATG good, but both aren't far from it.

Ggg backed canelo up for the whole first fight and clearly won the fight but the scorecards didnt reflect that so should he have done the same in the second fight or try something different to get a better outcome, if you do the same thing how can you expect the outcome to be different, to quote what sanchez says is ridiculous, thats the same as quoting roach, the trainers should be seen and not heard, just the same as refs, some love to get thsir heads on TV

[Bjl12]

Ggg backed canelo up for the whole first fight and clearly won the fight but the scorecards didnt reflect that so should he have done the same in the second fight or try something different to get a better outcome, if you do the same thing how can you expect the outcome to be different, to quote what sanchez says is ridiculous, thats the same as quoting roach, the trainers should be seen and not heard, just the same as refs, some love to get thsir heads on TV

This will be the last time I respond to you on this topic.

The first and second fights were very different. What changed was Canelo's gameplan.

Abel is on the record asking for exactly what happened - Canelo to stand and trade - that was GGG's gameplan. Abel even said after the fight that Canelo gave them exactly what they wanted.

Abel is ALSO on record saying he can't complain about the judges because Canelo fought a great fight.

If you are upset about the gameplan of a fighter in either fight please contact their camp. Most people saw a winner, albeit narrow, but only rabid fans whined about robberies or controversy.

There was never a robbery. I felt Canelo won both fights 7-5 and I'd be happy to go through those fights if you wanted. I also am not put-off if someone says GGG won both fights 7-5 although I think GGG winning 7 rounds in the 2nd fight is pushing it. Nonetheless deviating 1 round from the official judge(s) is not outrageous.

The two guys are evenly matched no matter how you slice it. They could fight 10 times and after 120 rounds it could be something like 54-54-12. The most glaring difference is their age and, if you can remain objective, it is very hard to pretend Canelo ducked.

Canelo has fought Lara, Trout, Floyd, Cotto, GGG...and the 2nd GGG was coming of a year layoff (without a tuneup), knee surgery, and PED speculation. And now he will fight top contender Danny Jacobs

GGG has fought Canelo and Danny Jacobs. There are no other legitimate threats on his entire professional resume. Like it or not GGG has one of the worst boxing resumes in any weight class today. And he had chances to fight Andrade, Dervenchenko, BJS, Canelo/Cotto in 2015 at a catchweight, Ward at 168, Lara, and others I'm probably forgetting. He chose not to take those fights so he must live with those consequences.

If one is to objectively examine each fighter...one guy who is guilty of ducking can never be Canelo. He has never ducked. I believe him when he says he'll fight "so and so" when he's ready. He said in 2015 he'd fight GGG when he's body was ready for 160 which he forecasted would be 2 years...GGG V Canelo 1 happened in 2017 with the rematch in 2018.

GGG balked with Ward, Canelo/Cotto in 2015 over a few pounds, never acknowledged Lara, passed up on BJS, Andrade, and Dervenchenko. Those are champion caliber opponents. Instead he continued fighting the Vanes of the world and has nobody to blame but himself.

Oh and the reason Canelo is fighting Danny Jacobs in May is because GGG doesn't want the 3rd fight. GGG prefers a different opponent. It's clear as day to those who aren't wearing extremely biased glass lenses