Larry Holmes never gets the credit he deserves!

[Anthony342]

I am not debating that. I am just saying what Ring magazine said at the time. I still have the Ring where they claimed it was the reason. Beating Ali was a better reason no doubt.

I don't need Wiki to see what happened in the 70's and 80's I watched every fight back then and subscribed to every publication.


That being said, I never agreed with the modern definition of lineal champion. Before The Ring started naming Ring champions(which fans today tab "lineal"), lineal meant "the man who beat the man". Marciano and Louis for example, they where the only champions in the world so they where the lineal champion. Back in the seventies The Ring had many titles vacant in their rankings and decided a way to fill those spots often was naming a champion that held one title but was not undisputed, meaning there were other champions out there with a claim to the title. Fans started confusing Ring campion with "lineal" which before that time also meant someone down the line was the only champion.

True, but I still give the Ring champion more weight than say, a WBC title holder, even today, in most cases. And Ring and lineal champs are often one in the same. I do like that when looking them up online on TBRB or Wikipedia, that they have the separate columns for Ring and lineal too and that Transnational Boxing Rankings Board recognizes their own champions now too.

[HOUDINI563]

Agreed and certainly. The reason it’s not is that the typical fans eyes glaze over when you mention lineal title and the idea behind it. Most fans just know Wilder and Joshua are the champions as they hold the political titles. To be honest boxing has become such a convoluted mess I’ve thrown my hands in the air regarding the lineal title. The powers that be don’t care and the titles get more and more fragmented. If we all were smart WE would all get together and form the “lineal boxing championship” and bring order back to boxing. One champion ignoring the alphabet titles all based upon historical champions and LOGICAL lineage. Understanding that a true historical lineage atthis point is impossible in some circumstances.

[Anthony342]

Agreed and certainly. The reason it’s not is that the typical fans eyes glaze over when you mention lineal title and the idea behind it. Most fans just know Wilder and Joshua are the champions as they hold the political titles. To be honest boxing has become such a convoluted mess I’ve thrown my hands in the air regarding the lineal title. The powers that be don’t care and the titles get more and more fragmented. If we all were smart WE would all get together and form the “lineal boxing championship” and bring order back to boxing. One champion ignoring the alphabet titles all based upon historical champions and LOGICAL lineage. Understanding that a true historical lineage atthis point is impossible in some circumstances.

That's what these guys are trying to do: http://www.tbrb.org/

[Ben Bolt]

To be honest boxing has become such a convoluted mess I’ve thrown my hands in the air regarding the lineal title. The powers that be don’t care and the titles get more and more fragmented. If we all were smart WE would all get together and form the “lineal boxing championship” and bring order back to boxing.

That's what these guys are trying to do: http://www.tbrb.org/

I wrote it before. I think it's a shame that TBRB, The Ring and the other big boxing sites/mags can't cooperate and agree on publishing the same ratings. If they did, it would take a lot of power away from the boxing orgs.

The boxing journalists know each other, if not personally so by name, because they read each others stuff. So if they were dedicated, they could nullify today's mess in the pro boxing world.

In most other sports, journalists fight for their sport's reputation and strike hard against all idiocies that would harm it.
I'm pretty fed up of today's boxing reporters, who whenever they see an acronym in connection with a title fight, report it as a "true world title fight".

Today, even The Ring recognizes most belts. As I read recently in the mag: The Ring doesn't recognize WBA regular belts, only WBA super/ordinary belts (along with WBC, IBF, WBO belts).
Why?

[HOUDINI563]

Boxing has been on a downward spiral, with some brief exceptions, since Ali retired in 1979. Someone came up with the idea that if their were unlimited “world championship” title bouts revenues paid to the commissions would soar. Thus the purposeful fragmentation of titles. They want the multiple champions and the 40 plus top ten challengers. It’s all about the $ and nothing more. Ring has lost its legacy unfortunately. Writers that are TRUELY connected with boxing history are too few and far between. Too many revisionists trying to make a name for themselves by being controversial. Too many who just don’t have a grasp of boxing’s past history.