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Jack was coming off a long layoff and gene was active.
Or would genes style always beat jack even in his prime?
Or would genes style always beat jack even in his prime?
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I wouldn't have said that Dempsey would have been prime even two years earlier.
Dempsey's prime was 1919-1922 for me. We complain about the state of the heavyweight division today, but frankly it was shocking that Dempsey held the title from 1923 to 1926 without one defense! It could be argued that Dempsey was showing signs of slipping in his thriller with Firpo in 1923.
Its no surprise that Dempsey lost to Tunney; throughout that time Gene had been very active, sharpening his skills against the likes of Greb (several times!), Carpentier, Delaney and Gibbons.
History forever shows us what a two or three year layoff can do to a fighter. When Dempsey met Tunney he was rusty and had lost the pace and sharpness of his prime years. Even then he did scare Tunney a fair bit, certainly in the second fight!
As for who would have won if they had met prime for prime, I'd always maintain that Tunney would be a tough fight. The man had simply superb boxing skills, a terrific chin, an iron will and unmatched ring intelligence. That said, I would shade prime Dempsey over prime Tunney under 1919 rules. 'That' Dempsey had a ridiculous level of pace and hand/footspeed that would seriously scare Tunney......and if Jack did manage to knock Gene down (hardly a rash assertion considering the 1927 rematch!) than Dempsey would simply stand over Gene and bludgeon him the moment he tried to repeatedly stand up!!! -
As for who would have won if they had met prime for prime, I'd always maintain that Tunney would be a tough fight. The man had simply superb boxing skills, a terrific chin, an iron will and unmatched ring intelligence. That said, I would shade prime Dempsey over prime Tunney under 1919 rules. 'That' Dempsey had a ridiculous level of pace and hand/footspeed that would seriously scare Tunney......and if Jack did manage to knock Gene down (hardly a rash assertion considering the 1927 rematch!) than Dempsey would simply stand over Gene and bludgeon him the moment he tried to repeatedly stand up!!!
Great insight as always sugar JComment
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To speak of Dempsey and be thorough you need to add in all the "Kid Blackie" fights he fought all over the country at tuff man carnivals and barnstormin' events. Most of these fights were against men who held and hit and were known for their strength. Jack fought alot of those men and although theres no record of those fights he used to say how he'd get ruffed up pretty good from a combination of bare knuckled to wrapping with cloth to what would be compared to as 4oz bag gloves. Point is he took alot of abuse and as the years go on that abuse mounts up and does effect stamina and often times with trial horse type guys their focus is deminished!
This isn't an excuse but these are the facts that fighters who traveled back in that era as fighters dealt with.
I had an Uncle ****e (Marino, and many other names hahaha) who fought in the teens and 20s and actually fought twice in one night when a snow storm stopped a few fighters from showing up. He actually did this a few times in Canada, he fought a 4 round prelim and came back to fight the main event hahahaha!! He fought at 115lbs and fought guys 155lbs. Again point is that era was very different even from 1925. That ten year period (1915 to 1925)is when boxing styles and training methods began to change, and thats the biggest change in history even in todays standards.
I like Jake over Tuney because I like punchers who can move and Jack was NOT slow footed at all he also had good hand speed and put punches together very well.
I also think Tuney is a fantastic boxer and he's the guy that would always give Dempsey fits.
I've read articles all through the years about Jack passing on fighting this guy or that guy and that gets over blown. As we all see management has the first call on opponents and theres outside obligations the fans have no clue about. I don't think Dempsey feared anyone, I met the man and as I've stated on this forum before he was the biggest 6'1" man I ever met!! His hands were like huge ham hocks and his hand shake was very very memorable. When you consider all the travels and all the fights this man had and he still was able to jump start his career as trials and tribulations kept coming and going. Imagine the current day fellows living his life???
When theres a fantasy fight suggestion lets put the modern guy back in time with Jack, say 1922 for age comparisons. Using his rules and his equipment!
I'd surely pay to see that;
Dempsey vs Marciano at the Yankee Stadium!!!!
Dempsey vs Ali at Madison Sq. Garden
Dempsey vs Tyson at Las Vegas Nev.
.................................................. .....Dempsey was the biggest name in sports back then even bigger than Ruth. He's still pretty big today too! RayComment
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