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Old 09-07-2017, 11:51 PM #41
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Originally Posted by JK1700 View Post
I would've loved to see him fight Canelo around 2012 it would've been a really interesting fight at that point. Martinez is just unlucky that he didn't have a bigger promoter and he would've got bigger fights but at the same time even though I liked him I never bought into the hype because his best wins were against overhyped guys who stood right in front of him (Pavlik, Williams) and had no versatility. He was the best MW for a few years and had some entertaining fights, but that doesn't make you p4p top 3 or some sort of boogeyman/monster. The MW division has been really bad for a very long time now.
naw Canelo was to Green according to this forum
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Old 09-07-2017, 11:55 PM #42
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Originally Posted by larryxxx. View Post
naw Canelo was to Green according to this forum
The Canelo that struggled with Trout would of lost badly to Martinez. Canelo now would still lose to Prime Martinez but would be closer
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Old 09-07-2017, 11:57 PM #43
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Originally Posted by larryxxx. View Post
I dont get why Floyd has to fight all these bigger guys for ya'll to say he would lose...I mean he fought several world champs..moved up 4 divisions and came out undefeated...Why are ya'll so angry about that?
Makes them feel a little better that Floyd, a guy who started at 130lbs and fought over 50% of his fights there, and never weighed more than 150lbs on fight night, would lose to JMW's and MW's who weigh 165lbs on fight night.

The least they can do, being top 5 P4P fighters and top 3 of their weight class at 154-160, is beat Floyd. That's the least they can do.

No version of Martinez in history beats Canelo or Cotto. Martinez got wrecked so badly vs Cotto, that I don't see how any version of Martinez beats Cotto, bad knee or not. Martinez is prone to knock downs, always has been, as seen vs Chavez Jr as well, and Cotto while he lacks in defense he's always had A+ offense. Martinez's crappy balance vs Cotto's offense would always end up in disaster. With that said, Mayweather went 2-0 vs Cotto and Canelo at JMW.

No triangle theory here, but Martinez has shown his sh*t defense and balance consistently vs Williams, Pavlik, Macklin, Cotto, Murray, Chavez Jr. With this sh*t defense and terrible balance that even prime Martinez showed, idk what makes people think a guy as defensively sound and as offensively poised as Mayweather would lose any more than 4 rounds vs Martinez, green, prime, past prime, doesn't matter. Martinez wins 4 rounds at best.
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Old 09-08-2017, 12:03 AM #44
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Originally Posted by -Kev- View Post
Makes them feel a little better that Floyd, a guy who started at 130lbs and fought over 50% of his fights there, and never weighed more than 150lbs on fight night, would lose to JMW's and MW's who weigh 165lbs on fight night.

The least they can do, being top 5 P4P fighters and top 3 of their weight class at 154-160, is beat Floyd. That's the least they can do.

No version of Martinez in history beats Canelo or Cotto. Martinez got wrecked so badly vs Cotto, that I don't see how any version of Martinez beats Cotto, bad knee or not. Martinez is prone to knock downs, always has been, as seen vs Chavez Jr as well, and Cotto while he lacks in defense he's always had A+ offense. Martinez's crappy balance vs Cotto's offense would always end up in disaster. With that said, Mayweather went 2-0 vs Cotto and Canelo at JMW.

No triangle theory here, but Martinez has shown his sh*t defense and balance consistently vs Williams, Pavlik, Macklin, Cotto, Murray, Chavez Jr. With this sh*t defense and terrible balance that even prime Martinez showed, idk what makes people think a guy as defensively sound and as offensively poised as Mayweather would lose any more than 4 rounds vs Martinez, green, prime, past prime, doesn't matter. Martinez wins 4 rounds at best.
Martinez's height reach and footwork would be very difficult for Floyd. Also Martinez throws a lot of punches and has crazy good stamina. He could throw a 100 punches a round. Also Floyd ain't gonna walk him down no way with Martinez power Floyd won't risk it. Floyd will just be overwhelmed and be so defensive and not be able to return fire. Gonna lose by decision or late TKO.
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Old 09-08-2017, 12:04 AM #45
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Martinez didn't look good against Macklin or Barker for that matter, it seems much gets overlooked with Sergio Martinez. I understand that he no longer had his knees against Cotto but one can't ignore the fact that Cotto was the most skilled fighter Martinez had ever faced.
Exactly he struggled in those fights and those guys aren't even great boxers, so imagine what a master boxer would've done to him. People make excuses for fighters they like, yeah Martinez was past it and had bad knees but Cotto was also old and worn down at that point. Personally I think Floyd would've beat him comfortably anyway but it's not realistic since he walked around 20-25lbs heavier. It would've been like asking Lomachenko to fight Errol Spence or Thurman. It's totally ridiculous but I guess haters can only mention bigger guys when it comes to Mayweather since he beat everyone else. If anything I would've liked to see Martinez/Canelo that would've been a good one.

Last edited by JK1700; 09-08-2017 at 12:07 AM.
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Old 09-08-2017, 12:04 AM #46
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Originally Posted by muslimer12 View Post
The Canelo that struggled with Trout would of lost badly to Martinez. Canelo now would still lose to Prime Martinez but would be closer
Lol "prime" Martinez.

Prime Martinez is too defensively careless for Canelo.

Look who knocked down "prime" Martinez:

Williams
Pavlik
Macklin
Chavez Jr (almost killed Martinez in round 12)
Murray (twice) - Murray actually beat him on my scores

If you think Canelo would not have absolutely obliterate Martinez, you must have amnesia about how bad Martinez defense really was.
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Old 09-08-2017, 12:10 AM #47
whoelsebutjames whoelsebutjames is offline
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Lol "prime" Martinez.

Prime Martinez is too defensively careless for Canelo.

Look who knocked down "prime" Martinez:

Williams
Pavlik
Macklin
Chavez Jr (almost killed Martinez in round 12)
Murray (twice) - Murray actually beat him on my scores

If you think Canelo would not have absolutely obliterate Martinez, you must have amnesia about how bad Martinez defense really was.
Martinez was the Cinderella man. They guy who wasn't supposed to win and found his power as he aged. It's easy to get emotionally invested. Plus, people love the unexpected KO. It's not his attributes it's his intangibles.
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Old 09-08-2017, 12:11 AM #48
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Originally Posted by muslimer12 View Post
Martinez's height reach and footwork would be very difficult for Floyd. Also Martinez throws a lot of punches and has crazy good stamina. He could throw a 100 punches a round. Also Floyd ain't gonna walk him down no way with Martinez power Floyd won't risk it. Floyd will just be overwhelmed and be so defensive and not be able to return fire. Gonna lose by decision or late TKO.
Martinez having good stamina is a misconception, he tired against Macklin, Barker and Pavlik, fortunately for him all three of them stood right in front of him.

It's an entirely different ball game when your opponent forces you to have to constantly reset and is willing to go to the body as well.
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Old 09-08-2017, 12:13 AM #49
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Originally Posted by muslimer12 View Post
Martinez's height reach and footwork would be very difficult for Floyd. Also Martinez throws a lot of punches and has crazy good stamina. He could throw a 100 punches a round. Also Floyd ain't gonna walk him down no way with Martinez power Floyd won't risk it. Floyd will just be overwhelmed and be so defensive and not be able to return fire. Gonna lose by decision or late TKO.
It doesn't matter if Martinez throws a lot of punches against other opponents, the work rate wouldn't stay the same vs Floyd, he'd bring it down because that's what Floyd does, he brings down the pace of his opponents to his own.

The Martinez opponents with the most solid defense was Martin Murray and Matthew Macklin. Martinez threw 591 punches against Murray and 437 vs Macklin (in 11 rounds), this wasn't Martinez getting old, this was Martinez vs someone with good defense. In comparison Martinez threw 908 vs Chavez Jr, 691 vs Barker (11 rounds), and 686 vs Pavlik.

If Macklin lowered Martinez down to 437 punches thrown in 11 rounds, what do you think Mayweather would do?
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Old 09-08-2017, 12:13 AM #50
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Lol "prime" Martinez.

Prime Martinez is too defensively careless for Canelo.

Look who knocked down "prime" Martinez:

Williams
Pavlik
Macklin
Chavez Jr (almost killed Martinez in round 12)
Murray (twice) - Murray actually beat him on my scores

If you think Canelo would not have absolutely obliterate Martinez, you must have amnesia about how bad Martinez defense really was.
Martinez was def past it when he fought Murray. And all those knockdowns with the exception of the Chavez one were cuz of his balance. Tbh I would barely call them knockdowns. Williams hit Martinez on his shoulder as he was moving and Martinez slipped and was a knocked down. Martinez tripped over Macklins feet and was considered a knock down. And pavlik tapped Martinez on the head as Martinez was in an awkward position. Martinez was never hurt by them. His defense was his footwork and Canelo struggles GREATLY with guys who move. Combine that with the power speed and stamina of Martinez and it does not look good for canelo.
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