Marciano 49-0 vs. Mayweather 49-0.

[New England]

Except by the most literal standard, which of course is that if they'd fought, Marciano would have easily knocked Floyd out. So calling Mayweather the "greater fighter" is pretty silly. You need to add P4P to that statement for it to make any sense.

shut the f#ck up and get out of the history section, troll.

[travestyny]

Respectfully I disagree. Not that I would want the history section to turn into the 2010 NSB with this discussion. Mayweather had no interest in fighting the Pacman that destroyed Hatton and De La Hoya. It wasn't until Manny suffered a knockout to Marquez that he wanted the fight. Much the same way he accepted the Cotto fight, after he was stopped by Manny.

I know you mentioned not wanting to divert the conversation, but how can you say Mayweather had no interest in fighting a prime Pac when he signed a 50/50 contract to do just that?

Doesn't make sense to say he didn't want to fight when the fight wasn't made because Pac needed 24 days in between testing and the fight (which he suddenly didn't need in 2015) and even Freddie Roach places the blame more on Pac's team's side.

[IronDanHamza]

Respectfully I disagree. Not that I would want the history section to turn into the 2010 NSB with this discussion. Mayweather had no interest in fighting the Pacman that destroyed Hatton and De La Hoya. It wasn't until Manny suffered a knockout to Marquez that he wanted the fight. Much the same way he accepted the Cotto fight, after he was stopped by Manny.


Now I do agree Mayweather had better skills than Marciano, especially on the defensive end and arguably is the best boxer of this era.
There were many that thought Marciano could have lost to LaStarza in the first fight, the same way that most say Mayweather got a gift over Castillo. On the debate of resumes, Charles, Louis, Walcott and ol Archie stack up way higher than the 20 Mayweather beat but that may come down a debate of quality vs. quantity. I think it cannot not be debated reasonably by how much of a Mayweather fan you are or just because you are a Marciano fan.

You say "most say" in regards to Mayweather-Castillo when it's generally split down the middle more or less.

In regards to Mayweather-Pacquaio, you disagreeing with it doesn't change the fact that Pacquaio turned down and walked away from the fight in 2010.

[N/A]

shut the f#ck up and get out of the history section, troll.

If we were trolls, it would be easy to debunk our position. Yet, you can't. Which is why you resort to the sort of histrionics above.

[billeau2]

Is it just human nature? to need to disparage one guy or the other? First off, Marciano fought some great fighters just a bit off twilight, and so did Floyd, Lets not forget that Marciano fought Moore, Charles (Twice) Louis and Walcott. With the exception of perhaps Louis these men were still a real threat, at least as much as the version of Pacman and Mosley and even Judah that Floyd fought. My point is that this point is comprable to an extent.

Beyond that things diverge widely: Different situations totally. Floyd grew up in a boxing pedigree clinic. Michigan tough... Always been known for excellent technical fighters, with toughness and pride. Marciano walked into the Arthur Murray Dance studio and was told he would never do...

Marciano became the Bionic man...Charlie Goldman the engineer. Instead of the slow careful steps of the puncher, cutting the ring off, Marciano was taught to duck under, to leap back when necessary and to come in under with his own flurries. Once inside, Marciano was taught relentlessness and not speed. One can look at Hank Armstrong and see that what Marciano did had been accomplished, just not as a heavyweight where one good punch could mean the fight.

Again lets look at precedent...As a heavyweight Holyfield got by initially on his activity rate...sure he had good combo punching, but what allowed him to fight up when he first started to, was as with Marciano, his ability to be unrelenting against the big boys...When he did go up against a skilled boxer puncher he initially lost (Moore).

Floyd and Marciano both have a similar record, both guys never fought a prime ATG, but fought fighters who were still dangerous in their twilight. As far as Floyd's last fight it is not disrespectful to consider that McGregor was not a professional boxer. Its a fact. Beyond that they are very different fighters.

[billeau2]

I know you mentioned not wanting to divert the conversation, but how can you say Mayweather had no interest in fighting a prime Pac when he signed a 50/50 contract to do just that?

Doesn't make sense to say he didn't want to fight when the fight wasn't made because Pac needed 24 days in between testing and the fight (which he suddenly didn't need in 2015) and even Freddie Roach places the blame more on Pac's team's side.

"Whether the barn burns down with the pigs inside, or I buy pork chops, roast pork is roast pork."

I don't blame Floyd, or Marciano, for that matter, for not facing certain opponents. the argument that Floyd ducked Margarito and Williams I don't agree with because if Floyd had beat either guy we would be having the same conversation about prime ATG's and title defense.

At the end of the day for whatever reason... Floyd much like Marciano did not have that career defining fight against a prime ATG juggernaught.

[lightsout_finit]

Floyd has by far the greater resume, and more impressive achievements, longevity, skills and list of opponents.

Never beat a great in their prime.
Waited out dangerous opponents or avoided them completely.

I can't think of even one old time legend who did it that way, can you?

agreed. floyd mayweather is a greater fighter than rocky marciano by any real, objective standard.

Yeah?
Marciano would ko him.
Would he not?

only thing rocky really did better was punch and take punishment. floyd basically ticks every other box. he had a better career and was a much better fighter.

How do we really know? Floyd ducked any and all credible threats.

And anyone who loses to Castillo and Maidana can't be that good....

I don't really like comparing them because of the difference in weight class. Marciano did what he had to do as a heavyweight so I can't disrespect what he did. But that just doesn't compare to a multi division champion like Mayweather.

You are commending Floyd for taking the path of least resistance?
That's not a good thing...

Besides Marciano never lost to Maidana level guys.

[lightsout_finit]

Rocky never waited for any opponents to get old. Mayweather did just that with Pacquiao. Rock was a green twig when Charles and Louis were in their primes, so no fault can be laid at his feet. A lot can be laid at Mayweather's. Thug lovers will never see that, though.

Despite consummate defensive skills, Mayweather has the most carefully manufactured resume of any world level fighter. I like guys who come to fight, not wussies who put on more of a fight with words before the fight than with their brittle little mitts once the bell rings.

The tune of punks like Mayweather changes once the bell rings and all the tickets are sold. They do not go out and thrash as promised. They go out instead for a carefully executed exhibition match.

I never had much use for Mayweather's brand of entertainment, nor any respect at all for the type of mentality that hailed and idolized him. To me the guy was simply the Meadowlark Lemon of boxing.

Solid post.

You forgot to mention ducking Margarito and Williams to fight Sharmba Mitchell and then be A WWF wrestling q*eer.
Getting the win even when he loses and then getting to keep rematching guys till he really beats them.

I had to google Meadowlark Lemon.
Fitting comparison Indeed.

[lightsout_finit]

the argument that Floyd ducked Margarito and Williams I don't agree with because if Floyd had beat either guy we would be having the same conversation about prime ATG's and title defense.

None of that makes sense. He either ducked them or didn't?

Both bigger and stronger than anyone Floyd ever fought.
You think that's a coincidence?

[travestyny]

"Whether the barn burns down with the pigs inside, or I buy pork chops, roast pork is roast pork."

I don't blame Floyd, or Marciano, for that matter, for not facing certain opponents. the argument that Floyd ducked Margarito and Williams I don't agree with because if Floyd had beat either guy we would be having the same conversation about prime ATG's and title defense.

At the end of the day for whatever reason... Floyd much like Marciano did not have that career defining fight against a prime ATG juggernaught.

Agreed. That fight should have happened when both were closer to their prime, for sure!