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Old 11-22-2020, 02:33 PM #71
Anthony342 Anthony342 is offline
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Originally Posted by GhostofDempsey View Post
Manny knew if he postponed the fight he would likely not get another chance. It took him five years of chasing Floyd for the fight. Floyd himself said he deserved credit for being smart that he marinated the fight for all those years. Manny had a world class and highly respected surgeon diagnose and operate on his shoulder. It wasn’t an excuse it was a real injury.
Apparently the Nevada commission declined the toradol injection, but Pacquiao's camp still could've gotten cortisone. Don't know why he didn't then.
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Old 11-22-2020, 02:35 PM #72
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Originally Posted by GhostofDempsey View Post
Not only did he use drug testing as his initial dodge, he had the audacity to be caught cheating after the fight with the illegal IV. He was never dehydrated, he was masking something. T-levels don’t lie.

When you think about it, what better way to conceal your own cheating and PED use than to publicly claim you want to clean up boxing, insist on blood tests, and all the while you have USADA on your team?
He would also have to have a WADA lab on his team. The WADA labs don't work for USADA. His samples are required by the lab to pass a specific gravity to be tested. Even with a TUE, he wouldn't be allowed to fail the test. That's not how it works. A TUE doesn't allow you to test positive, and you can't mask a urine sample that has passed a specific gravity test, which is a requirement of the lab.

And there was nothing out of the ordinary about his T-levels. An expert already stated as much flat out. This is just more bullshlt that you don't understand. You're busy talking about blood tests, when the test he took the night before the fight was not a blood test. It was a urine test.

Also, the TUE application doesn't have the athletes' names on them. They are purposely anonymous to the doctors who preside over them. You know nothing of this process.


If USADA wanted to help him cheat, there would never have been a TUE. Why would they want to draw attention, create a paper trail, and involve various other people in different organizations if they wanted to help him cheat? To make it more likely that they get caught?

Last edited by travestyny; 11-22-2020 at 02:43 PM.
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Old 11-22-2020, 02:47 PM #73
Anthony342 Anthony342 is offline
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This was consistent with WADA protocol. They didn't change any rules for Mayweather.
No they didn't. He didn't break them but Floyd was trying to bend the rules to turn the game in his favor. Kinda like a cooler in a casino who comes in to make sure you lose. Whether it's loaded dice, a new deck of cards, a new dealer. It's all about sleight of hand. Look over here, so you can't see what's going on over there. It prepared him well for his career now as a promoter.
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Old 11-22-2020, 02:55 PM #74
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No they didn't. He didn't break them but Floyd was trying to bend the rules to turn the game in his favor. Kinda like a cooler in a casino who comes in to make sure you lose. Whether it's loaded dice, a new deck of cards, a new dealer. It's all about sleight of hand. Look over here, so you can't see what's going on over there. It prepared him well for his career now as a promoter.
How was he trying to bend the rules? They were literally WADA's rules. USADA is forced to follow WADA's rules.


It was no different than the retroactive TUE that was given to Ian McCall of the UFC and other athletes when they received an IV after having it cleared. A retroactive TUE has been a part of WADA's protocol long before this fight.


USADA publicly put out a 25 page rebuttal regarding any wrongdoing:

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Last edited by travestyny; 11-22-2020 at 03:06 PM.
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Old 11-22-2020, 03:15 PM #75
Anthony342 Anthony342 is offline
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How was he trying to bend the rules? They were literally WADA's rules. USADA is forced to follow WADA's rules.


It was no different than the retroactive TUE that was given to Ian McCall of the UFC and other athletes when they received an IV after having it cleared. A retroactive TUE has been a part of WADA's protocol long before this fight.
Okay, but Floyd was still trying to avoid having the fight happen sooner. Otherwise, why mention publicly letting the fight marinate unless he wanted negotiations to take longer? So I believe he came up with this drug testing excuse knowing it would be a major roadblock because it had not been done before in pro boxing (at least, not that I'm aware of). And if all Pacquiao took in the past was an anti-inflammatory medicine, then why the need for such strict drug testing? Boxers still get tested right after a fight, don't they? And the other fighter wouldn't just give in because who is a boxer to just come along and change the rules? He's not part of any boxing commission. I mean, are players in any other sport allowed to change the rules of one particular competition without some kind of higher up approval? Uh, no. So why is boxing any different? It was a power play Manny wanted no part of until enough time went by that he had no choice but to take the fight.

People saying he should've just taken the test is the same as someone saying you should just take the first offer in a negotiation. That's not very smart. Oh yeah, so you get what you want, but in order to get it, you have to take this big dick in your ass in addition to it. Yeah, no thanks, hard pass. No pun intended.
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Old 11-22-2020, 03:25 PM #76
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Plus Floyd wasn't even approved for the IV until after the fight officially.
Correct. A fighter of his caliber does not allow himself to get dehydrated for the biggest fight of his career. It’s not like he loses all that much weight to get down to 147 as it is. Most experts said he could have rehydrated with a Gatorade. No need for IV unless he was masking something. There was already a cloud over his head regarding illegal injections for his hands, allegedly sealed by De La Hoya. If you look at his transformation you can see where all of the speculation comes from.
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Old 11-22-2020, 03:26 PM #77
travestyny travestyny is offline
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Okay, but Floyd was still trying to avoid having the fight happen sooner. Otherwise, why mention publicly letting the fight marinate unless he wanted negotiations to take longer? So I believe he came up with this drug testing excuse knowing it would be a major roadblock because it had not been done before in pro boxing (at least, not that I'm aware of). And if all Pacquiao took in the past was an anti-inflammatory medicine, then why the need for such strict drug testing? Boxers still get tested right after a fight, don't they? And the other fighter wouldn't just give in because who is a boxer to just come along and change the rules? He's not part of any boxing commission. I mean, are players in any other sport allowed to change the rules of one particular competition without some kind of higher up approval? Uh, no. So why is boxing any different? It was a power play Manny wanted no part of until enough time went by that he had no choice but to take the fight.

People saying he should've just taken the test is the same as someone saying you should just take the first offer in a negotiation. That's not very smart. Oh yeah, so you get what you want, but in order to get it, you have to take this big dick in your ass in addition to it. Yeah, no thanks, hard pass. No pun intended.
I don't think it was a roadblock to the fight at all. Pacquiao agreed to testing. There is a distinction that has to be made.

Asking for extra testing wasn't what derailed the fight. What derailed the fight was Pacquiao wanting a 30 day (and then 24 day) cut off for testing. Mayweather agreed to a 15 day cut off.

Do you think it's reasonable to need 15 days to recover from giving 2 tbsps of blood?

Mayweather was the only one who signed the initial contract. That doesn't sound like marinating the fight to me.






He also called out Pacquiao right before going to prison. Pacquiao refused. His team stated that the Mayweather fight would always be there, and that they prefer Marquez IV.

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Manny Pacquiao’s promoter said Monday that the Filipino superstar prefers a fourth fight against Juan Manuel Marquez to a super-fight against Floyd Mayweather Jr.

That fight [Mayweather] can still be there for us in November [2012],” Bob Arum told The Times.

That position brought a strong reaction from rival promoter and former fighter Oscar De La Hoya, who helps promote Mayweather and said the 42-0 welterweight champion has already reserved May 5 at the MGM Grand in Las Vegas for boxing’s dream fight.

“I say to Manny, fighter to fighter, ‘Step it up, tell Arum what you want,’ ” De La Hoya said. “You’re the fighter. You’re a congressman. You call the shots here and decide who you’re going to fight.”

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That's not consistent with Floyd marinating the fight. If anything, that's Pacquiao's team marinating the fight. Am I right?
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Old 11-22-2020, 03:30 PM #78
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Apparently the Nevada commission declined the toradol injection, but Pacquiao's camp still could've gotten cortisone. Don't know why he didn't then.
Cortisone shots may take days to weeks before pain subsides. It works on inflammation right away but the time it takes to reduce or eliminate pain varies. Cortisone is also a steroidal treatment, toradol is not.
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Old 11-22-2020, 03:32 PM #79
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Of course this thread got hijacked into a PED debate once again. Common denominators are at it again.
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Old 11-22-2020, 03:38 PM #80
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Correct. A fighter of his caliber does not allow himself to get dehydrated for the biggest fight of his career. It’s not like he loses all that much weight to get down to 147 as it is. Most experts said he could have rehydrated with a Gatorade. No need for IV unless he was masking something. There was already a cloud over his head regarding illegal injections for his hands, allegedly sealed by De La Hoya. If you look at his transformation you can see where all of the speculation comes from.
Mayweather was shown to be dehydrated at one point before the Mosley fight. But regardless of that, the dehydration need not have been tied to weight loss.

Both Bermane Stiverne and Junior Dos Santos had a condition that caused them to become dehydrated. Needless to say, Stiverne wasn't going through great weight loss, and Junior Dos Santos's weight was also steady. Again, you don't know what you're talking about.

What Mayweather described his symptoms to be sounds exactly like what these two fighters had, which was rhabdomyolysis, which affects high level athletes and has nothing to do with weight loss.


Oh, I forgot to add. Guess how Rhabdo is treated? That's right. By IV.

Last edited by travestyny; 11-22-2020 at 03:46 PM.
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