OFFICIAL: Donald Trump thread.

[Sugar Adam Ali]

Do you know how statistics are gathered in research like this? There are parameters. Any type of research like this, especially when it comes to school testing, does.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multilevel_model

If you can find another method of statistics, in particular with school testing, by all means post it.

Statistics are facts and numbers...

Numbers don't need "adjustments" unless your trying to fit an agenda..


Once again, what were the adjustments?

[ИATAS]

Ok, so you've confirmed the fact that private schools test scores are higher.

Every data set that has been "adjusted" must be thrown out, so we ignore everything about scores you wrote after the "adjusting".

We move on now knowing this....

Do you even know what adjustments are and the context in which they are used for? Explain it to me.

This is hilarious. Throwing out research because you don't understand how it works. You realize the exact same SEP data showed Private school students do better across the board than public school students which you just "confirmed" with me, right? So you're ok with that data but not the data from the same research that shows Christian conservative students do worse in science and mathematics than public school students? You just played yourself.

Personally, I don't even care about the SEP data since I only used it for what I mentioned above, which was such a minor part of my post.

Yes, I am asking you for sources.

Twice now. Can you please source this claim? I've not heard anyone call for 'public funding of private/Christian schools'. If DeVos (or Trump) has, then show me. Cite a source, and then quote the relevant part(s).

You realize you're asking me to source everything I've been explaining to you? You want me to go back, wuote myself and the sources I've already posted and you have the gull to say I'm slowing down the discussion? You still haven't even responded to the rest of my posts (in regards to DaVos). The entire point of Trump's education plan and "school choice" is using vouchers, tax payers money, to get students into religious schools, charter schools and private schools in general. That's the point we have been discussing.

In addition to the sources I already posted, here:
Betsy DeVos Wants to Use America's Schools to Build "God's Kingdom"

"There are not enough philanthropic dollars in America to fund what is currently the need in education...Our desire is to confront the culture in ways that will continue to advance God's kingdom." As we look at many communities in our country, the church has been displaced by the public school as the center for activity...[I]t is certainly our hope that more and more churches will get more and more active and engaged in education. giving parents the ability to pick any traditional public school or charter school in a district—to allow taxpayer money to follow students to any private school via vouchers.

"Trump's signature education proposal calls for dedicating $20 billion in federal money to help families move away from what he has called our "failing government schools" and instead choose charter, private, or religious schools."

"The DeVoses' foundation giving shows the couple's clearest preference is for Christian private schools. In a 2013 interview with Philanthropy magazine, Betsy DeVos said that while charters are "a very valid choice," they "take a while to start up and get operating. Meanwhile, there are very good non-public schools, hanging on by a shoestring, that can begin taking students today." From 1999 to 2014, the Dick and Betsy DeVos Family Foundation gave out $2.39 million to the Grand Rapids Christian High School Association, $652,000 to the Ada Christian School, and $458,000 to Holland Christian Schools. All told, their foundation contributed $8.6 million to private religious schools—a reflection of the DeVoses' lifelong dedication to building "God's kingdom" through education"

"Betsy and Dick DeVos have contributed hundreds of thousands of dollars to organizations seeking to privatize education and blur the separation of church and state."


Fox News
She has advocated for a controversial school voucher program in the past, which allocates federal taxpayer dollars to provide children the opportunity to attend private and religious institutions.

Business Insider
The cost to teach a public school student for one year, according to 2012 data, is approximately $10,615. An education voucher lets parents apply that money to a private or religious schools. As secretary of education, DeVos has promised to expand existing voucher programs in line with President-elect Trump's goal to provide more school choice.

NY Times
https://mobile.nytimes.com/2016/12/1...r-schools.html

You're slowing up the discussion by first entering "adjusted" data and now simply repeating claims instead of proving them when asked.

Wild claim there comrade, considering I'm still waiting for you to address numerous points and information from previous posts. This "adjusted" data you speak of, for one you don't even understand it apparently and second it was only a tiny portion of my post. Even if you think "adjusted" means something sinister or something false, which it doesn't, the context is so small it means very little. Again, that SEP study backed up my claim that a). private school students typically performan better than public school students and b). Christian conservative school students do worse than public school students. That's literally it.

Do you even remember anymore what the context of me saying that was? You said your only concern is getting test scores up (which obviously isn't true). And I went on explaining a number of things, offered some opinions, data/research and so on. You have not commented on any of it, simply asked for a source in regards to Christian conservative school students and that's it. And you talk about me holding up the conversation? How about go back and actually reply to my points rather than holding up the discussion because you don't understand "adjustment" in statistical models (did you go to a Christian conservative school by chance?).

Um, this is what we have now. The rich parents get choice, the poor ones do not.

This is what DeVos and the voucher proponents are trying to change.

As I stated, which you left out (again), is this shift has already been occurring under Obama and Bush. What Trump is doing is accelerating it. Cutting the budget in Education and public schools, increase spending for vouchers (charter schools, Christian schools). This is taking money out of the schools that need it most and using it for private schools.

Which brings me to the next point.....

You've now twice pointed out that poor public schools are worse off than rich public schools. I get that. I agree with that. Please, don't tell us that a 3rd time. It's actually a key point of mine in terms of supporting vouchers.

See, the kids who will benefit the most under a voucher plan are those stuck in the worst schools, ie the poor ones. Specifically, the poor minority kids. Yet the party who claims to represent the poor and the non-white is fighting tooth-and-nail to keep poor minority children in the worst public schools.

Tell me why you oppose this choice for the ones who most need it.

Thats a lot of wishful thinking since the research suggests otherwise so far. There are 25 voucher programs operating in 14 states and the District of Columbia — serving nearly 180,000 students, according to EdChoice, a school choice advocacy organization based in Indianapolis. "In just the last year or so, we've had a couple of studies with negative findings". -Michael Petrilli, president of the Thomas B. Fordham Institute. I posted two sources in previous posts already, ignored of course.

That isn't the only concern of course. "To many, DeVos' nomination is a troubling sign that the administration of Trump is prepared to dismantle public schools by taking money away from them and leaving them crippled, while benefiting private schools that don't have to follow the same rules public schools do. In Michigan, for instance, private schools aren't required to administer state exams, though some do. And they don't have to file financial audits with the state."

"Charter school advocates say their students outperform their demographic peers in traditional public schools. A Free Press review of 2016 academic data — based on the Michigan Student Test of Educational Progress — showed that when poverty is taken into account, there was no statistically significant difference when charter performance was compared with traditional public schools on the English language arts portion of the exam. Students in traditional schools performed better in math."

"MIXED RESULTS
In a study of research on vouchers — released in December 2015 by the National Bureau of Economic Research, a nonpartisan research organization based in Cambridge, Mass. — the authors concluded that the effects of vouchers "have been neither the rousing success imagined by proponents nor the abject failure predicted by opponents."
http://www.freep.com/story/news/educ...tion/96199598/

So we've seen research where it's been poor results and another with "mixed" results. Hardly the data that shows this going to help poor communities in large. Hardly the data that shows more charter schools Christian schools are the answer (how come you didn't comment on Finland and their success or other countries in the world that don't have private or charter schools?).

The rest of it is you again pointing out DeVos is rich, a private sector person, etc.

Great, we get it.

Really man? You said she's successful and rich, therefore it's better than having a lifer politician. I broke down, in detail, where her riches come from (family), what she's done in business (nothing), her life involved in politics (which shot down your claim she's not a politician and just a super successful busines woman) and her contributions to right wing religious groups and hate groups.

This is why it's difficult talking to you. You twist almost everything, dispute factual information, and either flat out forget what we were talking about or purposely change the subject. Here is a perfect example of that - you are making the claim that I simply point to her being rich and private sector when on reality I was disputing the claims YOU made. It's outrageous behavior on your part and frankly I thought Mich better of you to resort to these kinds of tactics. You won't even address 1/2 of my content in my posts, simply ignore it.

Now tell me why someone of a different background than the status quo is a bad choice when the status quo is failing. You're ignoring that point and just bashing DeVos.

You're doing the exact same thing here again. You're accusing me of thinking that "someone of a different background than the status quo is a bad." Really? After all my posts you have the nerve to say I only dislike her because she has a different background of the status quo? Amazing.

You already did this before too, recently, just worded differently. In this post:
https://www.boxingscene.com/forums/s...postcount=3027

You said, "Why are you so opposed to putting people with records of success in positions where we need solutions?"

It's a real cute way of trying to spin something. I provide details and explanations, and you respond with a line like that (why do you hate success, bro?). Like imagine, you disagree with me on something and I could say, "why do you oppose intelligence? Why are you so afraid of smart people?" Pretty lame right? Well that's what you're doing.

And I responded to it anyway. Which of course you didn't reply to. But you should now that I'm calling you out on it.

You said, "She's had a lifetime of success. And success outside of being a lifer politician." And I provided a lot of information that you simply ignored. Here it is;

Success in what? Being born rich and marrying into an even richer family? (DeVos family is listed by Forbes as one of the richest families in America, with an estimated net worth of $5.4 billion) source

Funnelling millions of dollars into anti Gay and anti-LGBT causes? DeVos, from 2001 to 2013, was vice president of the Edgar and Elsa Prince Foundation, a "nonprofit group" founded by her mother that has been a generous donor to controversial and hate groups like Focus on the Family and Family Research Council.

A Portrait of Christian Hate: Prop 8's Elsa Prince of Michigan
http://m.dailykos.com/story/2008/12/1/667005/-
It's Executive Committee has included Oliver North, Gary Bauer, Pat Robertson, Richard DeVos, Tim LaHaye, and Richard Shoff, a former Ku Klux Klan leader in Indiana.

Follow the money:
https://mediamousearchive.wordpress....ce-foundation/

Refreshing though isn't it? Not a career politician just a plain old rich person which is so much better! Plus she's been involved in politics for years. She was chairwoman of the Michigan Republican Party throughout the 90s onto the 2000s and prior to that, "Since 1982, DeVos has participated in the Michigan Republican Party. She served as a local precinct delegate for the Michigan Republican Party, having been elected for 16 consecutive two-year terms since 1986.[38] She was a Republican National Committeewoman for Michigan between 1992 and 1997,[39] and served as chairwoman of the Michigan Republican Party from 1996 to 2000.[40][41]
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Betsy_DeVos

She's not a politician though.

I really want to keep having a discussion because I believe there's been a lot of good information provided in this thread that people get to soak up. What I don't want to do is engage in games and tactics that you've been doing. I came in here with the intention of learning why and how any intelligent people can still support Trump, given his first 100 days and already turning his back on things he said (hey there NAFTA!). Early on I accused you of blind support when it comes to DeVos but I told you to prove me wrong and all you've done is further support the original claim. It boils down to "faith" you have in Trump, not anything based on substance and reason and that's been proven with DaVos in that you support her because she's "rich and successful" and "has a different background". Those aren't legit reasons for anything.

[ИATAS]

Statistics are facts and numbers...

Numbers don't need "adjustments" unless your trying to fit an agenda..

Which is why you're probably not very advanced in mathematics. Ever take a class dealing with Mathematical statistics? A very broad term in various ways to collect, summarize, and draw conclusions from data. You don't simply take raw numbers and present them as accurate, there are many variations depending on what kind of data it is, some of it may be invalid, incorrect or misleading, etc. Some needs to be thrown out if it's not valid, adjustments are made accordingly etc.

Once again, what were the adjustments?

You could have simply clicked the link. It's not that hard to read. Takes less effort than being confused and relying on someone else to explain something to you. But fine, I'll hold your hand. Have fun.

The SEP research Comparing Private Schools, Christian schools and Public Schools uses the Hierarchical Linear Model.

What is the Hierarchical Linear Model? It is particularly useful in educational research.

Hierarchical Linear Modeling is a statistical model of parameters that vary at more than one level. An example could be a model of student performance that contains measures for individual students as well as measures for classrooms within which the students are grouped. These models can be seen as generalizations of linear models (in particular, linear regression), although they can also extend to non-linear models. These models became much more popular after sufficient computing power and software became available.

The Hierarchical Linear Model is particularly appropriate for research designs where data for participants are organized at more than one level (i.e., nested data). The units of analysis are usually individuals (at a lower level) who are nested within contextual/aggregate units (at a higher level). While the lowest level of data in multilevel models is usually an individual, repeated measurements of individuals may also be examined. As such, multilevel models provide an alternative type of analysis for univariate or multivariate analysis of repeated measures. Individual differences in growth curves may be examined (see growth model). Furthermore, multilevel models can be used as an alternative to ANCOVA, where scores on the dependent variable are adjusted for covariates (i.e., individual differences) before testing treatment differences. Multilevel models are able to analyze these experiments without the assumptions of ****geneity-of-regression slopes that is required by ANCOVA.

Multilevel models can be used on data with many levels, although 2-level models are the most common and the rest of this article deals only with these. The dependent variable must be examined at the lowest level of analysis.

Before conducting a multilevel model analysis, a researcher must decide on several aspects, including which predictors are to be included in the analysis, if any. Second, the researcher must decide whether parameter values (i.e., the elements that will be estimated) will be fixed or random. Fixed parameters are composed of a constant over all the groups, whereas a random parameter has a different value for each of the groups. Additionally, the researcher must decide whether to employ a maximum likelihood estimation or a restricted maximum likelihood estimation type.

To conduct research with sufficient power, large sample sizes are required in multilevel models. However, the number of individual observations in groups is not as important as the number of groups in a study. In order to detect cross-level interactions, given that the group sizes are not too small, recommendations have been made that at least 20 groups are needed.

A simple linear regression model might, for example, predict that a given randomly sampled person in Seattle would have an average yearly income $10,000 higher than a similar person in Mobile, Alabama. However, it would also predict, for example, that a white person might have an average income $7,000 above a black person, and a 65-year-old might have an income $3,000 below a 45-year-old, in both cases regardless of location. A multilevel model, however, would allow for different regression coefficients for each predictor in each location. Essentially, it would assume that people in a given location have correlated incomes generated by a single set of regression coefficients, whereas people in another location have incomes generated by a different set of coefficients. Meanwhile, the coefficients themselves are assumed to be correlated and generated from a single set of hyperparameters. Additional levels are possible: For example, people might be grouped by cities, and the city-level regression coefficients grouped by state, and the state-level coefficients generated from a single hyper-hyperparameter.

In other words, with all of the data available, adjustments are made appropriately in order to present accurate data.

For the SEP, there are many variables, detailed on their site (which is why I recommend you go there) but example nonresponse adjustments:

A set of units (e.g., schools or students) that are grouped together for the purpose of calculating nonresponse adjustments. The units are ****geneous with respect to certain unit characteristics, such as school size, location, public/private, student's age, sex, and student disability status.

I'm sure you're quite interested in the math behind it:

[Img][/img]



Both the numerator and denominator of the nonresponse adjustment factor contained only schools that were determined to have eligible students enrolled.

In the calculation of the above nonresponse adjustment factors, a school was said to have participated if:

-it was selected for the sample from the frame or from the lists of new schools provided by participating school districts, and student assessment data were obtained from the school; or

-the school participated as a substitute school and student assessment data were obtained (so that the substitute participated in place of the originally selected school).

The nonresponse-adjusted weight for the ith school in class h was computed as

Fh(1) is the school-level nonresponse adjustment factor for the ith school in the hthclass, and

Whitsch is the trimmed school base weight of the ith school in class h


Poststratification is a weighting procedure that adjusts the weights of respondents so that the weighted sample distribution is the same as the known population distribution. The sums of the poststratified-adjusted weights of the respondents are equal to known population totals for certain subgroups of the population. The main purposes of poststratification are to improve precision of survey estimates by reducing their mean square error and to enhance the comparability of survey data with other surveys, particularly when comparing estimates from the same survey over time.

The poststratification adjustment procedure involves applying a ratio adjustment to the student reporting weights. Assessed and excluded students are partitioned into poststratification cells, and a single ratio adjustment factor is calculated and applied to the reporting weight of all students in a given cell. The numerator of the poststratification factor is an independent estimate of the number of students in the given cell, and the denominator is the corresponding estimate derived using the student reporting weights. The numerator is derived from 1997 and 1998 Current Population Survey (CPS) data and 1999 population projections made by the U.S. Census Bureau.

The poststratification procedure is carried out separately by grade, subject, and reporting population. Poststratification adjustment cells are defined in terms of race/ethnicity, modal age status, and Census region for all grades except grade 12. Modal age status is not used for grade 12 because it is not possible to derive reliable modal age status counts from the CPS data. CPS counts all adult education students, regardless of age, as grade 12 students. Instead, grade 12 uses poststratification cells defined by students less than or equal to modal age (i.e., seventeen years of age or younger).

The poststratification factor for student i in a given poststratification adjustment class h is given by


The adjustment factor and the components of its formula do not include a subscript s to reflect the fact that not every student in a school s falls into the same student nonresponse cell.

Nonresponse adjustment procedures are not applied to excluded students, because they are not required to complete an assessment. In effect, excluded students were placed in a separate nonresponse cell by themselves, considered respondents, and all received an adjustment factor of 1. While excluded students are not included in the analysis of the NAEP scores, weights are provided for excluded students so as to estimate the size of this group and its population characteristics.

[Sugar Adam Ali]

Which is why you're probably not very advanced in mathematics. Ever take a class dealing with Mathematical statistics? A very broad term in various ways to collect, summarize, and draw conclusions from data. You don't simply take raw numbers and present them as accurate, there are many variations depending on what kind of data it is, some of it may be invalid, incorrect or misleading, etc. Some needs to be thrown out if it's not valid, adjustments are made accordingly etc.



You could have simply clicked the link. It's not that hard to read. Takes less effort than being confused and relying on someone else to explain something to you. But fine, I'll hold your hand.

The SEP research Comparing Private Schools, Christian schools and Public Schools uses the Hierarchical Linear Model.

What is the Hierarchical Linear Model? It is particularly useful in educational research.
Hierarchical Linear Modeling is a statistical model of parameters that vary at more than one level. An example could be a model of student performance that contains measures for individual students as well as measures for classrooms within which the students are grouped. These models can be seen as generalizations of linear models (in particular, linear regression), although they can also extend to non-linear models. These models became much more popular after sufficient computing power and software became available.

The Hierarchical Linear Model is particularly appropriate for research designs where data for participants are organized at more than one level (i.e., nested data). The units of analysis are usually individuals (at a lower level) who are nested within contextual/aggregate units (at a higher level). While the lowest level of data in multilevel models is usually an individual, repeated measurements of individuals may also be examined. As such, multilevel models provide an alternative type of analysis for univariate or multivariate analysis of repeated measures. Individual differences in growth curves may be examined (see growth model). Furthermore, multilevel models can be used as an alternative to ANCOVA, where scores on the dependent variable are adjusted for covariates (i.e., individual differences) before testing treatment differences. Multilevel models are able to analyze these experiments without the assumptions of ****geneity-of-regression slopes that is required by ANCOVA.

Multilevel models can be used on data with many levels, although 2-level models are the most common and the rest of this article deals only with these. The dependent variable must be examined at the lowest level of analysis.

Before conducting a multilevel model analysis, a researcher must decide on several aspects, including which predictors are to be included in the analysis, if any. Second, the researcher must decide whether parameter values (i.e., the elements that will be estimated) will be fixed or random. Fixed parameters are composed of a constant over all the groups, whereas a random parameter has a different value for each of the groups. Additionally, the researcher must decide whether to employ a maximum likelihood estimation or a restricted maximum likelihood estimation type.

To conduct research with sufficient power, large sample sizes are required in multilevel models. However, the number of individual observations in groups is not as important as the number of groups in a study. In order to detect cross-level interactions, given that the group sizes are not too small, recommendations have been made that at least 20 groups are needed.

A simple linear regression model might, for example, predict that a given randomly sampled person in Seattle would have an average yearly income $10,000 higher than a similar person in Mobile, Alabama. However, it would also predict, for example, that a white person might have an average income $7,000 above a black person, and a 65-year-old might have an income $3,000 below a 45-year-old, in both cases regardless of location. A multilevel model, however, would allow for different regression coefficients for each predictor in each location. Essentially, it would assume that people in a given location have correlated incomes generated by a single set of regression coefficients, whereas people in another location have incomes generated by a different set of coefficients. Meanwhile, the coefficients themselves are assumed to be correlated and generated from a single set of hyperparameters. Additional levels are possible: For example, people might be grouped by cities, and the city-level regression coefficients grouped by state, and the state-level coefficients generated from a single hyper-hyperparameter.

In other words, with all of the data available, adjustments are made appropriately in order to present accurate data.

For the SEP, there are many variables, detailed on their site (which is why I recommend you go there) but example nonresponse adjustments:
A set of units (e.g., schools or students) that are grouped together for the purpose of calculating nonresponse adjustments. The units are ****geneous with respect to certain unit characteristics, such as school size, location, public/private, student's age, sex, and student disability status.

I'm sure you're quite interested in the math behind it:

[Img][/img]



Both the numerator and denominator of the nonresponse adjustment factor contained only schools that were determined to have eligible students enrolled.

In the calculation of the above nonresponse adjustment factors, a school was said to have participated if:

-it was selected for the sample from the frame or from the lists of new schools provided by participating school districts, and student assessment data were obtained from the school; or

-the school participated as a substitute school and student assessment data were obtained (so that the substitute participated in place of the originally selected school).

The nonresponse-adjusted weight for the ith school in class h was computed as

Fh(1) is the school-level nonresponse adjustment factor for the ith school in the hthclass, and

Whitsch is the trimmed school base weight of the ith school in class h


Poststratification is a weighting procedure that adjusts the weights of respondents so that the weighted sample distribution is the same as the known population distribution. The sums of the poststratified-adjusted weights of the respondents are equal to known population totals for certain subgroups of the population. The main purposes of poststratification are to improve precision of survey estimates by reducing their mean square error and to enhance the comparability of survey data with other surveys, particularly when comparing estimates from the same survey over time.

The poststratification adjustment procedure involves applying a ratio adjustment to the student reporting weights. Assessed and excluded students are partitioned into poststratification cells, and a single ratio adjustment factor is calculated and applied to the reporting weight of all students in a given cell. The numerator of the poststratification factor is an independent estimate of the number of students in the given cell, and the denominator is the corresponding estimate derived using the student reporting weights. The numerator is derived from 1997 and 1998 Current Population Survey (CPS) data and 1999 population projections made by the U.S. Census Bureau.

The poststratification procedure is carried out separately by grade, subject, and reporting population. Poststratification adjustment cells are defined in terms of race/ethnicity, modal age status, and Census region for all grades except grade 12. Modal age status is not used for grade 12 because it is not possible to derive reliable modal age status counts from the CPS data. CPS counts all adult education students, regardless of age, as grade 12 students. Instead, grade 12 uses poststratification cells defined by students less than or equal to modal age (i.e., seventeen years of age or younger).

The poststratification factor for student i in a given poststratification adjustment class h is given by


The adjustment factor and the components of its formula do not include a subscript s to reflect the fact that not every student in a school s falls into the same student nonresponse cell.

Nonresponse adjustment procedures are not applied to excluded students, because they are not required to complete an assessment. In effect, excluded students were placed in a separate nonresponse cell by themselves, considered respondents, and all received an adjustment factor of 1. While excluded students are not included in the analysis of the NAEP scores, weights are provided for excluded students so as to estimate the size of this group and its population characteristics.

Lmao...

Why are you copy n pasting wiki pages...

I'm asking about the precise stats you posted.. not some generalized definition...


How were the stats you provided adjusted.... in your own words, specific to the data you presented... not a generalized wiki definition

[Left Hook Tua]

What are you referring to? The NEP data? If so, I take it you didn't actually click the link to the NEP site did you?

I used the NEP for one very specific thing - that conservative Christian schools do worse at mathematics and science than Public schools. That's it. Not sure why anyone would even question that, seems common knowledge.

Fewer asian students

[AddiX]

Lmao trump today said that he was a, "nationalist and a globalist".

Fcking moron, only thing dumber than him is the cuck puppets who follow and defend this idiot.

[$tate of Mind]

So at essentially 100 days in how's the wall and healthcare reform coming along? What exactly has Dump accomplished other than making himself and his administration a complete and utter embarrassment?

[ИATAS]

Lmao...

Why are you copy n pasting wiki pages...

I told you man! It's not fun stuff to read.

The wiki link is so you can have a basic idea of the Hierarchical Linear Model, since that's what the SEP uses. Without that understanding the term "adjustments" is meaningless.

Basically the adjustments in the SEP research is normal and necessary in order to have accurate statistics. It won't be honest without it.

I'm asking about the precise stats you posted.. not some generalized definition...


How were the stats you provided adjusted.... in your own words, specific to the data you presented... not a generalized wiki definition

The second part is straight from the SEPs website. I can't simply put it in my own words because there's tons of data. The second half of my post is just on "nonresponse adjustments" alone. If you want the raw data it's included in that link too, but here is a direct like to the PDF file.

I don't know why you thought "adjustments" was some negative thing, like its a way to skew the data. You can see in the PDF file the list of people involved in the research, non-biased academic 3rd party researchers and then on top of that a separate group (NAGB) reviews and must approve the SEPs findings. The research is legit and so is the mathematics involved.

Regardless, it seems like an insignificant thing to break my balls over given the context (Private school students in general did better than public school students in testing and public school students did better than Christian conservative school students in math and science). Again, all that has been considered common knowledge.

There is actually other research I've read that painted private school testing, among other things, in a negative light, but I chose not to post it here since I had no way of knowing how legit it was since no real in-depth data regarding the research was available as far as I could tell. If I wanted to be deceitful I could easily post stuff like that but I have no reason to be deceitful. I've been honest and I've been as accurate as I can. Besides healthcare, education is one of the most important topics for me and I'm tired of watching the privatization of public education by the Adminstrations of Bush, Obama and now Trump is accelerating it at an even faster rate.

[Sugar Adam Ali]

I told you man! It's not fun stuff to read.

The wiki link is so you can have a basic idea of the Hierarchical Linear Model, since that's what the SEP uses. Without that understanding the term "adjustments" is meaningless.

Basically the adjustments in the SEP research is normal and necessary in order to have accurate statistics. It won't be honest without it.




The second part is straight from the SEPs website. I can't simply put it in my own words because there's tons of data. The second half of my post is just on "nonresponse adjustments" alone. If you want the raw data it's included in that link too, but here is a direct like to the PDF file.

I don't know why you thought "adjustments" was some negative thing, like its a way to skew the data. You can see in the PDF file the list of people involved in the research, non-biased academic 3rd party researchers and then on top of that a separate group (NAGB) reviews and must approve the SEPs findings. The research is legit and so is the mathematics involved.

Regardless, it seems like an insignificant thing to break my balls over given the context (Private school students in general did better than public school students in testing and public school students did better than Christian conservative school students in math and science). Again, all that has been considered common knowledge.

There is actually other research I've read that painted private school testing, among other things, in a negative light, but I chose not to post it here since I had no way of knowing how legit it was since no real in-depth data regarding the research was available as far as I could tell. If I wanted to be deceitful I could easily post stuff like that but I have no reason to be deceitful. I've been honest and I've been as accurate as I can. Besides healthcare, education is one of the most important topics for me and I'm tired of watching the privatization of public education by the Adminstrations of Bush, Obama and now Trump is accelerating it at an even faster rate.

Okay, honestly this is way too mundane to debate about. It's NFL draft night so I'm a little ****ed up, especially after my beloved bears made stupid moves...


I agree education should be one of the most important things in society... but public schools are a complete disaster..

I know you hate privatization of schools, but it makes schools incredibly effective and efficient... schools have to perform or people will stop paying, unlike public schools which have unlimited access to taxpayers money and they get paid no matter if they suck or not. Private schools don't have that option, they can't force money from people, like government does for public schools.

No accountability in public schools, too much greed as their pensions are always the reason schools are broke, not lack of funding, it's wasting funds on non-student related spending that is dragging down schools...

I do agree that education and healthcare should be priorities in society, but we must not let big centralized government dictate everything

[ИATAS]

Lmao trump today said that he was a, "nationalist and a globalist".

Fcking moron, only thing dumber than him is the cuck puppets who follow and defend this idiot.

How are his supporters defending his flip flopping on NAFTA? He was to announce Saturday, on the 100th day of his presidency, that he was withdrawing from NAFTA. The same NAFTA during his campaign he called “a total disaster” and “one of the worst deals ever.”

Trump said, “I was all set to terminate,” Trump said in an Oval Office interview Thursday night. “I looked forward to terminating. I was going to do it.” He supposedly gets calls from Mexico and Canada urging him not to and that's it? That's all it took? Amazing.

You know, that was probably the one thing I really wanted Trump to do. I've been opposed of NAFTA since it was implemented by Clinton and I believe it's had terrible consequences. One reason I thought Trump would actually do it is because of his hard stance on immigration- before Clinton implemented NAFTA, there were only about 3 million illegal Mexicans in America. Illegal immigration then EXPLODED as a result of NAFTA and how much it hurt farming in Mexico, among other things, so many of them could no longer make a living and were forced to come here for work and a way to support themselves.

It's just another thing in an increasingly long list of things Trump is going back on.

How about Trump declaring NATO “no longer obsolete,” after months of saying it was?

Then of course Syria.

MAGA though! Its all good. Trickle down economics will eventually kick in, right guys?!