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Old 06-05-2019, 10:36 AM #51
uppercut510 uppercut510 is offline
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Originally Posted by THEFRESHBRAWLER View Post
The fight was just announced a few hours ago. Can you point me to the post where people are calling Charlo-Cota a good fight like GGG Stanís were saying about GGG-Vanes?
thisssssssss!!!!!!!!
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Old 06-05-2019, 11:17 AM #52
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Originally Posted by Boxing1013 View Post
I just disagree about Vanes - again any time he stepped up against top competition he basically fought to a draw, and he did so many times - Andrade, Charlo, Lara (2) etc. If he was stopped badly his last few fights I would agree it was a really bad pick. In the moment I don't think it was that bad at all. Certainly better than Spike O'Sullivan etc.

I think a lot of the hate on Vanes now is driven from the fact that many do not like GGG and are looking for any reason possible to give him some sh.it. People do the same thing to Wilder on here sometimes - saying Ortiz is now 50 years old etc, when going in many thought Wilder would lose. From a neutral perspective those are my 2 cents there.

Again worth pointing out Vanes did win the first round against GGG on many cards, and as someone who remembers watching him in his first fight vs Lara, he looked the same as he has always looked to me. If he came in fat and gassed late, or looked shot I would give my opinion that he looked bad, but I didn't see that.

As I said before, a guy coming up from 154 and 2 years inactive was certainly not an ideal opponent for GGG so in that way it wasn't a great matchup. And you say coming off a loss - I say he fought he really close fight with Lara (who I love) and most people on here would have loved to see Lara fight GGG. If Vanes was completely destroyed by Lara in that fight it would have been a completely sh.it fight with GGG, but overall going in it wasn't that bad, not on short notice.

I do agree that anyone willing to take the fight on a month's notice will in general be a guy who is a lighter touch - most guys who really feel they can win will probably want a full camp and/or to negotiate a good split money wise.

For Vanes' case he was inactive so he jumped at the opportunity to get a shot like that, even if it was above his pay-grade. I don't think he was shot though and I think people have always rated him as a top fighter. The moving up in weight and style matchup with GGG was not in his favor imo, but otherwise he looked fine. He just fights too aggressive against someone like GGG who will KO you if you can't back him up, or if you aren't trying to move a lot around the ring.

Thanks for your thoughts though man, good post.
No dude the hate was because Vanes was a sh-t opponent at 160 for GGG. Your unwillingness to admit that is 95% of the problem. The other 5% is the attempted justification of him as a viable opponent.

It was a bad choice regardless of the context and circumstances. We understand why the choice was made-to ensure a win so the Canelo rematch wasn't hurt-but that mitigates the choice only a bit.

In the end a guy who was a top 2 MW in the world chose an opponent coming off a 2 year layoff whose last fight was a loss at 154. Unacceptable.

Notice how Cota is also coming off a loss and no one is trying to make him seem anything but a bum.
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Old 06-05-2019, 12:26 PM #53
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No dude the hate was because Vanes was a sh-t opponent at 160 for GGG. Your unwillingness to admit that is 95% of the problem. The other 5% is the attempted justification of him as a viable opponent.

It was a bad choice regardless of the context and circumstances. We understand why the choice was made-to ensure a win so the Canelo rematch wasn't hurt-but that mitigates the choice only a bit.

In the end a guy who was a top 2 MW in the world chose an opponent coming off a 2 year layoff whose last fight was a loss at 154. Unacceptable.

Notice how Cota is also coming off a loss and no one is trying to make him seem anything but a bum.
Again I think you're going way overboard on the dismissing of Vanes. He was always levels above Cota. No one ever embarrassed him in the ring, and he was in there with multiple guys of a similar level to GGG.

With all due respect, I have said many times that it was not an ideal fight for GGG, but on short notice it wasn't that bad.

I have admitted the areas where Vanes was not an ideal opponent (weight, 2 year inactivity) and you seem intent on refusing to point out his good attributes (always fought well at the top level, no one ever KOd or completely outclassed him in the ring).

I just try to call it like I see it man - Vanes was never a bad fighter and was always a top guy at 154. Moving up in weight on short notice after 2 years inactive was not ideal at all, but he looked fine in the ring to me, and many people gave him round 1 vs GGG, indicating he looked fine.

GGG stopped him impressively in round 2. Good win for GGG considering the style in which he won - compare to say how Charlo looked against a similar fighter in Korobov for example.

My overall point is/was that anyone coming in on short notice will be seen as 'unacceptable' to some people. For me, when a guy has to take on a short notice replacement I don't really blame the guy whose opponent pissed dirty or got injured. Take the stay busy fight and then fight again quickly against a big name. GGG did that and I assume Charlo will as well.
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Old 06-05-2019, 12:29 PM #54
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Originally Posted by uppercut510 View Post
thisssssssss!!!!!!!!
Can you find a post where any GGG fan was saying Vanes-GGG was a great fight? Seemed at best they were saying it was a good replacement on short notice.

I can definitely point out posts though where fans were giving GGG grief for this fight, while none seem to be having the same energy for Charlo. No one seems to be saying that Charlo should postpone the original date to fight Hurd, Lara etc...
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Old 06-05-2019, 01:03 PM #55
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Originally Posted by Boxing1013 View Post
Can you find a post where any GGG fan was saying Vanes-GGG was a great fight? Seemed at best they were saying it was a good replacement on short notice.

I can definitely point out posts though where fans were giving GGG grief for this fight, while none seem to be having the same energy for Charlo. No one seems to be saying that Charlo should postpone the original date to fight Hurd, Lara etc...
there were some fans who tried to justify it by saying vanes knocked down Andrade, they were saying how tough he was... a lot were condemning it as well... I'm not that into the back n forth to go find the post but they exist... you may have had some extreme geeGG haters who kept complaining about it but what can him and charlo do but fight the replacement? only so much complaining we can do... I get the fanbase back n forths, they are fun but after a while it gets to be annoying.
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Old 06-05-2019, 01:52 PM #56
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there were some fans who tried to justify it by saying vanes knocked down Andrade, they were saying how tough he was... a lot were condemning it as well... I'm not that into the back n forth to go find the post but they exist... you may have had some extreme geeGG haters who kept complaining about it but what can him and charlo do but fight the replacement? only so much complaining we can do... I get the fanbase back n forths, they are fun but after a while it gets to be annoying.
I hear ya man, completely agree for the most part. We are all going to have our favorites as far as who we root for, but I wish most on here kept it a little more real with the analysis of fights/fighters. I think it would be a much better community on here if that were the case. That goes for basically every group not just one.

Would love to just get on here and purely talk boxing but unfortunately that doesn't always happen. Good post man.
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