April 9, 1988 Evander Holyfield becomes undisputed CW Champion

[Anthony342]

You know which one, BROTHER!

Okay, so the wrestler. Speaking of Superstar Billy Graham and wrestling, how good a boxer was Ernie Ladd? I only heard Ladd was a football player and pro wrestler. Did you know Graham was originally scheduled to be on Hogan's team in the first Survivor Series PPV, but his career ending knee injury forced them to do an angle where they had Greg "The Hammer" Valentine use his figure four leglock finisher to end Graham's career, so the original Rock in wrestling, Don Muraco, formerly The Magnificent Muraco could replace him in Survivor Series 1987? Well, you do now.

And on Bruce Prichard's wrestling podcast, he's told some pretty good stories about Ladd when he retired and worked behind the scenes with Vince McMahon saying things like "King Kong Bundy, you're so terrible, you should be picking up your paycheck with a gun and ski mask". I saw an older Ladd in one of those Bunkhouse Brawl battle royals in the Nassau Coliseum here in Long Island or ON Long Island, like some people like to say around here and the old guy was still in pretty good shape. Since battle royals have no DQs, the guys brought weapons, but it was still the pre Extreme ECW era. I guess not a boxing hall of famer, but he IS in the WWE Hall of Fame.

And to bring it back to boxing, Mike Tyson was originally supposed to get involved in the WWF years before he did, but that was nixed when he got knocked out by Buster Douglas, so Douglas was brought in for that PPV instead. Tyson was eventually brought in years later for Wrestlemania 14, where they had him siding with Shawn Michaels and his heel faction Degeneration X, who were just inducted into this year's WWE Hall of Fame. The big twist or "swerve", as they call it in the wrestling business, was that Tyson later turned on Michaels and knocked him down after Stone Cold Steve Austin beat him for the title. Or it might have been during the match, haven't seen that one in a while.

Holyfield was later brought in on an episode of Saturday Night's Main Event when that brought that back for a few episodes. I don't know why anyone thought a legit boxing match was a good idea when years ago WWE back when they were still WWF did a tournament called Brawl for All, anyone ever watch this? Vince McMahon or maybe Vince Russo, I don't know who, somehow thought it was a good idea for guys used to scripted matches to take part in legit boxing matches. Or boxing/MMA matches, I don't know because even though they mostly boxed, they seemed to allow takedowns. I guess they wanted to compete with the UFC at the time and maybe boxing. And what did the winner get, in addition to a check? A 4 round fight with Butterbean, which amounted to getting knocked out cold at that year's Wrestlemania. Yeah, let's have a pro wrestler with some amateur experience get in the ring with a much larger guy with huge punching power and years or pro and toughman experience. That couldn't possibly end badly. So Bart Gunn then gets fired, even though it wasn't really his fault. It's like blaming a poodle for losing to a pit bull.

[QueensburyRules]

- -Gorilla Monsoon and Andre had an epic boxing match.

Seem to maybe recall in Puerto Rico as the most available of the US territories that would sanction it.

[billeau2]

There is a little more to the B@st@rd Maker than that. Yes he fought very close to the line, with bad head butting, elbows, ect, and yes he grew a bit lol. But Holly also had excellent chin, excellent combo punching, and could really outhustle a lot of guys, so to speak.

I believe that lists can change but with that said there are times when I could see Holly on a relative short list of greats at heavy. I actually think that unlike Tunney for example, whom, as good as he was, was even better at light heavy/cruiser... Holly was a better heavyweight than Cruiser. Really crafty guys could always be a problem for the B@stard Maker... Moore (chronically underrated) and Toney both showed that quality.... But Holly on smash, at his best was a handful!

[Anthony342]

- -Gorilla Monsoon and Andre had an epic boxing match.

Seem to maybe recall in Puerto Rico as the most available of the US territories that would sanction it.

Yeah and if that match were real or what they call a "shoot" in the wrestling business, Monsoon would've been dead with the shots he took and how Andre threw him around. Even more entertaining was the scripted match Roddy Piper and Mr. T had at Wrestlemania 2. The Butterbean knockout of Bart Gunn was real though. Man, that was brutal. Vince McMahon was sending a lamb to the slaughter that night. The Holyfield-Hardy match they probably made look real. I doubt Evander was going all out, but Matt probably still felt those shots, so Holy probably was still "working stiff" somewhat that night or "potatoing" some of those punches in there. Good thing they were wearing gloves.

[Rusty Tromboni]

So, the latter?

Some where down in Guatanamo terrorists are being forced to listen to a 24-hour loop of a Dane Cook-Dave Chappelle mash-up.

So I guess... all things considered, we should consider ourselves lucky... and thank you?

[Rusty Tromboni]

There is a little more to the B@st@rd Maker than that. Yes he fought very close to the line, with bad head butting, elbows, ect, and yes he grew a bit lol. But Holly also had excellent chin, excellent combo punching, and could really outhustle a lot of guys, so to speak.

I believe that lists can change but with that said there are times when I could see Holly on a relative short list of greats at heavy. I actually think that unlike Tunney for example, whom, as good as he was, was even better at light heavy/cruiser... Holly was a better heavyweight than Cruiser. Really crafty guys could always be a problem for the B@stard Maker... Moore (chronically underrated) and Toney both showed that quality.... But Holly on smash, at his best was a handful!

Holyfield was a very good fighter. Sound fundamentals, great stamina and chin. He had a real killer-instinct. He was a lot like a much bigger Ray Leonard w/o the special features and Ring IQ. The Cadillac Escalde Base Model compared to a classic Coupe DeVille customized.
He lacked the real tools to be great, though: no Joe Frazier left hook, nor Ali's speed of hand and foot; not even Fury's defensive ability. I think he penchant for mixing it up was to compensate for that. He knew he'd win w/the fans even if he didn't win the fight.

At least that's how it started. As time progressed, he really built himself into a giant killer. He got smarter and less wreckless.

In my mind there's 3 iterations of Holyfield: the CW, the Hw chasing glory, and the crafty veteran. Each has his case for being the defining point of the Holyfield legacy.

I do think that if Holyfield came of age today, though, we'd appreciate him much more as a technician and tactician, even if we'd miss out on the epic battles. He'd need to stay a Cw much longer - whether he wanted to, or not.

[QueensburyRules]

- -If crafty is a frontal lobotomy, than you and Field are crafty to be sure.

[billeau2]

Holyfield was a very good fighter. Sound fundamentals, great stamina and chin. He had a real killer-instinct. He was a lot like a much bigger Ray Leonard w/o the special features and Ring IQ. The Cadillac Escalde Base Model compared to a classic Coupe DeVille customized.
He lacked the real tools to be great, though: no Joe Frazier left hook, nor Ali's speed of hand and foot; not even Fury's defensive ability. I think he penchant for mixing it up was to compensate for that. He knew he'd win w/the fans even if he didn't win the fight.

At least that's how it started. As time progressed, he really built himself into a giant killer. He got smarter and less wreckless.

In my mind there's 3 iterations of Holyfield: the CW, the Hw chasing glory, and the crafty veteran. Each has his case for being the defining point of the Holyfield legacy.

I do think that if Holyfield came of age today, though, we'd appreciate him much more as a technician and tactician, even if we'd miss out on the epic battles. He'd need to stay a Cw much longer - whether he wanted to, or not.

Thats very well said. I agree. One interesting thing about Holy that always made him somewhat unique to me: while he was stubborn at times, seemed to like to get into it with guys like Bowe who could hurt ya...Yet during some of his biggest fights he became very "coachable." He was at his best when he listened to his corner. One time being when he defeated Bowe by boxing, the other was when he was taught by Turner to get Tyson on his heels instead of to back off like most people did when they felt a Tyson punch.

He did indeed have different manifestations and never quite had that "SuzyQ" lol. Definitely made the most of his talents.

[billeau2]

- -If crafty is a frontal lobotomy, than you and Field are crafty to be sure.

No no thats the procedure they did for you before they gave you that special jacket that buttons in back Queenie...Remember now? If not try putting your finger back in the socket and it will all come back to you in a flash.

[QueensburyRules]

- -Field was 18-10-2 after Big George turned him into a hanging basket.

Miserable KO% too. Hey, nobody fought tougher comp, but it is what it is.