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Old 10-17-2017, 10:45 AM #11
Floyd's Mask Floyd's Mask is offline
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basically, the TS is a huge fan of Deontay Wilder!

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Old 10-17-2017, 10:51 AM #12
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Originally Posted by Ganstaz003 View Post
...


So the question is, does someone like Golovkin (a knockout artist) really have more punching power than someone like Andre Ward, or is it his offensive skills that are simply superior?
I wouldn't compare Golovkin to Ward -- because the huge difference in "styles"...

... But what about comparing GGG to Crawford or Spence?...
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Old 10-17-2017, 10:52 AM #13
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Recently, it appears from reading and hearing from what most individuals say / write, that 'boxing skills' are only referred to as defensive skills whilst offensive skills (skills required to KO opponents or inflict destructive damage upon the opponent) is relegated to 'brawling' or 'luck', to the point where it's not given the same credit as defensive skills.

So I ask theses very simple questions:

1) Doesn't the ability to win boxing bouts
consistently via knockout / stoppage / inflicting destructive damage upon the opponents require 'boxing skills', as much as it requires 'boxing skills' to evade punches or not get hit by punches from the opponent?

2) Is punching power alone enough to win bouts consistently in that manner?

The so called 'power punchers' who are knockout artists, a lot of the time aren't even specially power punchers. Their natural physical strength / power isn't any better than many of the other boxers who aren't knockout artists. However, they are able to win more of their bouts by KO because they have superior offensive skills. Such as:

1) Better power punching technique / mechanics.

2) Better power punching accuracy.

3) Better power punching timing.

4) Better ability to set up knockout punches.

5) Better ability to apply pressure and cut the ring off.


So the question is, does someone like Golovkin (a knockout artist) really have more punching power than someone like Andre Ward, or is it his offensive skills that are simply superior?
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Old 10-17-2017, 11:11 AM #14
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Its a bit of both but at the end of the day if you arent landing your punches, and arent landing them accurately, you arent knocking anyone out.

What you often find as a 'puncher' moves through the levels is that he is no longer able to land the shots that got him that rep in the first place. The really great punchers have the iq to land KO shots on elite fighters.

When GG was fighting Canelo he was not able to wind up the power shots he wanted to because of Canelos anticipation, his counters and his headmovement. He didnt look like a massive puncher in that fight.

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Old 10-17-2017, 11:57 AM #15
Floyd's Mask Floyd's Mask is offline
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Its a bit of both but at the end of the day if you arent landing your punches, and arent landing them accurately, you arent knocking anyone out.

What you often find as a 'puncher' moves through the levels is that he is no longer able to land the shots that got him that rep in the first place. The really great punchers have the iq to land KO shots on elite fighters.

When GG was fighting Canelo he was not able to wind up the power shots he wanted to because of Canelos anticipation, his counters and his headmovement. He didnt look like a massive puncher in that fight.
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Old 10-17-2017, 06:32 PM #16
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1. It doesn't require special skills knock someone out, stop someone, or inflict a lot of damage but it helps. It also doesn't require special skill to evade punches. It does require special skills to be able to inflict a lot of damage while taking little damage or be able to focus when you're taking return fire. It also takes special skills to evade punches and still be in position to mount an offense.

2. No. If the right punch land most boxers will go down. You have to have all the other attributes you listed to be consistent. Golovkin is better at stopping his opponents because he is more focused on getting a stoppage. You've seen in his last 2 fights when the focus isn't there (for whatever reason), the KOs doesn't come easy. You also saw when Ward was focused on stopping Kovalev, he actually did. Of course you need skills to be able to carry it out.
Brilliant post! I agree with this.
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Old 10-17-2017, 06:33 PM #17
Ganstaz003 Ganstaz003 is online now
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I wouldn't compare Golovkin to Ward -- because the huge difference in "styles"...

... But what about comparing GGG to Crawford or Spence?...
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Or rather, 'a lack of style'? There exists styles and there exists lack of styles.

'Stylistically', a boxer has many ways to inflict damage upon the opponent or produce knockout victories. The inability to do those things is an indication of a lack of style, rather than a different form of style.

As for comparing GGG to Crawford or Spence, I could also compare GGG to Wladimir Klitschko, Guillermo Rigondeaux and etc. The point I was trying to make was that someone who isn't a knockout artist (Andre Ward) isn't NECESSARILY a less powerful puncher than a knockout artist (Gennady Golovkin). Instead, the reason could simply be that despite both having the same amount of punching power, Golovkin has the better offensive skills. Therefore, he is able to consistently produce knockouts unlike Andre Ward. For this comparison, Errol Spence Jr and Terence Crawford aren't suitable since they actually are knockout artists themselves (to a slightly lesser extent). I needed to compare a knockout artist to a non-knockout artist.
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Old 10-17-2017, 06:35 PM #18
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What do you mean?
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Old 10-17-2017, 06:39 PM #19
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basically, the TS is a huge fan of Deontay Wilder!

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No, but I am a huge of the greatest boxer in history and arguably the greatest athlete in history named Wladimir Klitschko, who has :

1) the highest knockout percentage in the heavyweight division's history in world championship fights.

2) the highest knockout quantity against previously unbeaten / never knocked out opponents.

3) The highest quantity of wins + knockouts against most styles of opponents (southpaws, counter punchers, pressure fighters and etc.).

4) Average knockout victims, heavier than any other past heavyweight in history.

5) More OVERALL wins + knockouts than any other past heavyweight in history.

6) Lost fewer rounds than any other past heavyweight in history (excluding his brother Vitali Klitschko).

7) Has arguably, the best win / loss ratio in his career record, out of the number of fights he has had.

8) Excluding Mike Tyson, knocked out / defeated more heavier than self opponents than any other past heavyweight.


This is because quality of opposition also matters (measured by the official ranking of the opponent).
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Old 10-17-2017, 06:43 PM #20
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Its a bit of both but at the end of the day if you arent landing your punches, and arent landing them accurately, you arent knocking anyone out.

What you often find as a 'puncher' moves through the levels is that he is no longer able to land the shots that got him that rep in the first place. The really great punchers have the iq to land KO shots on elite fighters.

When GG was fighting Canelo he was not able to wind up the power shots he wanted to because of Canelos anticipation, his counters and his headmovement. He didnt look like a massive puncher in that fight.

So would you say that Wladimir Klitschko is one of, if not the greatest punchers in history. His KO percentage against top 10 ranked opposition, previously unbeaten opposition, previously never knocked out opposition and etc is higher overall than any past modern heavyweight (boxers competing against opponents weighing 200 pounds whilst weighing 200 pounds themselves)?

In fact, Wladimir Klitschko's KO record may just be the greatest out of any boxer in history of any weight division.
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