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Old 07-07-2014, 05:54 PM #11
Elroy1 Elroy1 is offline
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I didn't insult you, you just insulted me.

But Jones is an ATG man, no doubt. The guy was incredible, that kind of talent is not "normal" by any bench mark.
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Old 07-07-2014, 07:09 PM #12
Mick6 Mick6 is offline
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Originally Posted by SBleeder View Post
Toney and Hopkins are not top 20 ATGs. Jones was great, but nowhere near the GOAT.
Exactly. Not much more to add.
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Old 07-07-2014, 07:17 PM #13
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Originally Posted by Elroy1 View Post
You know this is otherwise a good post except this...

Roy Jones isn't an ATG...

You always have to take the very best boxers and run them down into the ground in favour of your favourites of eras past.

To say that Roy Jones is not an ATG but admit other guys who could barely even box makes you a fool!

To be fair, Ray did say in his opinion Jones was a top 20 light heavyweight. Of all the boxers in history that's pretty damn good. I guess it depends what ATG means.
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Old 07-10-2014, 11:46 PM #14
Sugar Adam Ali Sugar Adam Ali is offline
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Not #1 because his resume of title defenses throughout his career is pathetic..

He always looked like the goat, but only had one true goat win vs toney
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Old 07-10-2014, 11:52 PM #15
Sugar Adam Ali Sugar Adam Ali is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LacedUp View Post
Wouldn't say Hopkins and Toney are top 20 ATGs.

But let's look at things. From MW-HW.
Jones' prime ended with Ruiz, right? We can agree to that.

Was he one of the best fighters we had ever seen? Yes, I think he was. There aren't many people in history I would pick to beat a prime Roy Jones jr.

Would you?

So yes, I would say he's definitely up there in terms of P4P. But obviously not the greatest.

From 88-Ruiz fight,, what are his best wins,, it's basically toney.. Hopkins was considered an espn caliber of fighter, and didn't look good till a decade later..

Literally, go look at his mw defenses and post the best ones
Go look at his super middle defenses and post the best ones
Go to light heavy and post the best defenses..

Literally Eric Harding is the best guy he ever defended against..

A lot of smoke and mirrors in Roy's career.

Had he made fights with benn, McClellan, Eubanks, liles, nunn, michlewski, Collins, we would have had a much more accurate view of Roy had he landed 2 or 3 of those fights
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Old 07-10-2014, 11:54 PM #16
Mike Haynes Mike Haynes is offline
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I pick a prime Roy Jones over every fighter in the history of boxing.
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Old 07-11-2014, 06:38 PM #17
Humean Humean is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sugar Adam Ali View Post
From 88-Ruiz fight,, what are his best wins,, it's basically toney.. Hopkins was considered an espn caliber of fighter, and didn't look good till a decade later..

Literally, go look at his mw defenses and post the best ones
Go look at his super middle defenses and post the best ones
Go to light heavy and post the best defenses..

Literally Eric Harding is the best guy he ever defended against..

A lot of smoke and mirrors in Roy's career.

Had he made fights with benn, McClellan, Eubanks, liles, nunn, michlewski, Collins, we would have had a much more accurate view of Roy had he landed 2 or 3 of those fights
There is no doubt that Jones did not fight and defeat as many quality opponents as he could of and should of but how much doubt do you have that he would have defeated any and all those fighters you listed? I know you can't claim hypothetical achievement for Jones but I think his career did suggest enough to think he was the superior to all of them and would have defeated them if he had fought them. The sad part is that I think Jones could have established himself, as close as any modern fighter could, with the greatest in history. Unfortunately he wasted a good part of his career in the glory of his position as the best rather than in continuously proving it.
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Old 07-12-2014, 01:21 PM #18
Sugar Adam Ali Sugar Adam Ali is offline
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Originally Posted by Humean View Post
There is no doubt that Jones did not fight and defeat as many quality opponents as he could of and should of but how much doubt do you have that he would have defeated any and all those fighters you listed? I know you can't claim hypothetical achievement for Jones but I think his career did suggest enough to think he was the superior to all of them and would have defeated them if he had fought them. The sad part is that I think Jones could have established himself, as close as any modern fighter could, with the greatest in history. Unfortunately he wasted a good part of his career in the glory of his position as the best rather than in continuously proving it.
Jones would probably beat all the guys i mentioned, but its not a given. One punch could change everything especially vs a guy like Mcclellan who i thought had the best chance of beating roy..

Look at guys like manny in the lower weights and oscar, or tommy hearns, if you consistently fight top level guys, no matter how good you are, your going to have an off night...

Roy was a great fighter, but not the GOAT
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