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Old 11-21-2019, 02:31 PM #491
DreamerUSA DreamerUSA is offline
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I think the party knows what it is, there are just a lot of groups and subgroups where the Republican party is much more ****geneous which makes the messaging much easier. I think free college, ways to clear up debt, and expanding healthcare to all are strong policy initiatives that can work.

I think the hate is amped up because many people have grown tired of Trump and how he embarrasses the country. Just look at what happened in Louisiana last weekend. The Republican candidate just attached himself to Trump. that is the main reason he lost. Of course that isn't going to win a national election.

As for the debate, once a Democratic candidate is named, I am not so sure. Depending who the candidate is will determine a lot.

The key IMO to Trump winning is voter turnout among minority women. This is what has determined a number of races in the South in the heart of Trump country. If Trump can tone his behavior down in such a way that doesn't "piss off the natives" I agree he should win.
That is the problem though, Dunn. The Fed just came out again last week about how our debt is unsustainable and yet somehow paying for college, national healthcare and erasing debt, is somehow doable. We are talking about trillions and trillions of dollars. They writing checks we can't cash.
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Old 11-21-2019, 02:37 PM #492
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yes it was. Rispone spent a sh-tload of money but had no message other than I am with Trump. He ran a campaign similar to DeSantis in Florida because that campaign was successful. Trump is +13 in Louisiana yet Rispone lost by 2.6. That is almost a 16 point difference.

I do agree he is a centrist Democrat and his pro life position is essential in Louisiana. I also think he was smart to stay away from impeachment talk, which a national Dem candidate for President will not be able to do.

The Louisiana vote, much moreso than Kentucky, was a referendum on Trump. You would be dishonest to suggest otherwise. Doesn't mean Trump will lose.
Attaching himself to Trump was the only thing making his race with Edwards competitive. People forget that Edwards demolished the Republican Vitter in 2015. Rispones campaign used up an enormous amount of cash to defeat Abraham, and afterwards he was running on fumes against Edwards. He only managed to secure the top spot a few months ago, which left him almost no time to campaign against Edwwards.


If you think this is a referendum on Trump, you're going to be in a world of surprise when he exceeds his 2016 numbers in Louisiana come 2020.
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Old 11-21-2019, 02:37 PM #493
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That is the problem though, Dunn. The Fed just came out again last week about how our debt is unsustainable and yet somehow paying for college, national healthcare and erasing debt, is somehow doable. We are talking about trillions and trillions of dollars. They writing checks we can't cash.
I think that is where eliminating corporate tax breaks and tuition free college is a huge winner. I would tie the removing the tax breaks with infrastructure as well.

I agree with you about healthcare and debt, I don't think people pay enough attention to those issues. I also don't know how Dems can craft a message on those topics because most people are worried about household income and spending than national spending and debt.

Social security and climate change are expensive as hell as well..
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Old 11-21-2019, 02:46 PM #494
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Originally Posted by JimRaynor View Post
Attaching himself to Trump was the only thing making his race with Edwards competitive. People forget that Edwards demolished the Republican Vitter in 2015. Rispones campaign used up an enormous amount of cash to defeat Abraham, and afterwards he was running on fumes against Edwards. He only managed to secure the top spot a few months ago, which left him almost no time to campaign against Edwwards.


If you think this is a referendum on Trump, you're going to be in a world of surprise when he exceeds his 2016 numbers in Louisiana come 2020.
What you are saying (without saying it) is Trump resonates with Republicans but not outside the party. You can run the way Rispone did in the primaries but that no longer works in a wider election.

Yes, DeSantis won, but Kentucky (gov), Alabama (Sen) and the Virginia senate and house flips illustrate Republicans just attaching themselves to Trump need more of a message.

I am not suggesting Trump will lose Louisiana. I am just pointing out that Trump won Louisiana by 20 pts in 2016. Its 2019 and he came down and stumped HEAVY for a big spender who attached himself to Trump and he lost by 2.6 pts.

That is significant even if you will not admit it.

Last edited by The Big Dunn; 11-21-2019 at 02:48 PM.
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Old 11-22-2019, 12:43 PM #495
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What you are saying (without saying it) is Trump resonates with Republicans but not outside the party. You can run the way Rispone did in the primaries but that no longer works in a wider election.

Yes, DeSantis won, but Kentucky (gov), Alabama (Sen) and the Virginia senate and house flips illustrate Republicans just attaching themselves to Trump need more of a message.
You're overlooking the primary reasons why these people lost in attempt to draw a connection with Trump.

Kentucky governor lost because he literally was one of the least liked governors in the whole country. His approval to disapproval was something like 32-56. Even then he lost by only 5k votes, and lost to an extremely moderate democrat.

Alabama Senators race, Doug Jones won because Roy Moore had an innumerable amount of sexual harassment accusations, if Jeff Sessions runs again, if any Republican with a half way decent history runs again Doug Jones is toast and everyone knows this.

As for Virginia, that state has been turning blue from the migration of D.C. and Northern States since 2008, what happened there is absolutely no surprise, just like Ohio and Iowa have now slowly turned fully red.


Quote:
I am not suggesting Trump will lose Louisiana. I am just pointing out that Trump won Louisiana by 20 pts in 2016. Its 2019 and he came down and stumped HEAVY for a big spender who attached himself to Trump and he lost by 2.6 pts.

That is significant even if you will not admit it.

Right which goes to show you, that people think beyond just Trump giving a certain candidate support, they evaluate those candidates on their own merits.
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Old 11-22-2019, 01:05 PM #496
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You're overlooking the primary reasons why these people lost in attempt to draw a connection with Trump.

Kentucky governor lost because he literally was one of the least liked governors in the whole country. His approval to disapproval was something like 32-56. Even then he lost by only 5k votes, and lost to an extremely moderate democrat.

Alabama Senators race, Doug Jones won because Roy Moore had an innumerable amount of sexual harassment accusations, if Jeff Sessions runs again, if any Republican with a half way decent history runs again Doug Jones is toast and everyone knows this.

As for Virginia, that state has been turning blue from the migration of D.C. and Northern States since 2008, what happened there is absolutely no surprise, just like Ohio and Iowa have now slowly turned fully red.





Right which goes to show you, that people think beyond just Trump giving a certain candidate support, they evaluate those candidates on their own merits.
I agree with you about Kentucky and honestly didn't think it was really about Trump (i even posted that in the Trump thread when I commented about Louisiana.)

I would agree Jones is vulnerable. That said, Moore was endorsed and backed by Trump but lost.

The same gameplan DeSantis and others used to win just last year, Rispone used the same gameplan and lost. I think it shows to a degree Trump's coattails are not what they used to be. Again, I am not suggesting this means he will lose.
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Old 11-22-2019, 01:12 PM #497
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I agree with you about Kentucky and honestly didn't think it was really about Trump (i even posted that in the Trump thread when I commented about Louisiana.)

I would agree Jones is vulnerable. That said, Moore was endorsed and backed by Trump but lost.

The same gameplan DeSantis and others used to win just last year, Rispone used the same gameplan and lost. I think it shows to a degree Trump's coattails are not what they used to be. Again, I am not suggesting this means he will lose.
I agree with you, Trump can help push you over the edge if you are somewhat likeable and running a neck and neck race, like he did DeSantis, but you're not going to win a race by simply just attaching yourself to him, because there is only one Trump, no one else can be him, therefore show us what else you got.
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Old 12-17-2019, 08:32 PM #498
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Tonight is gonna be lit! Actually, it isnít...Tulsi isnít participating
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Old 12-17-2019, 08:39 PM #499
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Tonight is gonna be lit! Actually, it isnít...Tulsi isnít participating
Is Buttigieg the only semi-rational one left at this point?
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Old 12-17-2019, 08:40 PM #500
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Tonight is gonna be lit! Actually, it isnít...Tulsi isnít participating

Tonight??????
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