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Old 05-14-2019, 12:08 PM #81
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Originally Posted by BattlingNelson View Post
I did notice that Shapiro said he he had changed his mind regarding some tweets from 5-10 years ago, but he was challenged on his book as well and I didnít notice that he retreated from that? Correct me if Iím wrong and maybe you can also tell me how old the book is?

I will say, however, that if Shapiro in fact did say he couldnít stand behind his previous opinions, then itís all good. Everybody is entitled to get wiser. BUT that makes his no mas even worse! If he had changed his mind and told the interviewer that, then the interviewer would have to change subject, so why the hell did he quit?
Not certain but I figured the point Neill was making as the quit happened was about the tone of what Shapiro says. That he has made these controversial comments about Jews, then about Arabs, called Obama a fascist etc. but then he brings out a book talking about how political discussion needs to be more civilised.

It's not about being right/wrong with any particular comment but about being inflamatory to get attention, then once you get the attention acting like everyone else needs to tone it down.
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Old 05-14-2019, 12:21 PM #82
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Originally Posted by Clegg View Post
Not certain but I figured the point Neill was making as the quit happened was about the tone of what Shapiro says. That he has made these controversial comments about Jews, then about Arabs, called Obama a fascist etc. but then he brings out a book talking about how political discussion needs to be more civilised.

It's not about being right/wrong with any particular comment but about being inflamatory to get attention, then once you get the attention acting like everyone else needs to tone it down.
Exactly, and Neil didn't clarify that was what he was trying to say, and then proceeded to use inflammatory verbiage himself "Dark Ages". So he's also part of the problem.

But it doesn't change the fact that Shapiro QUIT!...when confronted with his own data.
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Old 05-14-2019, 12:31 PM #83
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People are giving him credit for 'taking the L' but his comments say he wasn't prepared which is just a crybaby excuse. What prep do you even need to explain why you have spent years using OTT and crude language yet now want to complain about other people lowering the bar? He's wasn't even asked that many tough Q's as Neill was still warming up, Shapiro barely lasted longer than Curtis Harper.
Before any televised situation, there's a prep that should have happened with his people.

The prep is designed to inform you about who you're speaking to and what the topical matter is going to be. It also gives you a sense of tone of the conversation. Think of it like fighters that watch tape of their upcoming opponent and then form a strategy with their trainers and partners (so yes, to certain people, this is VERY much like boxing).

If you don't prep, what happens is you start getting set off by things that you weren't ready to answer or for which you had an answer but didn't know how to express it.

I actually analyzed Shapiro's responses and the vast majority were fine, but then he got triggered by the "Dark Ages" so much that it offset the good he did. He kept going back to this idea that Neil is a leftist which is a joke, and he was reacting badly to Neil's strawman arguments.

Neil was trying to connect the dots. He was trying to imply that Shapiro in the past has done and/or supported dialogue that is the same type of divisive speech you hear from other Republicans and President Trump. He's not wrong there; where he's wrong is that everyone does it - including over in the UK. That's where Shapiro got defensive and it came back to bite him.

Quitting was the biggest no-no. Some of Neil's stuff was just asking questions and Shapiro just had to answer and then back it up with factual data.

It felt to me like Shapiro didn't understand how culturally different it is overseas and why he came across so bad. Him quitting hurt his perception more than had he just responded to his words calmly and with facts.

Note: I'm an American who has befriended and dated folks from across the entire UK, so I've been exposed to the differences in culture on many different fronts. It's COMPLETELY different. Tolerance is way different and I learned that quickly.
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Old 05-14-2019, 12:49 PM #84
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He crapped a tray of kugel and quit
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Old 05-14-2019, 01:44 PM #85
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Originally Posted by revelated View Post
What the hell does Calzaghe/Lacy have to do with Ben Shapiro?
The thread was getting bizarrely nationalistic, with defensive Fat Yanks, so I thought of the most one-sided UK vs US bout in recent memory.
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Old 05-14-2019, 02:20 PM #86
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I see a lot of people saying that Neil wasn't giving him stuff to debate, or engaging in a debate properly. It was just an interview, basic questions, not a "debate".

I've watched a couple of this guy's prior bouts, and **** me, anyone can talk fast like a gaylord - Paulie Malignaggi's made a career out of it - but seriously, THIS GUY was being touted as the P4P No.1 in Fat Yankistan?

No wonder the lounge is so full of great "debates" if that's the standard.
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Old 05-14-2019, 02:27 PM #87
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Good breakdown:

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Old 05-14-2019, 02:50 PM #88
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He always gets flustered and lost for words when going up against a person with some intelligence and ability to rationalize. He always looks "smart" when it's some half-educated college student or some person who sits on the couch all day and eats up what they hear on the news or headlines they've read on facebook posts.

He looked just like this against Piers Morgan and Piers isn't some all inspiring intellect of the Rick and Morty kind. He's just a person who can think out what they want to say and doesnt get overwhelmed by Shapiro's quick and slick talk.

Maybe it's just a British thing that Shapiro just can't quite cope with.
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Old 05-14-2019, 04:58 PM #89
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Good breakdown:

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Here's another hilarious breakdown of the untouchable Shapiro
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Old 05-14-2019, 08:13 PM #90
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Originally Posted by !! Anorak View Post
The thread was getting bizarrely nationalistic, with defensive Fat Yanks, so I thought of the most one-sided UK vs US bout in recent memory.
It's the quit that really matters, but if you're going for one-sided schooling, Wilder/Fury seems more apropos.
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