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Old 03-22-2012, 11:33 PM #1
klipsch speaker klipsch speaker is offline
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Default Do you believe that Press People...

Covering Fights (Radio, Papers)
During the time of the Old School Fighters
Were just EXAGGERATING things for the listeners and readers so that the pictures that form inside their heads become more palatable?

And from this exaggerations, the thought of old school fighters (Out of this world defense, Super Punches, Extraordinary footwork) become so ingrained to the consciousness of the younger generations of historians who take these things at face value?

In turn, overrating the accomplishments of the fighters from the olden times and underrating the current ones?

I dont have any agenda on this. I just want to know up to what extent historians take this blow by blow accounts from reporters of yesteryear who are very much prone to exaggerations.
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Old 03-23-2012, 03:30 AM #2
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Originally Posted by klipsch speaker View Post
Covering Fights (Radio, Papers)
During the time of the Old School Fighters
Were just EXAGGERATING things for the listeners and readers so that the pictures that form inside their heads become more palatable?

And from this exaggerations, the thought of old school fighters (Out of this world defense, Super Punches, Extraordinary footwork) become so ingrained to the consciousness of the younger generations of historians who take these things at face value?

In turn, overrating the accomplishments of the fighters from the olden times and underrating the current ones?

I dont have any agenda on this. I just want to know up to what extent historians take this blow by blow accounts from reporters of yesteryear who are very much prone to exaggerations.


No. Most fighters there are video of to corroborate reports. The thing about that though is one has to keep an open mind when watching old film. It is much more difficult to pick up the subtleties on old film that was run at a different speed, in black and white and usually from a distance with only one angle. Its easy to not see punches that landed but look like they may not have, parrying and blocking punches and how fast a fighter really was. Past greats are lauded not only for their skills, but because boxing was simply tougher with harder roads to travel than today. There are many great fighters today, but they have a cushy ride having to fight far less often and under much less stressful circumstances. Can you picture ANY fighter today fighting against a 27-0 fighter and than traveling 300 miles by train to take on one of the greatest p4p fighter ever the next day like Joe Gans did? Or the heavyweight champion fighting 6 time in 6 months, 3 of those time against top 10 rated fighters? Joe Louis did that against what is refereed to as the "bum of the month club".
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Old 03-23-2012, 04:53 AM #3
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I think it's silly to rate fighters H2H via ringside reports. Judge resume all you want but, don't try and predict match-ups.
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Old 03-24-2012, 07:22 AM #4
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but in fairness rating fighters on reports of how badass they/their opponents were is alot of what we do here! I mean how do we know how good fitzsimmons was? or how he would do against larry Holmes or something? In answer to the original question there I remember listening to eubank v collins on the radio when I was a kid it sounded like Apollo Creed v Rocky Balbao III! When I watched a few months later it well it was still a good fight and all but well ... u know I was kinda like
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Old 03-24-2012, 09:02 AM #5
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but in fairness rating fighters on reports of how badass they/their opponents were is alot of what we do here! I mean how do we know how good fitzsimmons was? or how he would do against larry Holmes or something? In answer to the original question there I remember listening to eubank v collins on the radio when I was a kid it sounded like Apollo Creed v Rocky Balbao III! When I watched a few months later it well it was still a good fight and all but well ... u know I was kinda like
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H2H we don't sadly.
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Old 03-24-2012, 10:16 AM #6
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Just look at this excerpt from the website of a noted boxing historian Monte Cox on Bob Fitzsimmons:

Early ring historian Sandy Griswold said in the Dec 24, 1904 National Police Gazette, “He knows all the vulnerable spots of the human anatomy as well as the most erudite surgeon in the business and has a greater variety of effective blows than any fighter who ever lived.”

if thats not some exaggeration, I really dont know what it is.

Sometimes it makes me wonder up to what point some modern historians take this as "truth". And once they take it as that, the inevitable overrating of the old fighters and underrating the current ones results from it.
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Old 03-24-2012, 11:54 AM #7
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Originally Posted by klipsch speaker View Post
Just look at this excerpt from the website of a noted boxing historian Monte Cox on Bob Fitzsimmons:

Early ring historian Sandy Griswold said in the Dec 24, 1904 National Police Gazette, “He knows all the vulnerable spots of the human anatomy as well as the most erudite surgeon in the business and has a greater variety of effective blows than any fighter who ever lived.”

if thats not some exaggeration, I really dont know what it is.

Sometimes it makes me wonder up to what point some modern historians take this as "truth". And once they take it as that, the inevitable overrating of the old fighters and underrating the current ones results from it.
Yeah, it's an exaggeration. He has an excellent resume though.
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Old 03-24-2012, 03:57 PM #8
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Originally Posted by klipsch speaker View Post
Just look at this excerpt from the website of a noted boxing historian Monte Cox on Bob Fitzsimmons:

Early ring historian Sandy Griswold said in the Dec 24, 1904 National Police Gazette, “He knows all the vulnerable spots of the human anatomy as well as the most erudite surgeon in the business and has a greater variety of effective blows than any fighter who ever lived.”

if thats not some exaggeration, I really dont know what it is.

Sometimes it makes me wonder up to what point some modern historians take this as "truth". And once they take it as that, the inevitable overrating of the old fighters and underrating the current ones results from it.
Than again Fitzsimmons was one of the first fighters to use a focused body attack targeting the liver, heart and solar plexus. Today it would sound like an exaggeration because its common. Back than it would have seemed innovative and fresh therefore not really making it that much of an exaggeration.
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Old 03-24-2012, 06:17 PM #9
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Originally Posted by JAB5239 View Post
Than again Fitzsimmons was one of the first fighters to use a focused body attack targeting the liver, heart and solar plexus. Today it would sound like an exaggeration because its common. Back than it would have seemed innovative and fresh therefore not really making it that much of an exaggeration.
Woops misread, I thought Cox was saying that. Yeah Ol' Fitz would have been amazing for his day, however the proof is in the pudding when you try and decipher exactly what's happening in the Corbett film. What he's doing would simply not be effective today.
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