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Old 02-11-2020, 08:20 PM #31
GhostofDempsey GhostofDempsey is offline
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He holds an edge in resume, but in a head to head fight I would favor Holyfield for the win.
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Old 02-11-2020, 08:27 PM #32
D4thincarnation D4thincarnation is offline
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Originally Posted by PRINCEKOOL View Post
I am sure David Haye would of relished the idea 'Of signing up to a tournament which guaranteed him a shot at all the title contenders' How David Haye unified the division for me was more impressive and emphatic.

Also how David Haye went about his heavyweight invasion was more impressive 'There is zero conviction or inspiration in Usyk's actions'
But he didn't, it not about what you want or relish it is about what you do that makes you great.

Haye fought Monte Barrett, pulled out of fights with Vitali and fought Valuev.

Uysk had his warm up fight, going to get Chisora and then he wants AJ
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Old 02-11-2020, 08:40 PM #33
PRINCEKOOL PRINCEKOOL is offline
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Originally Posted by D4thincarnation View Post
But he didn't, it not about what you want or relish it is about what you do that makes you great.

Haye fought Monte Barrett, pulled out of fights with Vitali and fought Valuev.

Uysk had his warm up fight, going to get Chisora and then he wants AJ
Monte Barrett was pretty much a solid gate keeper, same kind of level as Derek Chisora 'Who by the looks of it? Has made Usyk's a*s completely go.

David Haye during his first fight at heavyweight, destroyed Monte Barrett knocking him down 4-5 times violently. What did Usyk do during his first fight at heavyweight? Usyk and his team did not even pick a fighter who had a proper training camp 'Even with all of these variables in their side, he failed to look impressive'.

Nobody in the heavyweight division is afraid of Usyk.

Nobody batted a eye lid, when he was threatening to come into the division and take Anthony Joshua's or Deontay Wilder's titles 'Nobody but Tony Bellew & certain sections of he boxing media that are suffering from cognitive dissonance'

The writing is already on the wall, Oleksandr Oleksandrovych Usyk is overrated 'The man is a solid fighter but has no great attributes'.

Note: I am aware that David Haye had fought Thomas Bonin sp* at heavyweight just before facing Enzo Maccarinelli, and if I recall correctly? Blasted him out within 1 round.
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Old 02-11-2020, 08:51 PM #34
D4thincarnation D4thincarnation is offline
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Originally Posted by PRINCEKOOL View Post
Monte Barrett was pretty much a solid gate keeper, same kind of level as Derek Chisora 'Who by the looks of it? Has made Usyk's a*s completely go.

David Haye during his first fight at heavyweight, destroyed Monte Barrett knocking him down 4-5 times violently. What did Usyk do during his first fight at heavyweight? Usyk and his team did not even pick a fighter who had a proper training camp 'Even with all of these variables in their side, he failed to look impressive'.

Nobody in the heavyweight division is afraid of Usyk.

Nobody batted a eye lid, when he was threatening to come into the division and take Anthony Joshua's or Deontay Wilder's titles 'Nobody but Tony Bellew & certain sections of he boxing media that are suffering from cognitive dissonance'

The writing is already on the wall, Oleksandr Oleksandrovych Usyk is overrated 'The man is a solid fighter but has no great attributes'.

Note: I am aware that David Haye had fought Thomas Bonin sp* at heavyweight just before facing Enzo Maccarinelli, and if I recall correctly? Blasted him out within 1 round.

So when Usyk gets injured his scared and when Haye gets injured and pulls out of fights you ignore those points.

Right.....

Why do you think AJ is chose Pulev over Usyk?


BTW this this thread is about Holyfield and Usyk at cruiser.
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Old 02-11-2020, 09:52 PM #35
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Originally Posted by ShaneMosleySr View Post
Sorry.

Qawi is better than Usyk.

De Leon is probably better than anyone Usyk fought.
This is true

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Originally Posted by Inspired View Post
holyfield was a steroid user, fact.
This is also true.
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Old 02-11-2020, 10:12 PM #36
Thraxox Thraxox is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PRINCEKOOL View Post
I am sure David Haye would of relished the idea 'Of signing up to a tournament which guaranteed him a shot at all the title contenders' How David Haye unified the division for me was more impressive and emphatic.

Also how David Haye went about his heavyweight invasion was more impressive 'There is zero conviction or inspiration in Usyk's actions'
Wishful thinking. You are wishing that those things happened to Haye where he fought them on their own backyard and rest the belts away but he didn't, and also he wasn't the undisputed Cruiserweight.

Haye has a more impressive run in Cruiserweight? Did you remember that he got knocked out by a 40 year old undersized Cruiserweight, he thought Thompson was ripe for the taking and got KTFO?
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Last edited by Thraxox; 02-11-2020 at 10:16 PM.
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Old 02-11-2020, 10:17 PM #37
Thraxox Thraxox is online now
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Originally Posted by therealpugilist View Post
you obviously never watched him fight.....height doesnt make you a good fighter or bad one


he was a former light heavyweight champion, beat the breaks of hall of famer Matthew Saad Muhammad, went 12 tough rounds with another hall of famer in Michael Spinks, and fought as high as heavyweight, even went rounds with Foreman so him getting destroyed by those guys is highly unlikely given he has been in there with more talented fighters than those guys
Nope, but height gives you a massive size advantage. Qawi had a great LHW but his cruiserweight run is not anything special.
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Old 02-11-2020, 10:19 PM #38
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Usyk has a better overall resume at CW with 17 wins vs Holys 7. Qawi was a ball buster but I don't see him beating every Usyk opponents in "bloodbaths".

Head to Head, in a 15 rounder, Holyfield beats Usyk at 190 and that weight is before Evander started pumping chemicals into his body. After the drugs he wins even easier.
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Old 02-11-2020, 11:55 PM #39
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I think resume wise usyk has done a bit more . But he hasnt beaten one hall of Famer at this point . Head to head I would pick holyfield. Holyfield didnt really have any misses at cruiser ( maybe Johnny nelson ?? ) . I mean both guys beat a few guys who held titles but not many great fighters on either resume besides quawi. I guess some of the guys usyk beat could still go on to achieve something but I dont really see any of them turning out to be great fighters . Holy moved very fast and moved up to heavy to have a historic run but usyk has the chance to achieve that in a much weaker era . But this post isnt about heavyweight . I'd say altho it's close. I cant argue someone picking usyks resume over holys at cruiser , but head to head I would pick holy 9 out of 10 times. Kudos to both men for moving up when there wasnt any legacy fights at cruiser . But if u wanna go quantity over quality holy has quawi which is the only hof fighter on either resume . I dunno Carlos de leon was prolly a better win than anyone on usyks record too , I guess u could compare gassiev with de leon tho . Its really much closer than most would think just reading the post . Holy has gone down as an all time great heavy and some say the best of all time at cruiser . But the division wasnt too deep , yet when usyk fought there it was red hot , just without the great fight usyk needed legacy wise . He has very solid wins ( more so than evander ) but he also never beat one great fighter at the weight . Altho I cant really call him out for that , he fought everyone he could have at cruiser and all of them in their back yard . Cruiserweight is a historically weak division ( and young) talent wise . There really isnt a golden era . Which is a shame becuase the division is criminally underrated and over shadowed by the heavyweight division. Going off memory holy takes it but when I dig in I can't argue with the post. But iam not sure I can fully agree ( may be my bias of watching holy growing up and the fact that usyk didnt beat any future hof fighters ) but he did beat henry Tillman who was a gold medalist at heavyweight ( which would be cruiser as a pro , he also beat willy DeWitt and tyson twice) but it's a bit of a reach as tillman had a disappointing pro career. Good post . This is a hard debate . But I cant disagree .
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Old 02-12-2020, 08:17 AM #40
PRINCEKOOL PRINCEKOOL is offline
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Originally Posted by Thraxox View Post
Wishful thinking. You are wishing that those things happened to Haye where he fought them on their own backyard and rest the belts away but he didn't, and also he wasn't the undisputed Cruiserweight.

Haye has a more impressive run in Cruiserweight? Did you remember that he got knocked out by a 40 year old undersized Cruiserweight, he thought Thompson was ripe for the taking and got KTFO?
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David Haye was the WBC, WBA, WBO, Ring Magazine Champion, and would of been the IBF Champion if Mormeck did not get stripped 'He was the undisputed Crusier-weight champion, he even used to refer to himself with that status etc

David Haye was a more impressive fighter at cruiser-weight, NOBODY remembers any of Usyk's fights 'Because he does nothing special in them, due to him being just a solid fighter with zero great attributes'. David Haye knocked John Mormeck out in France to capture the WBC, WBO & Ringmazine titles, with no real backing of the British media 'Hardly any support out their for him etc'

Carl Thompson was the impetus for David Haye's rise no shame in losing to that man 'A fighter with immense durability and power' I would honestly back him to also beat Usyk.

Usyk is a overrated fighter, he has already been displaying this of late 'He is not winning any world title's at heavyweight or beating any of the top guys'.

There is a weird obsession that people within the boxing community have with fighters from the former soviet countries, they are so easily anointed with the status of being Great technical fighters. Usyk is a simple well schooled solid fighter with no real great attributes, that is exactly why he is trying to steal a vacant title at Heavyweight 'He is no David Haye or Evander Holyfield'

I am being 100% serious when I state this? Give David Price a 12 week training camp, and I would back David Price to beat Oleksandr Oleksandrovych Usyk 'I would at-least give David Price a chance' I do not rate this man at heavyweight at all.

Last edited by PRINCEKOOL; 02-12-2020 at 08:23 AM.
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